RCIA process - receiving communion

[Sarad22]

I was never asked about the dispensation. I’m so confused. The church will accept my baptism from my church but not the marriage.

Also, if our marriage is not recognized, then what are our children. . . . illegitimate?

Makes no sense to me. Another church may accept me so I’m prob going there. I appreciate everyone’s (name removed by moderator)ut.

I just don’t understand how they can be so particular about this yet have so many other flaws particular among priests and inappropriate behavior.

 

[CatholicSooner]

I was never asked about the dispensation. I’m so confused. The church will accept my baptism from my church but not the marriage.

Also, if our marriage is not recognized, then what are our children. . . . illegitimate?

Makes no sense to me. Another church may accept me so I’m prob going there. I appreciate everyone’s (name removed by moderator)ut.

I just don’t understand how they can be so particular about this yet have so many other flaws particular among priests and inappropriate behavior.

We could try to help you understand, but it sounds like there may be some other underlying issues. Probably best to speak to your priest about it.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Your marriage can be blessed prior to the Vigil and when you are received into the Church at the Vigil, you can receive Holy Communion.

 

[JulianN]

Makes no sense to me. Another church may accept me so I’m prob going there. I appreciate everyone’s (name removed by moderator)ut.

That’s actually not an option. Since your husband was obligated to marry in the Catholic Church (or receive a dispensation to marry elsewhere), your marriage is not considered valid by the Church. No parish can change that without a convalidation or radical sanation.

Someone should have asked you questions about your marriage when you began the RCIA process. I’m sorry this wasn’t done, and that it has caused a great deal of frustration and misunderstanding.

 

[phil19034]

I was never asked about the dispensation. I’m so confused. The church will accept my baptism from my church but not the marriage.

Assuming that neither of you were ever married before, the Church would have accepted your marriage in a Protestant Church. Your wedding vows are not the problem. Your husband’s are the problem. He (not you) needed to marry in the Church or ask for a dispensation so the Church could make sure that he understood Marriage.

When a Catholic doesn’t follow the rules for marriage, it makes it seem as if the Catholic doesn’t understand the Christian understanding of marriage. However, the Church does assume that two Protestants marrying in a Protestant Church understand Christian marriage.

You just have to get it fixed by either a Convalidation (which is quick and easy) or a Radical Sanation (which is easy but takes a while).

Also, if our marriage is not recognized, then what are our children. . . . illegitimate?

No. You’re kids are totally legitimate. “Illegitimate” status was many for just royal & noble hereditary titles & claims, when the Church was involved with them. It had nothing to do with them as people or their status in the Church.

Makes no sense to me. Another church may accept me so I’m prob going there. I appreciate everyone’s (name removed by moderator)ut.

I just don’t understand how they can be so particular about this yet have so many other flaws particular among priests and inappropriate behavior.

Sounds like your RCIA instructor did a horrible job explaining this.

The Catholic Church always assumes that two people are married validly unless they give reason to question that assumption.

• When two non-Catholics marry, the Church assumes they married with the understanding of what marriage is. So the Church assumes that the marriage is valid.
• When two people marry inside the Catholic Church, the Church knows they were taught & should understand what marriage is. So the Church assumes the marriage is valid.
• When a Catholic receives dispensation to marry a non-Catholic outside the Catholic Church, the Church knows the Catholic was taught & should understands what marriage is. So the Church assumes the marriage is valid.
• However, when a Catholic marries outside the Catholic Church without ever talking to this priest and receiving a dispensation, then the Church has no idea if the Catholic was taught what marriage is or if he/she understand what marriage is because they didn’t follow Catholic norms. Therefore, the Church questions the validity of the marriage.

(1 of 2)

 

[phil19034]

(2 of 2)

Again, the Church always assumes that a marriage is valid until given reason to doubt it. And when someone doesn’t understand what marriage is (or rejects what the Church says it is) than raises doubt if a true marriage ever took place.

Now, there is NO reason to fear or get flustered. Simply make an appointment with the pastor to schedule a Convalidation or discuss a Radical Sanation (as I said before Convalidation is easier).

NOTE: It’s also possible that the priest might not know what a Radical Sanation is. In the United States, they are very rare (unfortunately) so many priests have never done one or they might know what it is but forget what it was called. If he doesn’t know what it is or doesn’t know how to do it, tell him to simply call the diocese to get the paperwork started. But as I said before, a Radical Sanation takes a lot longer.

I pray this helps. If you still have questions, please let us know.

But most importantly - please talk with your pastor.

God Bless

 

[Sarad22]

Thank you this has been very helpful. I will speak with the priest. My conversations in the past with him have not been helpful.

I’m just feeling extremely discouraged. If this is a rule that must be followed, I guess I understand. What I don’t understand is if the question about the marriage was eventually going to be asked, why not ask this in the beginning?

Many people on here have said it is a simple process, but I’m more upset about the principle.

 

[Catholic361]

I was in the same situation I had no clue about the faith or didn’t have anyone who was catholic at the time In my family and I only knew one catholic that wasn’t practicing the faith at the time and I wasn’t even considering the Catholic church. Fast forward to 2018 I’m catholic…:blush:best choice I ever made to follow Christ’s call to come home.

 

[Usige]

I was never asked about the dispensation. I’m so confused. The church will accept my baptism from my church but not the marriage.

As others have said, the issue is that your husband, potentially, did not have permission (i.e. a dispensation) to marry outside of the Church.

Catholics hold to both natural law (e.g. how God designed creation) and ecclesiastical law (how the Church maintains order of her members). All people, Catholic, Baptist or Atheist, are bound by natural law. This is why it is impossible for say two men to marry, because it is against God’s law of creation.

On the other hand, ecclesiastic law only applies to Catholics. The requirement to get married in the Church or receive a dispensation falls under this heading. It would be a little like living in one country and not following their civil law and instead following the laws of another society that you preferred. All members of a society are bound to follow that society’s laws. Because he did not follow those laws, the marriage did not validly take place.

With regard to children, because you both believed you were entering into a valid marriage it has no impact on their legitimacy.

As far as changing parishes, it would just delay things. One of the first things they should check is if you are in a valid marriage. As soon as they know he is catholic they would have to check his baptismal record. Without being married in the church or receiving a dispensation, his records would show no notation of being married. You’d be right back where you are now.

Remeber this isn’t about punishing you, but making things right in the eyes of God. I know it might not seem that way but ultimately it’s about setting both you and your husband’s relationship with God back on the right footing.

 

[Usige]

What I don’t understand is if the question about the marriage was eventually going to be asked, why not ask this in the beginning?

Many people on here have said it is a simple process, but I’m more upset about the principle.

This is a completely understandable frustration. They should have checked in the very beginning. This is especially true since irregular marriages are one of the biggest bumps in the road for most RCIA classes.

In charity I will give the parish the benefit of the doubt and that perhaps there was a misunderstanding because of poorly worded or unclear question: “Were you married in the Church?” vs “Were either of you baptized, or received, into the Catholic Church before you were married? If yes, were you married in the Catholic Church or receive permission from the Catholic party’s bishop to marry outside the Church?” It isn’t always apparent to potential converts in RCIA that “married in the Church” doesn’t mean married in any church. Many could mistaken answer “yes” because they were married in their local methodist church.

 

[phil19034]

What I don’t understand is if the question about the marriage was eventually going to be asked, why not ask this in the beginning?

This is a very good question

Most likely, it was an honest mistake.

Worst case, person who runs your RCIA might be uncomfortable with having this discussion and puts it’s off (human nature).

Now, I understand why perhaps it shouldn’t be the first discussion, but it should towards the very beginning of the process.

I’m sorry this happened to you

God bless

 

[poche]

I think they should have addressed this at the very beginning. When a person who is baptized in the Catholic Church marries outside of the Church then that marriage is not recognized as valid in the Catholic Church. Therefore you all would need to have your marriage convalidated. That they would wait a long time in the program to discuss this with you is a mistake on their part, but the situation still exists where your marital situation needs to be regularized by the Church.

 

[mrsdizzyd]

Many people on here have said it is a simple process, but I’m more upset about the principle.

People make mistakes. Give them the same grace you would want to receive if you had a made a mistake.

 

[CatholicSooner]

Thank you this has been very helpful. I will speak with the priest. My conversations in the past with him have not been helpful.

I’m just feeling extremely discouraged. If this is a rule that must be followed, I guess I understand. What I don’t understand is if the question about the marriage was eventually going to be asked, why not ask this in the beginning?

Many people on here have said it is a simple process, but I’m more upset about the principle.

They should have asked at the beginning of RCIA like others have said but at least they realized it with 2 plus months before the vigil. It should be plenty of time.

 

[Sarad22]

Thank you all for your support and (name removed by moderator)ut. I’m going to meet with the priest and discuss. I just look on my parishes website and the RCIA inquiry form asks if you are married. I’m going to ask them to update this form so it is more clear from the beginning.

I’m definitely struggling with this on principle but will pray and think about it. I’m not sure if I agree with this and in my opinion religion is personal and internal.

 

[Sarad22]

Thank you, after calming down about this whole process, I may consider continuing if we are granted a radical sanation. If this is a retroactive dispensation, I am okay with this) I am not okay with having a new wedding date recorded in the church.

I am thinking back and on the 8 hour retreat about sacraments, the sacrament of marriage was discussed. We did discuss this topic, and how a catholic marrying a non-Catholic even if in another church is not recognized. We have a small RCIA class and the teacher saw a I had a funny look on my face. I am almost certain she said oh you are fine, some people decide to do a ceremony years later. I will ask the teacher about this because maybe her understanding was incorrect. It is frustrating because this occurred at least 1 month ago!

 

[JulianN]

Yes, the radical sanation will be retroactive, and you will not need a new wedding date. Nor would your husband need to participate if he’s not so inclined. This is often a sticking point (understandably) for people who are in this situation.

I am sorry this was not discussed sooner – it should have been. But unfortunately, there are often misunderstandings related to marriage validity canons. Even priests are sometimes confused.

I hope you are able to get this resolved and move on with the process – and welcome to the Church!

 

[Peebo]

If you decide not to become Catholic because of your principle then that’s up to you…many Catholics have gone through much harder times but have persevered…my wife went through RCIA while going through the annulment process…you’re fortunate that you don’t have to go through that process…it was 18 months of pain and stress for her…she didn’t know if she would get it…but she hung in there…she got her annulment and we had our marriage convalidated before mass for her confirmation…it took about 5-10 minutes…if your principles are more important than the Catholic faith then you may need to reflect what you want.

 

[JulianN]

if your principles are more important than the Catholic faith then you may need to reflect what you want.

I don’t believe that’s what the OP said. I think she is understandably upset that this wasn’t brought up earlier. Also, since she had no idea at the time of her wedding that there was a question of validity, it’s not unreasonable for her to feel that wedding counted, and that she would not feel right about a “new” wedding date.

 

[CatholicSooner]

Peebo:

if your principles are more important than the Catholic faith then you may need to reflect what you want.

I don’t believe that’s what the OP said. I think she is understandably upset that this wasn’t brought up earlier. Also, since she had no idea at the time of her wedding that there was a question of validity, it’s not unreasonable for her to feel that wedding counted, and that she would not feel right about a “new” wedding date.

I agree with Peebo on this.

IF the OP is already have issues like this with the Church, I’m not sure if she is ready to enter the Church. As this is pretty straight forward. There are a lot more confusing and controversal teachings than marriage in the Church