RCIA "team"

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We over all have a very good RCIA program, but I have a problem with one aspect of it-a BIG problem and maybe I am being overly critical.

4 years ago we had someone go through RCIA who was a Lutheran-Missouri Synod. Her father is a pastor. She teaches at our school. She is very learned about our faith and contributes alot to our sessions. Here’s the problem - that Easter she chose to not come into the Church, She came back to the team at the request of the , then Pastor and director the following year. NO problem I figured that there was something I did not know or understand. She has been a part of the program since. Not joining our Church. She has gotton divorced (2 or 3 years ago) so this is not the problem. She regularly comes to our Church on Sundays & Holy Days. She comes to adoration on occasion.

I have spoken to our current Priest about this, shrugs…and to the director about her possible conversion… the director does not really know what the problem is…

She is a good person, and as I said a good team member EXCEPT how can she teach or contribute faithfully what she appears to not embrace fully?

Is this any of my business? I got of the team but this year I am being asked to be a sponsor to a young person who really wants me to walk with him on his journey…HELP
 
Not all teachers in Religious Schools are Catholic either. I suppose as long as she is accurately teaching the Faith, and the priests/pastor has no problem, then there is none.
 
Sometimes this sort of thing happens. There could be a number of reasons why she refuses to convert. Ultimately they’d all be foolish reasons, but speaking from experience (former LCMS myself) it’s HARD to deal with the flak (sometimes it’s a lot worse than polemics. Some converts have been disinherited, lost health and auto insurance, and lost all support at home) that comes from relatives, especially those relatives who are LCMS ministers. I waited until I was out of my parents’ home to convert, not because they explicitly forbade me to convert, but because I know it would have been very difficult for them to deal with, and consequently difficult for me to deal with.

There’s a young woman who attends the chant Mass at Gonzaga who’s in this situation at the moment. She’s Lutheran, yet attends daily Mass and Chant Mass, and I believe she’s even been spotted at Adoration. She wants to convert, but she doesn’t want to “rush” into anything.

Even though the behavior of these two women may seem a little bizarre, just be patient and pray. You might even see about having a priest offer a Mass for her conversion --yes, this can be done-- and the conversion of her household. Who knows, her father might someday be a priest… and THAT would be pretty spiffy.
 
Dear Debi,

YOU WROTE: “how can she teach or contribute faithfully what she appears to not embrace fully?”

There are many Catholics who do not fully embrace the faith.
Be patient. Sponsor the individual and enjoy.
 
She of course could not be a certified Catechist on the RCIA team, but could be a guest speaker. Not being a Catholic would keep her from actually being a member of the RCIA team.
 
What would a catechumen think? Would they think that one church is as good as the other? The first thing I would ask this leader if I were a catechumen is “why are you not Catholic?” or “Why should I become a Catholic if you think it’s ok not to be?” What kind or answer would she give?
 
Poisson: I suspect that a catechumen might ask somewhat the same questions; perhaps with a slightly different twist or inflection. From My work in RCIA, I have found that not everyone there at the beginning is fully committed to becoming Catholic; they are exploring. And they may be having similar struggles to hers.

It seems to me that she could offer much, potentially, to the RCIA program, but it would also be easy to assume that she was Catholic. Having her there as an apparant member of the team makes me a little uncomfortable, to the extent that she has not converted; in particular if she does not make that clear at the beginning of the sessions. Just my opinion. 👍
 
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debi:
We over all have a very good RCIA program, but I have a problem with one aspect of it-a BIG problem and maybe I am being overly critical.

4 years ago we had someone go through RCIA who was a Lutheran-Missouri Synod. Her father is a pastor. She teaches at our school. She is very learned about our faith and contributes alot to our sessions. Here’s the problem - that Easter she chose to not come into the Church, She came back to the team at the request of the , then Pastor and director the following year. NO problem I figured that there was something I did not know or understand. She has been a part of the program since. Not joining our Church. She has gotton divorced (2 or 3 years ago) so this is not the problem. She regularly comes to our Church on Sundays & Holy Days. She comes to adoration on occasion.

I have spoken to our current Priest about this, shrugs…and to the director about her possible conversion… the director does not really know what the problem is…

She is a good person, and as I said a good team member EXCEPT how can she teach or contribute faithfully what she appears to not embrace fully?

Is this any of my business? I got of the team but this year I am being asked to be a sponsor to a young person who really wants me to walk with him on his journey…HELP
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Yes it is your business. You should talk to her about it, as outside the Catholic Church there is no salvation, defined three times by the Church infallibly (a part of one of these declarations is in my signature–it is clear enough). God bless.
 
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deogratias:
Not all teachers in Religious Schools are Catholic either. I suppose as long as she is accurately teaching the Faith, and the priests/pastor has no problem, then there is none.
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Only problem: she can’t go to Heaven :eek:
 
EENS - your quotation in your signature -

Would you say everthing in that Papal Bull is infallible teaching or just what one picks and chooses?

If everything in the Bull is infallible, then how would you deal with this?
Therefore, it commands all who glory in the name of Christian, at whatever time, before or after baptism, to cease entirely from circumcision, since, whether or not one places hope in it, it cannot be observed at all without the loss of eternal salvation.
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And let’s give the entire paragraph of your signature while we are at it.

**
The Most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews, and heretics, and schismatics
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**, can ever be partakers of eternal life, but that they are to go into the eternal fire “which was prepared for the devil, and his angels,” (Mt. 25:41) unless before death they are joined with Her; and that so important is the unity of this Ecclesiastical Body, that only those remaining within this unity can profit from the sacraments of the Church unto salvation, and that they alone can receive an eternal recompense for their fasts, alms deeds, and other works of Christian piety and duties of a Christian soldier. No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, no one, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved unless they abide within the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church.
 
Br. Rich SFO:
She of course could not be a certified Catechist on the RCIA team, but could be a guest speaker. Not being a Catholic would keep her from actually being a member of the RCIA team.
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Should or ought; unfortunately it may not. :banghead:
 
Rite of Christian Initiation of Adults, which is the rite used for people who are joining the Church.

While the Rite contains the specific rubrics used during the Mass at specific times during the process they go through, and anticipates their final part on Holy Saturday Night through baptism, (and the joining of those already baptised), the term RCIA is also used for the period of instructions which the Catechumens (those not baptised) and Candidates (those with a baptism recognized by the Chruch) go through.

Although I am not aware of the Rite being scrutinized in terms of any change, there is some discussion as to how the instructional part should be based.
 
Having just completed an 8 week course for RCIA coordinators, perhaps this woman was not able to come into the Church due to some marriage irregularities…that would not be something the pastor would share with anyone, I am sure. If that is the case, she should certainly remain in the RCIA, but as a team member? I would think that her example of patience and waiting would be a trememdous witness to others, but obviously, only if the story is shared with all :)…

If she has elected to wait, is not ready to take the next step, then she should certainly be welcomed to remain in RCIA, and even as a team member, as long as she is not in a catechetical role…if a team member is not eligible to be a sponsor and/or godparent, then I would hesitate putting them in a position of “teaching” matters of faith or reflection and discerment (such as breaking open the Word sessions). While I will agree that not all Catholics embrace and pass on the faith, that is not a reason to have non-Catholics do it instead,and while the pastoral part of me says keep her involved whatever it takes, what are her needs, etc. I would be concerned about compromising the faith formation of others in the program by having her as a team member.

Ultimately, it is the pastor/director’s decision to make, and should in no way inhibit a person’s call to sponsor someone…under the circumstances, the inquirer/candidate/pre-catechumen probably needs a sponsor who is strong in the faith… God bless, and please let us how it works out!

Peace…
 
I know what RCIA is, but I have no idea what an “RCIA team” is. I’ve just re-read the RCIA and there is no mention of a “team”. I might have missed something, though.
 
I agree that many Catholics do not fully embrace the faith. I also don’t see why those Catholics should be placed in positions which are responsible for passing on that very Faith they do not hold.
 
Théodred:
I know what RCIA is, but I have no idea what an “RCIA team” is. I’ve just re-read the RCIA and there is no mention of a “team”. I might have missed something, though.
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RCIA has many aspects to it and in reality the whole parish must be involved. A “team” would be made up of someone who coordinates the whole process, someone who handles refreshments, room setup, liturgies, minor rites, communications (buletin and newspaper), inquiry and interviews, Sponsor coordinator, Catechists, the larger reception after the Easter vigil, Mystagogy, someone who coordinates the dissmissal and the Catechists who lead theScripture discussion. Different people all handle each of these jobs and some positions like Catechists there are 5 or 6 different people.
 
**The Most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews, and heretics, and **schismatics, can ever be partakers of eternal life, but that they are to go into the eternal fire “which was prepared for the devil, and his angels,” (Mt. 25:41) unless before death they are joined with Her; and that so important is the unity of this Ecclesiastical Body, that only those remaining within this unity can profit from the sacraments of the Church unto salvation, and that they alone can receive an eternal recompense for their fasts, alms deeds, and other works of Christian piety and duties of a Christian soldier. No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, no one, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved unless they abide within the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church.
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Yes, I pretty much know the whole section by heart; however, it would not all fit in my signature… Furthermore, I am not a schismatic.

BTW, it’s not a Papal Bull… it’s a COUNCIL, as Vatican I said, when making a declaration on faith an eccumenical Council (which Florence was) is infallible.
 
The RCIA team is that group of people commissioned by the parish, led by the pastor or his designate, to handle catechesis of those adults (over age of reason) who desire to join the Catholic Church, whether they are catechumens (never baptized) or candidates (baptized Christians exploring full communion with the Catholic church). The team consists of catechists, who are always required to be living in conformity with Church teaching, including the laws on marriage and to have been educated in sound doctrine. The team should have one member, priest or deacon, who handles the liturgy aspects of the rites, and who provides pastoral counselling for the catechumens and candidates. The team also can include hospitality people, A-V assistance, publicity & communications and other support, and these people may still be working out issue that prevent full communion. Not fully initiated Catholics, civil marriage or other marriage situation in the process of being resolved etc. RCIA is a process with defined periods punctuated by certain liturgical rites, culminating in the sacraments of initiation (baptism, confirmation and/or eucharist). It requires catechesis, that is teaching and study, but is not limited to a class. It is a process of conversion, facilitated by catechists and team members and the entire parish. It takes as long as it takes. The pastor is responsible for pastoral concerns, including matters of the confessional, and the candidate does not need to tell the whole story to other team members.
 
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