RCIA classes. What to expect?

[Br.Rich_SFO]

And what you did was wrong Growing Grape.

There are poorly and even badly implemented RCIA processes in parishes. But that does not excuse one from following canonical requirements.

A person is not free to approach a Sacrament on their own without first requesting the Sacrament from the Church. That means that the pastor of the parish in which the person lives must grant his approval for a person to receive a Sacrament for the first time. Not just any priest but the Pastor of the persons parish.

Was your First Confession valid? yes more than likely. But something that would concern me would be was your First Holy Communion properly recorded in the Sacramental register? Was it forwarded to your Baptismal parish?

You don’t mention your Confirmation?

“First Communion is not a special sacrament in and of itself. It’s simply the first time you recieve Holy Communion in a state of grace. Same goes with First Confession. I was told this by a Franciscan Friar on St. Mikes Apologetics Q and A forum. I consulted with a professional on this!”

Theologically my Brother Franciscan was correct but however canonically he was incorrect. Anyone can Baptize and if you Baptize your infant in the kitchen sink with a witnesses. You can go over to the parish and request that the pastor record the Baptism in the parish register. The Baptism would be valid however Canon Law requires parents to present their children to the Church for Baptism. It prohibits anyone from Baptizing except in cases of emergency. The Baptism would be valid but illicit. Your Confession and First Communion was valid, but illicit.

“I then did catechism on my own.”

There is nothing wrong with studying the Faith on your own.

“Also, the Rite of Welcoming, Rite of Initiation, Rite of Acceptance, Rite of Continuuing Conversion, Rite of Election are NOT sacraments, and are not necessary to be a Catholic.”

That is correct they are not Sacraments but they are in a sense sacramentals. They are liturgical steps that have great meaning when prepared for and experienced properly. Could a Bishop take any man off the street Baptize if he is not already and Ordain him? Sure and the Ordination would be valid. However the Church has a liturgical path that should be followed. That man should receive training and formation, should be installed in the ministries of Lector and Acolyte, then be Ordained to the level of Deacon, and later to the level of priest. Because that is how the Church says it should be done. No one is free to create their own path to the Sacraments that are entrusted by Christ to His Church to administer.

“They are NOT found in any of the pre-Vatican II catechism texts.”

They are not found there that is correct. But they are found in the practices of the Early centuries of the Church. They are not anything new to the Church.

Friend you have some serious authority issues to deal with. Many of us may not like the rules of the Church but we must obey them.

 

[CatholicNerd]

Br. Rich SFO:

Your right. RCIA is intended for the Catechumenate and I always switch into Catechumenate mode when talking about the RCIA. A Candidate really does not belong in the RCIA process unless they were Baptized as a child and never catechized and know very little about the Christian Faith. Most really belong in a shorter “RCIA like” process, more specifically an adult Confirmation preparation.

That’s what my experience was like. The RCIA class for the catechumens had been meeting since last August but I jumped in this past March at the last minute. It wasn’t really so much for the instruction as it was to actually meet other converts. There were several other Lutherans that converted this year in the RCIA class and I’m so glad that I was able to meet them during the final stages of my journey.

 

[copland]

TheGrowingGrape,

you REALLY want to know the Catholic faith, all you gotta do is goto Adoration one hour per week. Read your catechism books there. Read The Bible there. Learn to pray the Rosary there. Learn contemplation and meditation there. Seriously, it will convert yo FAST

When does the adoration take place and where? I have heard someone else say the same thing. This sounds like something I would like to do.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Spending time in Adoration is a great thing to do. You can do it at any Catholic Church. Some churches have the Blessed Sacrament exposed for Adoration. However it is the same Christ that is in the tabernacle of every Catholic Church. So sitting in a Church near the tabernacle is also just fine.

Something to remember though is that Adoration should be a time “With Christ” in prayer, reflection and just listening.

Someone described it as this when we lug in a box of books with us.

It’s like inviting a good friend over and while sitting around the kitchen table you ignore their presence and instead sit there across the table and read a book about them. I can just hear Christ say “Don’t read that book about me, talk to me, listen to me, I’m here!”

Many people must “DO” something when at Adoration and just can’t sit there and be with Christ. If that is the case the Bible would be the best choice of book.

 

[oldsinnner]

I started the RCIA classes this year and find them very enlightening and comforting. There are several ‘teachers’ that are trained catechists and often the priest is there, if only for the 1st hour.

Before inquiring about the classes I had read the first part of the catechism ‘the profession of the faith’ and that was PART of what made me decide to convert but also reading some catholic writers, I had gone through a lengthy illness and treatment and had an epiphany. I had always had difficulty with guilt and resentments. But one evening I had the realization, and it wasn’t JUST a realization, it was more than that…that people are simply imperfect and so am I and the only answer is forgiveness. Forgiveness of myself and to forgive those who I had all this resentment towards. Then I began to pray and seek healing and help. Not for my physical illness, but for the illness of my character. Somehow so many things became understood to me that I cannot explain and I prayed to Jesus and told him that I was sorry and to help me.

I had not considered converting or really even going to church but I kept driving by the local Catholic church and went to their website. I didn’t even know what RCIA classes were. Had no idea how to convert to Catholicism. I called them, I had an interview and the rest is history.

I too had some ‘problems’ on occassion with the accuracy of some things the teachers said and I knew they were wrong because it was in the Catechism. We were told to put it down, if we were reading it, for now. So…I picked up and started reading ‘the concise History of the Catholic Church’ and every once in a while, there would be an error in the class and it kind of bothered me at first but it is not my place to ‘educate’ the catechist so I let it be. I"m a voracious reader so I figure I’ll learn it all eventually…well not ALL since I don’t think one can, or few can.

But, for me, my overall goal is to repair my character and become a better person. Getting into pissing contests with the catechist isn’t part of that plan and often times it’s over a minor thing anyway, such as the early history of the church or Rome. The RCiA classes aren’t seminary school as I see it. They aren’t phd’s in theology teaching the classes and neither am I so I’m not really in a position to be ‘calling them out’ and have no desire to. I appreciate all of their help and knowledge, knowing that they aren’t perfect. It’s not like Thomas Acquinas has come back from the dead and is teaching the class.

I am grateful the classes exist and have found them immensly helpful.

 

[fdesales]

I wonder exactly how it will be handled when I do get going with my conversion to the Catholic Church. I have been baptized in a Southern Baptist Church, and have even preached and taught for about 7 years. But now, I have been studying the Catechism for about 7 months on my own and have absolutely no doubts that the Catholic Church is the real deal. Most of every question I have ever had about Cathlicism I have researched it on my own on good Catholic web sites or books. My desire to be Cathoic has been a well thought out journey so far.

Ah, well, as an RCIA Coordinator, I can tell you that you do not even HAVE to go through the RCIA. It is meant for the non-baptized and those who are unchatechized - and it sounds like you are quite aware of the Gospel! The only thing missing is the Sacramentality of Catholicism. Of course, you can opt to go through the longer process, but you can also ask the priest to be welcomed into the Church - tell him about your spiritual walk in Christ, and the fact that you have even preached and taught the faith. Ask if he can teach you personally some of the specifics of the faith that are uniquely Catholic, such as the Sacraments of Eucharist and Confession.

Now, I can tell you that one does not experience Christ in the Sacraments by lectures, even from a priest. One must go to Mass! Even if you opt not to go through RCIA (which can be useful even in your situation), I would strongly recommend you get a ‘sponsor’ that can guide you on some of what it means to be Catholic - things you don’t learn in lectures. Join a Catholic ministry and you will become immersed in “Catholicism”.

Good luck

 

[crazzeto]

It should be a good experience for you. I haven’t personally walked that journey my self as I’m a cradle Catholic, but my Fiance is right now, and I"m attending with her to support her as well as I’m interested in sponcering.

Since you’re looking at being catechised as an adult, I would say do out of class homework to make sure you fully understand anything beind discussed, but also to be able to catch what might be, or might sound like error someone might teach should it happen. I’m not suggesting such a thing is common, but hey things happen.

One example is, unless you were paying close attention at one of the recent RCIA classes, and really thought about what one of our instructors was saying you might have been mislead into believeing that the Catholic Church teaches a doctrine of salvation through works alone.

The reason is because he was discussing a Jewish (ethnic) athiest who does leave a good life, but obviously completely lacks faith. He told the class that the Catholic Church teaches that he could go to heaven, but there was a subtle qualifier one might very easily miss. And that was “because we don’t know if he won’t fully embrase faith as he nears the end of his life, and we don’t know if, perhaps, Christ might come to him in his final moments and give him a chance to embrase faith”. If you missed that (since he stated it way more susinctly it would have been easy) then you would think “huh, doctrine of works”. If you fully take into account everything said, then you realize “well no, he’s just saying you don’t know whether or not he might at the last possible moment obtain the required faith”.

So anyway, just pay attention, do some homework, relax, have fun (you will) and I think you should probably walk away with a very positive experience.

 

[fdesales]

One example is, unless you were paying close attention at one of the recent RCIA classes, and really thought about what one of our instructors was saying you might have been mislead into believeing that the Catholic Church teaches a doctrine of salvation through works alone.

The reason is because he was discussing a Jewish (ethnic) athiest who does leave a good life, but obviously completely lacks faith. He told the class that the Catholic Church teaches that he could go to heaven, but there was a subtle qualifier one might very easily miss. And that was “because we don’t know if he won’t fully embrase faith as he nears the end of his life, and we don’t know if, perhaps, Christ might come to him in his final moments and give him a chance to embrase faith”.

I am not sure how this explanation is a “doctrine of works”, my friend. Accepting Christ at the end of one’s life is saving grace, not the “good life” he led before the end of his life. Leading the “good life” does not mean that this brought Christ at the end of the man’s life. God calls us regardless of our status of sin (Romans 5). The point the instructor is making, I believe, is that we should not judge whether a person is going to heaven or hell because they are “atheist” today, since we do not know whether a person will accept the Lord, even at the end of their life. Recall the parable of the man who went to hire men to work the field and collected workers throughout the day. The men who worked one hour received the same wages. Clearly, the point is that Catholic teaching emulates this - that one can be saved for eternal heaven even at the last moments of life.

I do not see how this is “salvation by works”, perhaps you could explain that?

Regards

 

[crazzeto]

I am not sure how this explanation is a “doctrine of works”, my friend. Accepting Christ at the end of one’s life is saving grace, not the “good life” he led before the end of his life. Leading the “good life” does not mean that this brought Christ at the end of the man’s life. God calls us regardless of our status of sin (Romans 5). The point the instructor is making, I believe, is that we should not judge whether a person is going to heaven or hell because they are “atheist” today, since we do not know whether a person will accept the Lord, even at the end of their life. Recall the parable of the man who went to hire men to work the field and collected workers throughout the day. The men who worked one hour received the same wages. Clearly, the point is that Catholic teaching emulates this - that one can be saved for eternal heaven even at the last moments of life.

I do not see how this is “salvation by works”, perhaps you could explain that?

Regards

You have to take in the whole post, I said that it sounded like a doctrain of works until you fully consider all that he’s saying. In the end, it wasn’t that, however if you weren’t paying full attention (and I think many people may have been confused, I very nearly was and I alreayd knew the doctrine).

If you didn’t get the part about Christ coming to the person near the end, and the person accepting the faith then, then it becomes a doctrine of works. If what you got out of what he was saying was that “since the aithest lived a good life, he’ll go to heaven anyway even though he’s an athiest with no faith” then it becomes a doctrine of works. The problem was, if you were in the room you would know he was speaking very softly, and in manner which would make it easy to get just that out of it, if you weren’t completely paying attention.

 

[fdesales]

You have to take in the whole post, I said that it sounded like a doctrain of works until you fully consider all that he’s saying. In the end, it wasn’t that, however if you weren’t paying full attention (and I think many people may have been confused, I very nearly was and I alreayd knew the doctrine).

No doubt, you were in a better position to judge what was happening than I. I am just trying to understand your interpretation based on what you wrote…

If you didn’t get the part about Christ coming to the person near the end, and the person accepting the faith then, then it becomes a doctrine of works. If what you got out of what he was saying was that “since the aithest lived a good life, he’ll go to heaven anyway even though he’s an athiest with no faith” then it becomes a doctrine of works.

I see what you are saying now. If you take part of what he said out of context, one could believe that Catholics teach “works salvation”. As an instructor, I realize that we must tread very carefully on this subject, since we are accused of it by our separated brothers in Christ. Taken in the entire context, I don’t see a “works salvation”, since he stresses at the end that he is saved by faith by accepting Christ, despite being an atheist (most Christians do not believe that 'being good" while remaining an atheist is sufficient in any way in God’s eyes). But taking part of what he said, I can understand your point.

The problem was, if you were in the room you would know he was speaking very softly, and in manner which would make it easy to get just that out of it, if you weren’t completely paying attention.

This is why summarizing and repeating main points is important. If part ‘a’ was all I heard, I think asking for clarification would be worthwhile, especially if one was a knowledgeable Christian already.

Regards

 

[oldsinnner]

I’m taking the RCIA classes and for the most part they have been good but a couple of times I’ve left feeling pretty empty but I remind myself the catechist and teachers are human beings. My last class was downright ugly. Wonder what protestants problems are with Catholics ? Just attend that last class of mine. Arrogant, self aggrandizing, and fast and loose with the truth… Minimizing the ugly side of her history or, flat getting it wrong. Sin before your very eyes. Pride. But, as a a friend of mine who is a cradle Catholic once quipped, 'You know what is wrong with the Catholic church ? It’s filled with Catholics. ’

The most knowledgeable of the teachers is a protestant convert. The cradle catholic teachers often get things wrong, based on what they were taught from who knows when…childhood…whatever.

So far, at best, I’d give them a ‘C’+/B-’ overall with by far the most knowledgeable being the convert.

It’s a shame when I know more about the religion than these lifelong catholics who are teaching, with notes I might add. They’ve got a few things memorized and call that ‘good enough’. I’m not wired that way. Good grief, pick up a book.

How can you be teaching the RCIA classes and NOT have read the catechism, confessions, and a few other books, cover to cover where you can just get up there and GO and get it right on the money. How can you be a Catholic for 60+ years, teaching the classes, and not be able to pull this off the top of your head 100% correct 100% of the time ?

Oh, THEY taught it to me like that. Well listen up, whoever THEY are, THEY are wrong and your own catechism tells you so.

But, I have to tell myself, they are human. Humans are flawed. It’s about drinking the blood of Christ, not the kool-aid.

I suppose I’m just upset right now. I thought a catechist and the teachers would have to be a little further along in the faith. Apparently, I’m wrong.

 

[fdesales]

I’m taking the RCIA classes and for the most part they have been good but a couple of times I’ve left feeling pretty empty but I remind myself the catechist and teachers are human beings. My last class was downright ugly. Wonder what protestants problems are with Catholics ? Just attend that last class of mine. Arrogant, self aggrandizing, and fast and loose with the truth… Minimizing the ugly side of her history or, flat getting it wrong. Sin before your very eyes. Pride. But, as a a friend of mine who is a cradle Catholic once quipped, 'You know what is wrong with the Catholic church ? It’s filled with Catholics. ’

The most knowledgeable of the teachers is a protestant convert. The cradle catholic teachers often get things wrong, based on what they were taught from who knows when…childhood…whatever.

Probably the best thing to do first is to address this in private, esp. when you are certain you caught them “fast and loose with the truth”. Speak to the RCIA Coordinator, and if that doesn’t help, go to the pastor. The Coordinator and instructors are answerable to the priest, and if you complain, perhaps he may show up to the classes and can correct them when he hears first hand.

If that doesn’t work, sadly, you’ll have to bring the Catechism with you and ask questions during the class. Ask questions politely that show a “confusion” with what you understand and what they have just said.

Like “excuse me, Mr. Smith, but according to this section I was reading in the Catechism, it states that Eucharist is the source and summit of our faith. I am confused on why you are telling us something different. I am not Catholic yet, could you explain this to me better?”

When an overconfident instructor is shown he is wrong with a Catechism citation, even if he won’t admit it, he’ll hopefully recognize that he needs to be better prepared for the “guy with the Catechism”. This can lead to some confrontation, but at least the instructors will be forced to back up their instruction with truth, and not just wing it from what they were taught in the second grade in 1955… Perhaps you are God’s instrument to correct the teachers of this class. Pray for discernment on how to approach this.

Pray for patience and know that being Catholic is not about what you know by books, but by experiencing Christ in the sacraments and in action. They can point you to that, but they cannot manufacture that experience. Continue to read the Catechism, but be ready for the possibility that they may understand something in there differently.

It’s a shame when I know more about the religion than these lifelong catholics who are teaching, with notes I might add. They’ve got a few things memorized and call that ‘good enough’. I’m not wired that way. Good grief, pick up a book.

How can you be teaching the RCIA classes and NOT have read the catechism, confessions, and a few other books, cover to cover where you can just get up there and GO and get it right on the money. How can you be a Catholic for 60+ years, teaching the classes, and not be able to pull this off the top of your head 100% correct 100% of the time ?

I’m thinking that the RCIA coordinator is either short-handed or is in need of some instruction him/herself. It is their job to ensure that the truth is taught, and the catechists that work with me know that I will correct them if they make mistakes. I try to do this right away, but it depends on the situation. It sounds like this program is either just beginning, a new Coordinator, short-handed, or people who are not too concerned that they are forming the minds and hearts of new candidates…

Pray for patience and prudence on how to handle this without scandal.

Regards

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Quote:

"… my advice would be to bypass the parish office or the RCIA coordinator at whatever parish you choose and go straight to the priest. "

Also, the Rite of Welcoming, Rite of Initiation, Rite of Acceptance, Rite of Continuuing Conversion, Rite of Election are NOT sacraments, and are not necessary to be a Catholic. They are NOT found in any of the pre-Vatican II catechism texts. .

That would make sense since the RCIA was restored after Vatican II.

The RCIA is the normal way an adult person becomes Baptized or a non-Cthaolic Christian becomes fully united to the Catholic Church.
To do otherwise is to do an end run around the Church norms.

 

[TomBosco]

Be very careful of what you hear at RCIA classes. I’m sure they are not all bad but I’m also sure that most are very unorthodox. I have been thrown out twice as a teacher because I read from the Catechism and challenged the liberal nonsense that was taught at every lesson. The most common thread is that the teachers tend to believe that the Bible should not be taken literally. There are many involved in these programs who promote dissent from Church teaching also. Just be careful and do not let them turn you off to the Catholic faith.

 

[legacyfive2002]

I’ve been studying Catholic doctrine and beliefs for over a year…i’d say almost two years now. I’m wondering if I need to do RCIA classes? i’ve been baptized in the trinity.

 

[SuscipeMeDomine]

I’ve been studying Catholic doctrine and beliefs for over a year…i’d say almost two years now. I’m wondering if I need to do RCIA classes? i’ve been baptized in the trinity.

It’s wonderful that you’ve been studying about the Church.

RCIA will take you to the next step – inner conversion, growing as a Catholic, becoming part of the Church.

Best wishes to you.

 

[Diane04]

I see that this post was started a long time ago but see some people have posted recently so I thought I’d share my experience in RCIA. I have been in RCIA class for about 4 weeks now. So far my experience has been a positive one. I really love the classes, they are extremely informative. Our class last night was about Mary. It cleared up so many misconceptions I had and opened my eyes. St. Maria Goretti in Arlington, Tx. Great Priests, RCIA is wonderful and I feel so filled with the Spirit of the Lord since I’ve been attending there. Fr Mike attends all the RCIA classes and will often add/clarify to what our RCIA director has just said, if he thinks it needs to be clarified. Maybe some parishes RCIA classes aren’t as informative as others. But the one I’m attending is awesome.
Have a Blessed day

 

[legacyfive2002]

I found a Parish that had RCIA classes that started the first sunday after Labor Day. I am not able to attend until well…until I get a car. Now, I don’t know what to do. Will I have to wait till next time the classes start to convert? Or is there another way?

 

[SuscipeMeDomine]

I found a Parish that had RCIA classes that started the first sunday after Labor Day. I am not able to attend until well…until I get a car. Now, I don’t know what to do. Will I have to wait till next time the classes start to convert? Or is there another way?

The only way to know what that parish will do is to talk with the RCIA director and find out.

Ideally people will be able to join RCIA at different times during the year. Maybe they can help you with transportation. But the only way to know is to talk with them.

 

[kozlosap]

Our RCIA program is awesome! Our Jesuit parish is huge - we have 5 masses each weekend with 3 fulltime priests and 2 half time semi-retired priests. Our RCIA program is run by a former Mercy sister who is an outstanding educator. Our program is year-round and it is REQUIRED that you take full part in the process. Attendance is required on both Wednesday’s and 9:30 Sunday mass every week. We are blessed to have our priests teach many Wednesday evening classes. Father Mike taught at Jesuit universities in the States and Rome for 32 years and there aren’t many theological questions he can’t answer! This RCIA class is huge - at Easter Vigil 2011 we will welcome 15 new Catholics.