RCIA Sponsors

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djrakowski:
Where can I find the text of this “Rite of Acceptance?” I’m planning on asking our pastor about this, and I’d like to have something to back me up.
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I need it. I’m the sponsor. I’ve been one before and never read this.

The problem I’m seeing is from a different angle. We who are Catholic generally (not the people here) are clueless to our faith. If one does not get a strong leader, who is in tune to who encompasses his class, he will not convey the information to those who need it, the potential converts.
The Catholics are striving for information as well but RCIA should be about those who want to convert. If the Catholics are confused, perhaps a second class would be better.
As with my husband, if someone doesn’t get him to understand WHY Catholic teachings are better, he is gone.
 
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Orionthehunter:
Anyway, we have a period that we call “Period of Evangelization” where we cover Salvation History and certain Truths that are generally universal among Christians like Creation, and the Trinity, plus Church Authority and the four Marks (One, Holy, Universal (Catholic), Apostolic).
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Only one person in our class (of the 5 who aren’t already Catholic) is converting from a non-Christian religion, so the first 4 weeks have been excruciatingly dull for the rest of us. My research had led me to believe that there was a separate process for people who’ve been formed in other Christian traditions, so I was surprised to find us all lumped together with non-Christians and cradle Catholics. It seems to me that there should probably be 3 classes - one, an adult education program for Catholics, another for those with formation in another Christian tradition, and another for those with no formation in Christianity.
 
netmil(name removed by moderator):
I need it. I’m the sponsor. I’ve been one before and never read this.

The problem I’m seeing is from a different angle. We who are Catholic generally (not the people here) are clueless to our faith. If one does not get a strong leader, who is in tune to who encompasses his class, he will not convey the information to those who need it, the potential converts.
The Catholics are striving for information as well but RCIA should be about those who want to convert. If the Catholics are confused, perhaps a second class would be better.
As with my husband, if someone doesn’t get him to understand WHY Catholic teachings are better, he is gone.
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In our Parish, in addition to coming to Adult Education classes, our Pastor invites Catholics to participate in teh classes held for RCIA candidates/catechumens who want to learn more about the Catholic Faith. This year we have four such participants. Ask your Pastor if your hubby can’t attend for this purpose.
 
netmil(name removed by moderator):
I need it. I’m the sponsor. I’ve been one before and never read this.

The problem I’m seeing is from a different angle. We who are Catholic generally (not the people here) are clueless to our faith. If one does not get a strong leader, who is in tune to who encompasses his class, he will not convey the information to those who need it, the potential converts.
The Catholics are striving for information as well but RCIA should be about those who want to convert. If the Catholics are confused, perhaps a second class would be better.
As with my husband, if someone doesn’t get him to understand WHY Catholic teachings are better, he is gone.
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Along with him, the other Baptist fellow in our class may be gone as well. I can sense that he’s terribly unimpressed at the content of the class (even now that we’ve gotten discussions under control).
 
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djrakowski:
Only one person in our class (of the 5 who aren’t already Catholic) is converting from a non-Christian religion, so the first 4 weeks have been excruciatingly dull for the rest of us. My research had led me to believe that there was a separate process for people who’ve been formed in other Christian traditions, so I was surprised to find us all lumped together with non-Christians and cradle Catholics. It seems to me that there should probably be 3 classes - one, an adult education program for Catholics, another for those with formation in another Christian tradition, and another for those with no formation in Christianity.
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This suggestion may be beyond the resources of your particular parish. I know it would be for our Parish and our Priest. Additionally, I don’t think it is harmful for even a cradle Catholic to get a “primer” on the most basics. So many of your soon to be Catholic brethren have suffered under a period of poor catechisis. Finally, for those more developed, they can still use the initial classes to get an understanding and appreciation for those unchurched and their challenges. For me personally, the people who I end up having the greatest affinity and appreciation for that go thru RCIA are the people with no faith background. The miracle of them finding the Church and their unique zeal is truly inspiring. I recommend that you befriend one. You will be surprised of the fruits that you experience.

I fondly recall a person who went thru RCIA a few years ago who was probably as well-developed as you. She at first expressed her frustration with the pace. However, in the end, she ended up praising Father for proceess because she got a sense on how the Truth is cumulative and builds on itself. Be patient my friend. Patience is a Virtue for a reason. 🙂 God Bless you in your journey. You are on the first steps of one that will last for all eternity!
 
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Orionthehunter:
In our Parish, in addition to coming to Adult Education classes, our Pastor invites Catholics to participate in teh classes held for RCIA candidates/catechumens who want to learn more about the Catholic Faith. This year we have four such participants. Ask your Pastor if your hubby can’t attend for this purpose.
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That’s where he is at, RCIA.
It should not be put on him to answer his questions. It should be presented clearly, almost like an Apolgetics class.

They are going off on Devotions and Apparitions. He is not ready for that. He needs to know why we genuflect, why we use Holy Water, if he should bow or nod his head etc. He doesn’t need to know how Abraham is connected to Issac, that’s the Sunday School stuff he got as a child. He needs how B16 is connected to Peter. The Catholic teachings that make our church the true church.

This is not good.
 
netmil(name removed by moderator):
That’s where he is at, RCIA.
It should not be put on him to answer his questions. It should be presented clearly, almost like an Apolgetics class.

They are going off on Devotions and Apparitions. He is not ready for that. He needs to know why we genuflect, why we use Holy Water, if he should bow or nod his head etc. He doesn’t need to know how Abraham is connected to Issac, that’s the Sunday School stuff he got as a child. He needs how B16 is connected to Peter. The Catholic teachings that make our church the true church.

This is not good.
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I would recommend a book called “Why Catholics Do That” as it touches on many of the issues that you address. Or pick up a book on Sacramentals. Regarding Authority, there are a number of books that address that but for a short version, I belive it is covered in “Catholic and Christian” by a guy named Schreck. I’ve also heard that Catholicism for Dummies is also good but don’t know first hand.

Additionally, our RCIA process is 20 classes (each 1.5 hours in length). Not ever class is pertinent to every person. My suggestion is that you and your hubby spend an evening making a list of all questions (don’t leave out anything) that he has about the Church. Ask the Priest for the Curriculum to find out where there are “holes” that you need to fill by outside sources. Maybe most of them could be answered by inviting your Priest over for an evening of dinner and “catechesis” or meeting with your Adult Educatin director. However, I’ve come to realize that there is a general expectation that the Church is responsible for directly teaching us everything we need to know. This is not true. We need to be seeking information and learning on our own. And since we know best what we don’t know, we should be “designing” our own learning curriculum.

Personally, I’ve done RCIA for five years and learn something new each class, have read countless books, and the more I learn the more I realize I don’t know.

Finally, with all due respect to your Pastor, devotions and apparitions are things that we don’t cover in our RCIA class as they are beyond the basics. When I first got into RCIA, I too wanted such subjects covered. However, after years of experience, I now agree that these issues are to be explored post Confirmation. You might want to sit down with your Pastor and discuss this with him.
 
Early this year I attended RCIA to see if I would get anything out of it or if I could contribute. It was excruciating to see how watered down it was, it wasn’t horrible but I really like solid answers. I offered as much (name removed by moderator)ut as I could but since I had just come back into the Church a month or so before I gave them a chance to do it and not be disruptive.

Now I am involved where I can help in a Bible Study and CCD. This is where I can help and get a little into some meat and potatoes. I don’t want the kids of today to recieve the crummy catechesis I did.

I know someone who went through that RCIA at my parish and he made it through and is very involved at our parish. It didn’t kill him, and probably did give him a good rounded out education.

I know a lady who is interested a little in the Church and have been talking to her, she used to go to Kingdom Hall so she has to get over some prejucides first. So if God wills it I might be going to RCIA as a sponsor in the future. Maybe now that I have spent a little time in the parish and hopefully proved I am not a nutcase, I can give a little (name removed by moderator)ut into things.

God Bless
Scylla
 
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Orionthehunter:
Finally, with all due respect to your Pastor, devotions and apparitions are things that we don’t cover in our RCIA class as they are beyond the basics. When I first got into RCIA, I too wanted such subjects covered. However, after years of experience, I now agree that these issues are to be explored post Confirmation. You might want to sit down with your Pastor and discuss this with him.
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I’m in the same RCIA class as netmil(name removed by moderator)'s husband, and I can say for certain that the pastor wouldn’t tolerate this teaching. A deacon is leading our class, and he seems to come from an old, perhaps more ‘cultural’ Catholic background. The questions about private devotions, apparitions and ‘visionaries’ come from the cradle Catholics in the class.

Really, is there any place for cradle Catholics in a program entitled “Rite of Christian Initiation of Adults?” They’re already initiated, and all of this talk of private devotions and apparitions quite frankly sounds like superstition. These topics are so freaky to those of us from Protestant backgrounds that it nearly caused my wife and at least 3 other folks to drop out of the class.

Thankfully, I discussed the situation about private devotions/apparitions with the pastor, and he agreed to speak to the deacon about putting a lid on these topics. But, again, he mentioned ‘generational prayer’ and the Conyers apparition last night (though he didn’t allow these topics to take over the class as he had in previous weeks). We’ve about reached the end of our rope with this class. And, this is at a parish with a reputation for orthodoxy.
 
That is pretty annoying to me too when I am in Bible study and someone wants to keep piping up about private revelation. And some of the stuff these people come up with is pretty off the wall.

That is why we need to do some cleaning up with the Catechesis, too many ignorant Catholics out there. I was completely ignorant that is why I fell away, and I am sure most everyone who grew up with me was in about the same boat.

Scylla
 
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djrakowski:
I’m in the same RCIA class as netmil(name removed by moderator)'s husband, and I can say for certain that the pastor wouldn’t tolerate this teaching. A deacon is leading our class, and he seems to come from an old, perhaps more ‘cultural’ Catholic background. The questions about private devotions, apparitions and ‘visionaries’ come from the cradle Catholics in the class.

Really, is there any place for cradle Catholics in a program entitled “Rite of Christian Initiation of Adults?” They’re already initiated, and all of this talk of private devotions and apparitions quite frankly sounds like superstition. These topics are so freaky to those of us from Protestant backgrounds that it nearly caused my wife and at least 3 other folks to drop out of the class.

Thankfully, I discussed the situation about private devotions/apparitions with the pastor, and he agreed to speak to the deacon about putting a lid on these topics. But, again, he mentioned ‘generational prayer’ and the Conyers apparition last night (though he didn’t allow these topics to take over the class as he had in previous weeks). We’ve about reached the end of our rope with this class. And, this is at a parish with a reputation for orthodoxy.
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Pardon me for laughing but this was something that we experienced in our Parish many years ago. I joined the RCIA team upon the invitation of our new Pastor adn that first year, he spent most of the first few classes with growing frustration telling repeatedly the “cradle Catholics” taht the class was first and foremost a class for the candidates and that they were guests. In the end, he had to call all the offenders aside and tell them to “shut up”. Keep talkign to your Pastor as it appears he has a grasp on the situation and will ultimately prevail. LOL Like I said before, maybe the main thing you will get out of the class is learning Patience. However, consider it a worthy sacrifice as by the next year, we had things running smoothly and our “guests” know their place. Oh, the crosses we must bear on our journey!
 
No pardon is necessary. The fact that you found some humor in this story means that you’re able to see this at least a bit from my perspective. If I indeed stay in the class, it will be a triumph of patience in the highest degree.

I’m less concerned about my need of patience as I am with the poor formation that’s taking place, and how many people are being driven away by it. You’re right in telling folks like me and netmil(name removed by moderator) that we have the ability to get other resources. But, what about someone who doesn’t know about Catholic Answers, and doesn’t know which theologians and apologists are teaching in concert with the magisterium? They’re having all of their prejudices against Catholics reinforced by this class, and may never come back. Even my wife and I, after a year’s worth of convincing personal study, have been caused to reconsider.
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Orionthehunter:
Pardon me for laughing but this was something that we experienced in our Parish many years ago. I joined the RCIA team upon the invitation of our new Pastor adn that first year, he spent most of the first few classes with growing frustration telling repeatedly the “cradle Catholics” taht the class was first and foremost a class for the candidates and that they were guests. In the end, he had to call all the offenders aside and tell them to “shut up”. Keep talkign to your Pastor as it appears he has a grasp on the situation and will ultimately prevail. LOL Like I said before, maybe the main thing you will get out of the class is learning Patience. However, consider it a worthy sacrifice as by the next year, we had things running smoothly and our “guests” know their place. Oh, the crosses we must bear on our journey!
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scylla:
That is pretty annoying to me too when I am in Bible study and someone wants to keep piping up about private revelation. And some of the stuff these people come up with is pretty off the wall.
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Leroy. A few weeks ago at my “Dessert with Scripture and Tradition” class, some woman came who had never been there before. Took up 20 min of the class pestering Fr. about some New Age stuff she got off a website. Then later on she keeps going on about a private revelation. Poor Fr. kept trying to explain about public v. private revelation and non-binding, etc. but the woman just wouldn’t get it. We were all pretty annoyed.
 
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axolotl:
Leroy. A few weeks ago at my “Dessert with Scripture and Tradition” class, some woman came who had never been there before. Took up 20 min of the class pestering Fr. about some New Age stuff she got off a website. Then later on she keeps going on about a private revelation. Poor Fr. kept trying to explain about public v. private revelation and non-binding, etc. but the woman just wouldn’t get it. We were all pretty annoyed.
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From what I have heard, this has been the focus of this RCIA class.
My girls are in Polish Dance when the class is going on so I cannot be there but next week, my hubby may just do the Polish Dance and I will attend RCIA.

If my hubby is searching, I don’t want him turned off by his first experience in this. He states that to him, being Catholic is like a club he doesn’t belong to. We have the secret handshake, etc. He doesn’t need those things which are controversial, at best, to be in this class. He needs hard information for an adult audience. Not Sunday School with a sprinking of CCD. From what I hear, my third grader is getting more out of her CCD class.

And it’s really easy for Catholics to look for someone to affirm our fringe beliefs but that should not be what this is about. A separate class would be great.
 
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djrakowski:
Only one person in our class (of the 5 who aren’t already Catholic) is converting from a non-Christian religion, so the first 4 weeks have been excruciatingly dull for the rest of us. My research had led me to believe that there was a separate process for people who’ve been formed in other Christian traditions, so I was surprised to find us all lumped together with non-Christians and cradle Catholics. It seems to me that there should probably be 3 classes - one, an adult education program for Catholics, another for those with formation in another Christian tradition, and another for those with no formation in Christianity.
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BINGO! Give that person a prize.
 
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djrakowski:
No pardon is necessary. The fact that you found some humor in this story means that you’re able to see this at least a bit from my perspective. If I indeed stay in the class, it will be a triumph of patience in the highest degree.

I’m less concerned about my need of patience as I am with the poor formation that’s taking place, and how many people are being driven away by it. You’re right in telling folks like me and netmil(name removed by moderator) that we have the ability to get other resources. But, what about someone who doesn’t know about Catholic Answers, and doesn’t know which theologians and apologists are teaching in concert with the magisterium? They’re having all of their prejudices against Catholics reinforced by this class, and may never come back. Even my wife and I, after a year’s worth of convincing personal study, have been caused to reconsider.
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I’m glad that you got that I wasn’t laughing to make fun but laughing because we weren’t alone. I think that you have a good perspective on what is happening. I urge you to schedule a meeting with the Pastor alone or maybe with one more person (alone might be best so everyone is most frank and open) to discuss your concerns. Based on your earlier post, your Pastor seems to grasp what you are saying but might not grasp the severity. A follow up conversation will help him get the whole picture.

P.S. Anytime I’m going to have a frank conversation with my Priest about such matters, I usually try to spend 10 minutes in front of the Blessed Sacrament asking for wisdom to be most effective. Good Luck. You are truly on a mission from God!
 
I posted a thread on this a while back myself. Well, about a week or two ago. I’ve just decided to roll w/ the punches and won’t hesitate to just go and get on the internet or grab a book if I leave w/ more questions. But, so far, everything we have covered is fairly basic and I have pretty much read it all already. Not everyone in a parish (even if they WANT to help w/ RCIA or other education) is going to know everything. While I may have just read a wonderful explanation of Marian devotion by Scott Hahn because of my excitement, I realize not everyone in the room has! Last night we discussed the rosary and Mary. I had just read a chapter on the topic in Thomas Howard’s On Being Catholic. But, it was good reinforcement.

I was taken a bit aback by the fact that my wife’s sponsor didn’t understand the Immaculate Conception.

But we all got rosary beads!
 
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Orionthehunter:
Pardon me for laughing but this was something that we experienced in our Parish many years ago. I joined the RCIA team upon the invitation of our new Pastor adn that first year, he spent most of the first few classes with growing frustration telling repeatedly the “cradle Catholics” taht the class was first and foremost a class for the candidates and that they were guests. In the end, he had to call all the offenders aside and tell them to “shut up”. Keep talkign to your Pastor as it appears he has a grasp on the situation and will ultimately prevail. LOL Like I said before, maybe the main thing you will get out of the class is learning Patience. However, consider it a worthy sacrifice as by the next year, we had things running smoothly and our “guests” know their place. Oh, the crosses we must bear on our journey!
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Now here is an idea. Hold the RCIA sessions in the main church using the audio system and put the cradle Catholics in the cry-room behind the glass. That way they can hear but can’t be heard!
 
Br. Rich SFO:
Now here is an idea. Hold the RCIA sessions in the main church using the audio system and put the cradle Catholics in the cry-room behind the glass. That way they can hear but can’t be heard!
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:rotfl:
 
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