Rapture?

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Before we break out our credit cards and order all these books you recommend, do these authors also include why they and their church believe that the regathering of Jews in all nations to the land of Israel in not in God’s prophetic plan? Israel and end times prophecy events like the “rapture” event go hand in hand. And I wish if those wanting to debunk the rapture event do so, that they also include their explanation why todays regathering of Jews to the land of Israel cannot be supported by scripture.

I skimmed the “freebies” you posted, but did not see anything like that.
Yes at least in the case of David curie’s book, which I am reading… it has a damn good explination that takes you all the way back to Daniel, to the other OT prophets, to the Olivet Discourse from Jesus, to the pivotal early years of christianity, and finally and climactically to the book of Apocalpyse. It presents the “Rapture” as history, and does a damn good job of it.

It explaines the events of 70AD, and the fall of the Temple in jerusalem in a way that is truly confronting for the rapturist, and in doing so, effectivly renders the “Rapture Passages” as null and void and as having already come to pass, including the majority of the book of Apocalpyse. Israel’s role ended when that temple fell… and it’s not coming back.
 
Yes, I understand what “rapture” means—my point was merely that your earlier post may well be taken by Protestants to mean that the Catholic Church teaches that Revelation is in fact the literal and true prophecy of the future end of the world. That is the context in which fundamentalist Protestants view it.
I am a Protestant and that would not be correct.

The rapture is only the catching away (resurrection) of the saints at our Lord’s return. This is the same doctrine the RCC holds. It has nothing to do with how one interprets Revelation.
 
I am a Protestant and that would not be correct.

The rapture is only the catching away (resurrection) of the saints at our Lord’s return. This is the same doctrine the RCC holds. It has nothing to do with how one interprets Revelation.
So who is left behind during the 2nd Coming?
 
The emergence of rapture theology to an early 19th-century Chilean Jesuit named Manuel Lacunza who proposed a theory that those who receive the Eucharist often will be taken up early at the end of the world and be spared the final 45 days of terrible judgments visited on the rest of the world.

Rome condemned his writing as doctrinally unsound, Thigpen said, but it was translated into English by the Rev. Edward Irving of the Church of Scotland, one of the earliest Protestant preachers of the secret rapture, who was excommunicated from his own church for teaching that Christ’s human nature was sinful
Rapture theology relies on an interpretation of the passage in St. Paul’s First Letter to the Thessalonians where he says that when Christ comes a second time “the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.”

The word “rapture” comes from the Latin verb “rapere,” which was used in St. Jerome’s Latin translation of that passage to express the notion of the just being “caught up” with the Lord.

But as Donahue and the author of another article, theologian Paul Thigpen, pointed out, rapture theology ends up teaching about a third coming of Christ – first in his birth in Bethlehem, second in his secret coming to snatch away the just before the tribulations of the end time, and third at the end of the world to reign in glory

A seven-year tribulation between the ‘rapture’ and the return of Christ is not biblical. Scripture teaches that Christ will come after a period of tribulation and that all believers will at that time be taken up to heaven to be with him,"

Rev. John Nelson Darby, leader of a small English sect who traveled to the United States and Canada seven times between 1859 and 1874 to spread his teachings about the secret rapture, becoming the chief historical influence behind rapture teaching in North America. his view of the rapture was then picked up by another gentleman, who taught the view in the footnotes of his Reference Bible. The Scofield Reference Bible was widely used in England and America, and many Protestants simply accepted what its footnotes said. Thus it was that the pre-tribulational view of the rapture – the belief that the rapture will occur before the tribulation – became very popular very quickly… even though no one had heard of it during the previous 1800 years.

Before that time, all Christians – Catholic, Orthodox, and Protestant – believed that the event known today as the “rapture” would take place right before the Second Coming. It was believed that this event would actually end a long period of persecution
catholic.com/library/Rapture.asp

The Rapture Trap Paul Thigpen
catholiccompany.com/product_detail.cfm?ID=948&AID=650&new=yes
 
The emergence of rapture theology to an early 19th-century Chilean Jesuit named Manuel Lacunza who proposed a theory that those who receive the Eucharist often will be taken up early at the end of the world and be spared the final 45 days of terrible judgments visited on the rest of the world.

Rome condemned his writing as doctrinally unsound, Thigpen said, but it was translated into English by the Rev. Edward Irving of the Church of Scotland, one of the earliest Protestant preachers of the secret rapture, who was excommunicated from his own church for teaching that Christ’s human nature was sinful
Rapture theology relies on an interpretation of the passage in St. Paul’s First Letter to the Thessalonians where he says that when Christ comes a second time “the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.”

The word “rapture” comes from the Latin verb “rapere,” which was used in St. Jerome’s Latin translation of that passage to express the notion of the just being “caught up” with the Lord.

But as Donahue and the author of another article, theologian Paul Thigpen, pointed out, rapture theology ends up teaching about a third coming of Christ – first in his birth in Bethlehem, second in his secret coming to snatch away the just before the tribulations of the end time, and third at the end of the world to reign in glory

A seven-year tribulation between the ‘rapture’ and the return of Christ is not biblical. Scripture teaches that Christ will come after a period of tribulation and that all believers will at that time be taken up to heaven to be with him,"

Rev. John Nelson Darby, leader of a small English sect who traveled to the United States and Canada seven times between 1859 and 1874 to spread his teachings about the secret rapture, becoming the chief historical influence behind rapture teaching in North America. his view of the rapture was then picked up by another gentleman, who taught the view in the footnotes of his Reference Bible. The Scofield Reference Bible was widely used in England and America, and many Protestants simply accepted what its footnotes said. Thus it was that the pre-tribulational view of the rapture – the belief that the rapture will occur before the tribulation – became very popular very quickly… even though no one had heard of it during the previous 1800 years.

Before that time, all Christians – Catholic, Orthodox, and Protestant – believed that the event known today as the “rapture” would take place right before the Second Coming. It was believed that this event would actually end a long period of persecution
catholic.com/library/Rapture.asp

The Rapture Trap Paul Thigpen
catholiccompany.com/product_detail.cfm?ID=948&AID=650&new=yes
yep, that’s right
 
I am a Protestant and that would not be correct.

The rapture is only the catching away (resurrection) of the saints at our Lord’s return. This is the same doctrine the RCC holds. It has nothing to do with how one interprets Revelation.
Are you a fundamentalist?

Fundamentalists believe Revelation to be the literal account of the end of the world, of which the rapture is a part. The narrower Catholic definition is not the same thing as the fundamentalist view.
 
Yes at least in the case of David curie’s book, which I am reading… it has a damn good explination that takes you all the way back to Daniel, to the other OT prophets, to the Olivet Discourse from Jesus, to the pivotal early years of christianity, and finally and climactically to the book of Apocalpyse. It presents the “Rapture” as history, and does a damn good job of it.

It explaines the events of 70AD, and the fall of the Temple in jerusalem in a way that is truly confronting for the rapturist, and in doing so, effectivly renders the “Rapture Passages” as null and void and as having already come to pass, including the majority of the book of Apocalpyse. Israel’s role ended when that temple fell… and it’s not coming back.
Boy, after the “rapture”, this book will need a update, and quickly! 😉

Anyways, concerning Israels role ended, how does the author use grace as an excuse to cast aside the people and land of Israel?
 
Boy, after the “rapture”, this book will need a update, and quickly! 😉

Anyways, concerning Israels role ended, how does the author use grace as an excuse to cast aside the people and land of Israel?
I mean cast them aside from prophecy.
 
I mean cast them aside from prophecy.
The book leaves nothing in still future prophercy, except the future second coming and final judgement. It says “we are in the milennial reign of christ now”. It simply says “all that stuff has already happened.”
 
That’s the Day of Judgment. Not the Rapture.
Actually, that is the rapture.

When that occurs (like on the Day of Judgment) is debatable. That the saints will be caught up to be with the Lord is not.

That is all the rapture is. The timing itself can be wrestled with until it happens, however.
 
I have a cool theory of the rapture.

It already happened, and the only person found worthy was Mary, the Mother of God. She was raptured (or assumed) and the rest of us are here in this vale of tears. Till he comes again, that is.
 
I have a cool theory of the rapture.

It already happened, and the only person found worthy was Mary, the Mother of God. She was raptured (or assumed) and the rest of us are here in this vale of tears. Till he comes again, that is.
Nice compromise 😉
 
Actually, that is the rapture.

When that occurs (like on the Day of Judgment) is debatable. That the saints will be caught up to be with the Lord is not.

That is all the rapture is. The timing itself can be wrestled with until it happens, however.
Then you need to tell all your friends. Most people that preach of the Rapture hold to the 7 years of Tribulation between the Rapture and Judgment Day.
 
In all fairness to Atemi not every protestant believes in the pre-trib rapture and/or dispensationalism. Some hold to other views and some pretty much view as we do. It just seems the like most of them do because some of the most vocal hold to that. So lets not bust his chops on subjects where he’s more or less in agreement with us.
 
Then you need to tell all your friends. Most people that preach of the Rapture hold to the 7 years of Tribulation between the Rapture and Judgment Day.
But they all know darn well that that those 7 years are not the rapture of the saints itself.

What else others may hold is a different story and thread. It does not somehow make all those other end-times beliefs the rapture also.

…
 
In all fairness to Atemi not every protestant believes in the pre-trib rapture and/or dispensationalism. Some hold to other views and some pretty much view as we do. It just seems the like most of them do because some of the most vocal hold to that. So lets not bust his chops on subjects where he’s more or less in agreement with us.
LOL.

Well I am in agreement with you, as are most other non-Catholic Christians, that the saints are caught up to be with the Lord at His return.

The only place we differ is the timing, really, not the event called the rapture.

…
 
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