Real-life dilemma about vaccines

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JohnsonJJ said:
I will continue speak out against the MORTAL SIN of being an accessory to abortion by giving consent to vaccines derived from aborted fetal tissue.
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When it comes to vaccines, you are contradicting the Church, so you shouldn’t say you stand with her.
 
You can hold that opinion for yourself alone. It is not a sin of any kind, even venial, for everyone else. This simply is not Church teaching, merely your personal opinion.
 
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She should discuss the moral aspects of this with a priest.
It´s good to know that the Church teaches abortion to be a mortal sin - and supporting it isn´t a good idea either. But really, ask a priest.
 
Fortunately, the Church has been very clear that it is acceptable to get vaccines from fetal cell lines if no other options exist.
 
I absolutely am not. And you are accusing the Church herself of that. What you have stated is not what the Church teaches.
 
Can you copy-paste a quote from a document where the Church says so?
 
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From the NCBS:

https://www.ncbcenter.org/resources/frequently-asked-questions/use-vaccines/#alternatives

What is the Church’s teaching about the use of certain vaccines that have a distant historical association with abortion?

There are a number of vaccines that are made in descendent cells of aborted fetuses. Abortion is a grave crime against innocent human life. We should always ask our physician whether the product he proposes for our use has an historical association with abortion. We should use an alternative vaccine if one is available.

What does one do if a physician recommends one of these vaccines?

Sometimes alternative products, which are not associated with these cell lines, are available for immunization against certain diseases. For example, there is a rabies vaccine (RabAvert) and a single dose mumps vaccine (Mumpsvax) without any association with abortion that are equally safe and effective. If doing so is practical, you should ask your physician to use an alternative vaccine, but there is no moral obligation to use products that are less effective or inaccessible. Parents should check with their physician regarding the efficacy and availability of these and any other vaccine.

What support is there in Church teaching for this position?

A statement from the Pontifical Academy for Life issued in 2005 holds that one may use these products, despite their distant association with abortion, at least until such time as new vaccines become available. The Vatican instruction Dignitas Personae (#35) states that “grave reasons may be morally proportionate to justify” the use of these products, “for example, danger to the health of children could permit parents to use a vaccine which was developed using cell lines of illicit origin, while keeping in mind that everyone has the duty to make known their disagreement and to ask that their healthcare system make other types of vaccines available.”
 
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Everyone should get vaccinated. It has saved millions of souls.
 
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JohnsonJJ said:
In the link you posted, the Catholic Church does not infallibly teach that God gives anyone the right to take advantage of a murdered baby.
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"A statement from the Pontifical Academy for Life issued in 2005 holds that one may use these products, despite their distant association with abortion, at least until such time as new vaccines become available. The Vatican instruction Dignitas Personae (#35) states that “grave reasons may be morally proportionate to justify” the use of these products, “for example, danger to the health of children could permit parents to use a vaccine which was developed using cell lines of illicit origin, while keeping in mind that everyone has the duty to make known their disagreement and to ask that their healthcare system make other types of vaccines available.”
 
Nor does it teach that there is any sin in receiving the vaccine. In fact, it says the good of the vaccine means that this very remote cooperation can be justified.

Please do not make it sound as if babies are being aborted and their cells used for vaccines. The current vaccines are descendants of cells from those 40-year-old fetal cells —they are not actual fetal cells themselves.
 
Kima said:
Can you copy-paste a quote from a document where the Church says so?
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http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/c...cfaith_doc_20081208_dignitas-personae_en.html

Thus, for example, danger to the health of children could permit parents to use a vaccine which was developed using cell lines of illicit origin, while keeping in mind that everyone has the duty to make known their disagreement and to ask that their healthcare system make other types of vaccines available. Moreover, in organizations where cell lines of illicit origin are being utilized, the responsibility of those who make the decision to use them is not the same as that of those who have no voice in such a decision.
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https://www.ncbcenter.org/index.php/download_file/view/33/182/

(This is linked by the NCBC, but is to a Vatican document.)

This Pontifical Academy for Life, carrying out the commission entrusted to us by the Congregation for the Doctrine of Faith, in answer to your request, has proceeded to a careful examination of the question of these “tainted” vaccines…
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As regards the diseases against which there are no alternative vaccines which are available and ethically acceptable, it is right to abstain from using these vaccines if it can be done without causing children, and indirectly the population as a whole, to undergo significant risks to their health. However, if the latter are exposed to considerable dangers to their health, vaccines with moral problems pertaining to them may also be used on a temporary basis. The moral reason is that the duty to avoid passive material cooperation is not obligatory if there is grave inconvenience. Moreover, we find, in such a case, a proportional reason, in order to accept the use of these vaccines in the presence of the danger of favouring the spread of the pathological agent, due to the lack of vaccination of children.
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the lawfulness of the use of these vaccines should not be misinterpreted as a declaration of the lawfulness of their production, marketing and use, but is to be understood as being a passive material cooperation and, in its mildest and remotest sense, also active, morally justified as an extrema ratio due to the necessity to provide for the good of one’s children and of the people who come in contact with the children (pregnant women);
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The second document is a very in depth study reviewing the cooperation of people who receive the vaccine or have their children receive them.

Broader discussion on the topic from the National Catholic Bioethics Center: https://www.ncbcenter.org/resources/frequently-asked-questions/use-vaccines/#ChurchTeaching
 
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JohnsonJJ said:
The Catholic Church does not teach that babies can be murdered so you can use their cells to be vaccinated with. Abortion is murder and to support this GENOCIDE is a MORTAL SIN .
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Also from the NCBC:
Won’t my use of these vaccines encourage others to destroy human life for research purposes?

Upon use, one should register a complaint with the manufacturer of the products as an acceptable form of conscientious objection. This signals opposition to the wider, morally reprehensible practice of using the unborn as little more than research material for science.

It should be obvious that vaccine use in these cases does not contribute directly to the practice of abortion since the reasons for having an abortion are not related to vaccine preparation.
 
Fortunately, I think enough correct information has been posted here now so that anyone reading this thread will understand your opinion is not that of the Church.
 
My conscience tells me so as well.
I believe we should follow the natural laws which we know in our hearts of what is really right and wrong.

For instance I didn´t know using fetal cells in vaccines were an actual thing until I got on this thread - how awful and disgusting of humans to do to eachother!! I won´t take a vaccine with anything like that ever again!
 
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