Random Question on Flexibility of the Liturgy

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So I was recently listening to a podcast where the priest said he does two things that I have never seen or heard before and I was curious if it’s ok or goes against the rubric for the mass.

The first is that he does not limit the number of altar boys that minister mass. He said they may have 20+ for a mass. They don’t have a schedule bc they never had issues having enough show up. His reasoning is legit in trying to get they young men/boys to pay attention and be interested in the mass…obviously hoping it creates more priests.

The second thing was that they don’t have traditional candles. They use some type of propane flame that can change color for the seasons. And they have a bunch of them. His reasoning was that he and the others were tired of dealing with the wax,etc…so they developed their own torches to use.

Thoughts? I don’t think they are necessarily bad BUT i’m also of the opinion that a priest shouldn’t have a lot of freedom in making changes to the mass. How much freedom is a priest allowed?
 
A lot of churches don’t have traditional candles. One of the churches I attend has two fake “candles” that actually have an opening in the top to put a little fuel refill (I’m not sure what the fuel is but it’s not a candle) in when it runs out. A cap is then put on the top, the fuel is lit and the whole thing looks like a candle from a distance. No wax to deal with. I’m sure many churches are using these as you’d have to get right up close to them or watch the fuel-refill procedure to know you weren’t seeing an actual candle.

Edited to add, these are what they use:

http://www.almy.com/Category/LiquidChurchCandles
 
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A lot of the churches I visit have removed the votives that people light, and replaced them with battery-operated candles where you put money in and push a button. There’s a big fire hazard with letting people light votives. I know for many years there were none in my parish church that I grew up in. They were later replaced by a pastor who took over after I moved away.

I also saw an interesting way of dealing with it at a shrine I visited. No candles for people to light in the big church building, but there was an outbuilding made of concrete blocks where you could buy and light candles and put them in there. So many candles in that building, it was very hot.
 
Tis_Bearself said:
One of the churches I attend has two fake “candles” that actually have an opening in the top to put a little fuel refill (I’m not sure what the fuel is but it’s not a candle) in when it runs out.
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Presumably it’s liquid wax, and it is indeed a candle.
 
One of the churches I attend also uses the liquid oil candles that Tis_Bearself posted a link to. They have four of them around the four corners of the altar. They stand on the floor, but reach above the height of the altar. Obviously they’re not beeswax candles, so are they acceptable? I thought they were regular candles until one day I saw one being refilled. Very realistic.

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I don’t know why my brain saw “liquid oil”. Of course oil is liquid. So I take it they’re composed of wax that remains liquid at room temperature. Fascinating.
 
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s.cono said:
So I take it they’re composed of wax that remains liquid at room temperature.
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Yes. That is why they can be used.

A “disposable” candle melts wax with its flame, and draws the liquid up the wick to burn (which is why very little wick burns–only that bit at the top with no wax to give). Refillable canes draw the liquid up the wick without needing to pre-heat.

The little ones we hang outside the Holy Place (and inside, as well) go liquid to a depth of something like half an inch; only a fresh one has any solid once it gets to temperature.

hawk
 
I actually prefer the smell of burning wax candles. The liquid candles have no odor.

Some of the churches I attend still use the wax candles, usually inside a big glass jar so the wax doesn’t drip.
 
Hmm - - are these what you guys are talking about?
I don’t see how these are wax? And they burn something they call “Kerry liquid” - - is that wax? I"m not getting it…
Home : Shop : Product Category : Liquid Church Candles : Classic Altar Candles : Liquid Candles 1.25" Diameter

48d796f355565de71f6e561b45dabb33dc27328c.jpeg


Almy Liquid Candles - 1.25 Inch Diameter​

No wax…no mess…no worries! Almy Liquid Candles preserve the beauty and tradition of living light in your church. Yet they end forevermore the hazard and expense of wax candles.
  • Beautiful - liquid candles are liquid-fueled lamps made to look like traditional wax candles
  • Clean - no more messy melted wax or hazardous burning cinders to damage your appointments
  • Economical - cost 75% less than wax candles to burn
  • Made in our own Maine shop of ivory-colored nylon, brass wick holders and long lasting fiberglass wicks
  • Replacement wicks are free for customers who burn Almy’s KerryLiquid
  • Choice of top styles - plain nylon tops; Kerry-style straight sided brass tops; Almy-style tapered brass tops
  • In stock In a range of popular heights
  • Delivered with an optional free adapter to ensure perfect fit in candlestick sockets from 7/8" to 1-1/2"
  • Burn times between KerryLiquid refills: for 7" tall candle, 4.5 hrs; for 9" tall candle, 6.2 hrs; for taller candles, 6.5 hrs
  • QuikShip - sent within one business day
 
Okay, I admit I’m not an expert on wax or oil. But is this stuff wax? On this other website it says it is “liquid paraffin”, or “paraffin oil”. It looks like this:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
Here’s an ad for a competing product:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
Here’s what wikipedia says about it:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

So, are you saying that burning kerosene is the same as burning beeswax candles? I don’t understand…
 
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Paraffin is distilled petroleum product. In solid form it is waxy, similar to wax. Paraffin lamps were widely used back in the days before electric lights.

Kids also used to chew it before gum was invented.

Nowadays it is used in spa treatments, crayons, and to make candles which are cleaner burning and less smelly than wax ones.
 
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Tis_Bearself said:
Paraffin is distilled petroleum product. In solid form it is waxy, similar to wax. Paraffin lamps were widely used back in the days before electric lights.
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Yes, that would be the stuff Mom melted to top off her jars of jam before she screwed the lids on. This 1/4" to 1/3" of wax was meant to completely cover the jam sealing out air and preventing mold from growing.

In our church we have those paraffin candles by the altar, an electric Sanctuary lamp, a high beeswax content Paschal candle, and tiny votives that only last about 2 hours.

As far as altar servers go the priest can have as many of them as he can fit in the sanctuary. I know that in several parishes where I’ve been, any altar server who showed up vested and was in the sanctuary. One priest I know told me that they had over 100 servers in the Polish parish he served in the city and at any given Mass it wasn’t unusual to have 30 altar servers in cassock and alb.

In our parish we’re lucky if we have 5 volunteer to serve.
 
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My church uses liquid in the altar candles. I don’t know about the Tabernacle candle. We do not have votive candles.
 
But, but, I thought that altar candles in the US have to have wax content. You mean people aren’t following the rules? 🤣🤣🤣

Or am I missing something here?
 
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Composition of Candles for Use in the Liturgy​

From the April 2018 Newsletter of the Committee on Divine Worship

Prior to the Second Vatican Council altar candles were to be composed primarily or to a significant extent of pure beeswax, with the exact percentage determined by the diocesan bishop. The candle itself was given a mystical meaning: the beeswax symbolized the pure flesh Christ received from his Virgin Mother, the wick symbolized his soul, and the flame his divinity.

However, the current legislation is less specific. The General Instruction of the Roman Missal (GIRM) does not address the composition of altar candles. Conferences of Bishops possess the faculty to determine their make-up, but the USCCB has never employed this faculty to permit materials other than wax in the production of candles, so candles for use in the Mass and other liturgical rites must be made of wax and provide “‘a living flame without being smoky or noxious.’ To safeguard ‘authenticity and the full symbolism of light,’ electric lights as a substitute for candles are not permitted” ( Built of Living Stones , no. 93). This also applies to the so-called electric vigil lights used for devotional purposes. A bishop would have the authority to make an exception to a living flame in cases of necessity, if, for example, a prison or a hospital had a policy absolutely forbidding open flames.

It should be noted that while an oil lamp may be used to indicate the presence of the Blessed Sacrament in the tabernacle (see GIRM, no. 316), the U.S. bishops have never given permission for the use of oil lamps at the altar. Candles are symbols of the presence of Christ, the light of the world (Jn 8:12) and of Baptism by which we share in his light (Col 1:12), and are also signs of reverence and festivity.
 
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USCCB Says Fake Candles Not Allowed Liturgy and Sacraments
Use of Candles in the Liturgy The Secretariat of the Bishops’ Committee on the Liturgy has received a number of inquiries in the last year concerning the Church’s norms governing the use of candles and oil lamps in the liturgy. Many have asked whether oil lamps may be used as substitutes for candles during the celebration of the liturgy. The last time this question was addressed the by Secretariat was in the June-July 1974 edition of this Newsletter The General Instruction of the Roman Mi…
Click to expand...
 
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So I guess I could see how one could make the argument for liquid wax but I think it is a stretch and goes against the spirit of the rule.

As far as the original post, the priest I heard mentioned using a torch. To me that means using a gas as the fuel source.
 
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