RCIA Student, Traditional Roman Catholicism, and Latin language?

[Jason_NC]

Hello everyone. I’m currently an RCIA student who seems to be completely drawn to values and practices of the those who are deemed Traditionalist Catholics and I was curious about a couple of things. I was talking to my mother, who is a cradle Catholic, about my and her views towards the Catholic Church and she said many of my views sounds like that of a Traditionalist. I felt she had a point in what she said, but am I by chance getting to far ahead of myself since I’m not a member of the Catholic Church? Part of this went into my interest in learning Latin to help keep certain traditions of the Church alive and well at the very least in my own life, but again, I was somewhat curious if I’m jumping ahead of myself.

I was baptized Catholic as an infant but I was raised going to various Protestant Churches until became an Atheist, however since recently finding God and the Catholic Church, I have fell in love with the traditions of the Church.

 

[SecretaryMonday]

I don’t think there is such a thing as a “Traditionalist Catholic” - not, at least, as opposed to something else, like “Modernist Catholic.” Its one Church, Tradition and all…I know what you mean, though.
I went through RCIA in 2011. I was SO disappointed when I began to attend Mass in my parish; it didn’t seem at all like what I thought a Catholic Church would be like. (That’s just me, of course; its a good parish with many wonderful qualities so I’m not trying to demean it!) I craved the silence, reverence, and solemnity of the Latin Mass, and I am so blessed that we have the Latin Mass in my diocese.
From your post, it seems like you might be worried that your love of the traditional could be considered inappropriate somehow, maybe even schismatic. This isn’t the case at all (though I might have misunderstood you, I’m dense). What kind of questions do you have?

 

[George_Stegmeir]

I am of an older generation, pre-dating the reforms of VII. I went to a Jesuit run Parochial School in South Florida and we started learning Latin (and also Spanish) in the first grade. By the time I was in fourth grade and an altar boy, I and my classmates had enough knowledge of Latin that we knew what every prayer in the Mass meant in English! This was not uncommon for those of us who went to Parochial School in those days. Many of these schools did not teach Latin until the later grades, but teach it they did.
However, learning Latin was never a requirement for those who converted to our Faith. For those who didn’t know the language, we had the Catholic Missal, which had the Latin on a page and the authorized English translation next to it. Almost every practicing Catholic adult had one.
Since you are fifteen, it is admirable to want to learn Latin for whatever reason. It is part of a well rounded Classical Education. Learning Latin while you are in secondary school will give you the discipline you will need when and if you go on to a higher education. If you study any of the romance languages at some later date your earlier study of Latin will make your studies easy.

 

[YoungTradCath]

Hello everyone. I’m currently an RCIA student who seems to be completely drawn to values and practices of the those who are deemed Traditionalist Catholics and I was curious about a couple of things. I was talking to my mother, who is a cradle Catholic, about my and her views towards the Catholic Church and she said many of my views sounds like that of a Traditionalist. I felt she had a point in what she said, but am I by chance getting to far ahead of myself since I’m not a member of the Catholic Church? Part of this went into my interest in learning Latin to help keep certain traditions of the Church alive and well at the very least in my own life, but again, I was somewhat curious if I’m jumping ahead of myself.

I was baptized Catholic as an infant but I was raised going to various Protestant Churches until became an Atheist, however since recently finding God and the Catholic Church, I have fell in love with the traditions of the Church.

Just a few things. Latin is not going away, the Church has maintained it even in the worst of recent times and has recently reaffirmed it several times. If you want to learn it, that’s great. It will not only help you in your Catholic adventure (especially if you want to get into theological works), but it will also help you in post-secondary education.

Second, jumping ahead of yourself is not a good thing. I suggest you take it slowly and steadily for a while. You can become discouraged. This is because you will be intrigued by all the newness, and once this novelty wears off, you will feel like there isn’t anything “more” for you to “do.” Of course, you will never extinguish the treasures of the Church; there will always be something else, but it will not feel like it if you go too far too quickly in the beginning.

 

[Jason_NC]

I’ll respond more in detail later tonight when I get back from work, but Mr. Stegmeir I just wanted to politely correct you and tell you I’m not 15 but 19 turning 20 in two weeks. I assume the mistake was looking at the number of post I have. No worries, I just wanted to make that small correction.

 

[floresco]

Part of this went into my interest in learning Latin to help keep certain traditions of the Church alive and well at the very least in my own life, but again, I was somewhat curious if I’m jumping ahead of myself.
.

I love Latin and I love learning about traditional practices of the Church, but it is more important to learn the basics of the Faith.

 

[Jason_NC]

I don’t think there is such a thing as a “Traditionalist Catholic” - not, at least, as opposed to something else, like “Modernist Catholic.” Its one Church, Tradition and all…I know what you mean, though.
I went through RCIA in 2011. I was SO disappointed when I began to attend Mass in my parish; it didn’t seem at all like what I thought a Catholic Church would be like. (That’s just me, of course; its a good parish with many wonderful qualities so I’m not trying to demean it!) I craved the silence, reverence, and solemnity of the Latin Mass, and I am so blessed that we have the Latin Mass in my diocese.
From your post, it seems like you might be worried that your love of the traditional could be considered inappropriate somehow, maybe even schismatic. This isn’t the case at all (though I might have misunderstood you, I’m dense). What kind of questions do you have?

Partly yes and no. It seemed like I was getting some negative feedback over my views as my mother has various views that go against the Church partly having to do with her liberal political background. But my post was also looking to see if I was taking it too fast.

 

[floresco]

Partly yes and no. It seemed like I was getting some negative feedback over my views as my mother has various views that go against the Church partly having to do with her liberal political background. But my post was also looking to see if I was taking it too fast.

It is normal to be eager and passionate when first finding the Church. It is very much like falling in love. Of course you want to do everything at once. You just need a sense of priorities. The Creed is at the core of intellectual understanding of the Faith. This is unpacked in the Catechism. In terms living it out, the Mass is the source and summit of our Faith. Assist at Mass as much as you can. If you are more attracted to the Extraordinary Form, that is fine, but do not let your love for it turn you against the Ordinary Form.

I consider myself a traditional Catholic and, by preference, attend the EF. So obviously I do not think there is anything wrong with this. But there is a negative side to the traditional movement that you should beware of. There are those who are disrespectful and disobedient to the Pope and the Magisterium. There are those who look down on people who attend the OF. You need to learn how to take the very good things that come with tradition while avoid these evils.

Latin is great. I had learned a bit in high school (a very long time ago for me) but in recent years I have been working on taking it to a higher level. It is the language of the Church and it has enhanced my faith. I encourage you to pursue it, if you feel drawn. Just do not let it interfere with the more important aspects.

 

[Jason_NC]

It is normal to be eager and passionate when first finding the Church. It is very much like falling in love. Of course you want to do everything at once. You just need a sense of priorities. The Creed is at the core of intellectual understanding of the Faith. This is unpacked in the Catechism. In terms living it out, the Mass is the source and summit of our Faith. Assist at Mass as much as you can. If you are more attracted to the Extraordinary Form, that is fine, but do not let your love for it turn you against the Ordinary Form.

I consider myself a traditional Catholic and, by preference, attend the EF. So obviously I do not think there is anything wrong with this. But there is a negative side to the traditional movement that you should beware of. There are those who are disrespectful and disobedient to the Pope and the Magisterium. There are those who look down on people who attend the OF. You need to learn how to take the very good things that come with tradition while avoid these evils.

Latin is great. I had learned a bit in high school (a very long time ago for me) but in recent years I have been working on taking it to a higher level. It is the language of the Church and it has enhanced my faith. I encourage you to pursue it, if you feel drawn. Just do not let it interfere with the more important aspects.

Thank you for the answers. I’ve actually made a decision after getting a PM from a member to hold on learning Latin for the moment. Better to embrace the basic and core of the Church before I pursue learning the language the language of the Church. Going to fast won’t do me any good in my relationship with God and his Church. I’ll pursue learning the language sometime in the future though.

Edit: Also, I think I have already seen some proof of the disrespect from the traditional movement. I’ve read a lot of sites that have spoken very unfavorably of various Catholics to the point of even heavily criticizing the Pope and the post Vatican II Church.

 

[clem456]

Thank you for the answers. I’ve actually made a decision after getting a PM from a member to hold on learning Latin for the moment. Better to embrace the basic and core of the Church before I pursue learning the language the language of the Church. Going to fast won’t do me any good in my relationship with God and his Church. I’ll pursue learning the language sometime in the future though.

You will derive more benefit in God’s eyes from listening to and taking guidance from your RCIA instructors and priests than anything else, whether you agree with their paticular approach to the faith or not. Catholic tradition is full of saints who listened to those whose job it was to teach the faith. There may be a time and place for you to learn Latin etc…, listen to those who are instructing you and trust God and the Church.

 

[Jason_NC]

You will derive more benefit in God’s eyes from listening to and taking guidance from your RCIA instructors and priests than anything else, whether you agree with their paticular approach to the faith or not. Catholic tradition is full of saints who listened to those whose job it was to teach the faith. There may be a time and place for you to learn Latin etc…, listen to those who are instructing you and trust God and the Church.

One step at a time with the help of my Church at the moment.

 

[floresco]

Edit: Also, I think I have already seen some proof of the disrespect from the traditional movement. I’ve read a lot of sites that have spoken very unfavorably of various Catholics to the point of even heavily criticizing the Pope and the post Vatican II Church.

This is one of the most, if not the most, serious problems among traditional Catholics. And I say that as a traditional Catholic.

A couple of organizations that I consider models of the right way to be traditional Catholics are Familia Sancti Hieronomi and Una Voce. FSH has more emphasis on the Latin language and UV has its focus on making the EF Mass available. Both are explicit in their loyalty to the Pope. Here is the beginning of the FSH constitution:

All faithful Roman Catholics may become members of this association who agree to dedicate themselves to the following ends:

Sincere love for the Holy Father and a devoted obedience to His Supreme Magisterium;

Intense commitment to the spiritual life, striving to union with God according to the teaching and the example of so many Saints;

Diligent study and use of the Latin language, the living language of the Roman Catholic Church, in order to arrive at a sound command of the language in reading, thinking, speaking and writing.

hieronymus.us.com/

Here is the beginning of the Wikipedia article on Una Voce:

The Foederatio Internationalis Una Voce (Latin for “With One Voice”; from the Preface to the Roman Canon) is an international federation of Catholic lay organizations attached to the Tridentine Mass.[1][2]

The Foederatio Internationalis Una Voce (or FIUV) was founded on December 19, 1964 in Paris by Georges Cerbelaud-Salagnac in order to promote the Tridentine mass from the Pre-Vatican II Missale Romanum (1962).[3][4] The organization argues that while the Second Vatican Council had introduced vernacular liturgies, it did not actually forbid the Latin mass, and that regular weekday and Sunday masses in Latin should be maintained.[5] The organization also seeks to promote Latin Gregorian Chant, sacred polyphony and sacred art.[3][4] Unlike some of the other Catholic traditionalist organizations, Una Voce seeks to remain faithful to the Pope within the Roman Catholic Church,[3][4][6] and asserts that the Tridentine and the vernacular masses should be allowed to co-exist.[4][6][7] Among its prominent early members were the composers Maurice Duruflé and Oliver Messiaen.[3][8]

A number of national associations developed during 1964 and 1965, and in 1966 an international association, the Foederatio Internationalis Una Voce was formed. It currently has over two dozen national affiliates.[3][5][9]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Una_Voce

When you are ready to explore traditional Catholicism, I recommend looking into organizations like these. You might not want to join them but they will give you a model for traditional Catholicism that embraces loyalty to the Pope.

 

[Jason_NC]

Thank you for the information floresco.

 

[Prie_dieu]

Every person in western civilisation should have a knowledge of Latin whether they’re Catholic or not. It is the language of our patrimony. Protestants should know Latin to convert them, Catholics should know Latin to confirm them. By all means learn Latin even for its own sake. Learn Latin all the more for its place in the Church. The Holy Fathers have successively and repeatedly called for us to develop a knowledge of Latin in our simple prayers, for the Church and society to preserve the language, etc.

Also “traditional Catholicism” isn’t for those who have “graduated”. If you’e interested in traditional prayers and devotions, theology, the traditional Mass, etc., then explore it. These are not off limit to you. You don’t need to do 3 years of Ordinary Form until doing a semester abroad in the Extraordinary Form.

Avoid falling into the wars of “traditionalists” vs “modernists”. Be a Catholic. And a Catholic can love the Extraordinary Form, can say his Office in Latin, will pray his rosary every day, will fall in love with Thomistic philosophy and will rediscover its beautifly expounded by Garrigou-Lagrange, A Modernist is not a Catholic; a Catholic has no real need to label themselves a traditionalist though it’s understandable why they do.

Just be Catholic. And I’m sure you’ll find that a lot of the traditional practises you are attracted to are just that. Catholic.

Ad Jesum per Mariam!
Prie-dieu.

 

[Jason_NC]

Every person in western civilisation should have a knowledge of Latin whether they’re Catholic or not. It is the language of our patrimony. Protestants should know Latin to convert them, Catholics should know Latin to confirm them. By all means learn Latin even for its own sake. Learn Latin all the more for its place in the Church. The Holy Fathers have successively and repeatedly called for us to develop a knowledge of Latin in our simple prayers, for the Church and society to preserve the language, etc.

Also “traditional Catholicism” isn’t for those who have “graduated”. If you’e interested in traditional prayers and devotions, theology, the traditional Mass, etc., then explore it. These are not off limit to you. You don’t need to do 3 years of Ordinary Form until doing a semester abroad in the Extraordinary Form.

Avoid falling into the wars of “traditionalists” vs “modernists”. Be a Catholic. And a Catholic can love the Extraordinary Form, can say his Office in Latin, will pray his rosary every day, will fall in love with Thomistic philosophy and will rediscover its beautifly expounded by Garrigou-Lagrange, A Modernist is not a Catholic; a Catholic has no real need to label themselves a traditionalist though it’s understandable why they do.

Just be Catholic. And I’m sure you’ll find that a lot of the traditional practises you are attracted to are just that. Catholic.

Ad Jesum per Mariam!
Prie-dieu.

Thank you for the reply and I’m sorry for the late response. I’ve been busy on various personal matters.