Reasons not to be Catholic?

[Bettan89]

I’ve seen a lot of sites on the Internet arguing why one should not become a Catholic. But then I’ve never seen what they think you should be instead. To me it seems like if the Catholic church is not the Church founded by Christ, then the Truth has not been preserved in any church. Because historically, the Catholic church is the first church, and everyone else have broken up from this one, at least that’s my knowledge. So if I seek to find The Church and The Truth, and I for some reason have found the Catholic church not to be the One, then whitch church should I go to??

Therefore I wonder if anyone who is not a Catholic or anyone who has converted from the Catholic church to another church could tell me which church you believe is the true one? Because I strongly want to believe that Christ has preserved His Truth along history, and if the Catholic church bears the Truth, then I see no reasons why one should not belong to it.

A lot of people make their choice of church based on which church best suits their beliefs and interests. But IF their is a Truth, then does it really matter what I think? I would rather obey to the Truth of the Lord than seeking the church with the best priest, songs or people.

 

[JonNC]

=Bettan89;7791770]I’ve seen a lot of sites on the Internet arguing why one should not become a Catholic. But then I’ve never seen what they think you should be instead. To me it seems like if the Catholic church is not the Church founded by Christ, then the Truth has not been preserved in any church. Because historically, the Catholic church is the first church, and everyone else have broken up from this one, at least that’s my knowledge. So if I seek to find The Church and The Truth, and I for some reason have found the Catholic church not to be the One, then whitch church should I go to??

Welcome to CAF. As a Lutheran, you know that we understand the Church to be the congregation of believers, where the word is preached and the sacraments are administered.
Also, I think the Orthodox here will say that the CC broke away from the one true Church.
Therefore, to answer your question, as a Lutheran, I would say prayerfully consider where the Holy Spirit leads you to be. That might well be the Catholic Church, and if it is, then I believe you will be blessed in word and sacrament there.

Therefore I wonder if anyone who is not a Catholic or anyone who has converted from the Catholic church to another church could tell me which church you believe is the true one? Because I strongly want to believe that Christ has preserved His Truth along history, and if the Catholic church bears the Truth, then I see no reasons why one should not belong to it.

I agree, if that is where the Spirit is leading you, if that is what you truly believe.

A lot of people make their choice of church based on which church best suits their beliefs and interests. But IF their is a Truth, then does it really matter what I think? I would rather obey to the Truth of the Lord than seeking the church with the best priest, songs or people.

Agreed. The you should, by all means, enter RCIA.

Jon

 

[Iuventus]

I am a Catholic, new to CAF, and I would just like to say that I do enjoy talking with Protestants, because we are both trying very hard to stay true to the same Person. It is a great tragedy that we have confusion amongst ourselves, but we have hope that Christ will not abandon us.

JohnNC:

I think the Orthodox here will say that the CC broke away from the one true Church.

While it may be true that the Orthodox say the Catholic Church broke away from the one true Church, I know that the Catholic Church says the same thing about the Orthodox Church, and indeed all Protestantism. So the question remains: “Who’s right?” Did Catholicism betray the Church? Did Orthodoxy? How about Lutheranism? If they are all different, then which one contains the fullness of the Truth about Christ? This is the very question that Bettan89 wishes to raise, I think.

A lot of people make their choice of church based on which church best suits their beliefs and interests. But IF their is a Truth, then does it really matter what I think? I would rather obey to the Truth of the Lord than seeking the church with the best priest, songs or people.

Focusing on the objective reality, Truth, and not our subjective tastes is exactly the right way to approach this question.

Bettan89, I know you asked for reasons NOT to enter the Catholic Church, but if you don’t mind, I will try to give a reason to enter the Catholic Church

You said yourself, that the Catholic Church was the first Church. That means that it was at one point the only Church. And as we all know from John 17:20-21, at the Last Supper, Christ besought the Father that all believers in Him should be one. When Christ asks the Father for things, the Father usually grants them. So if the Catholic Church was at one point the only Church in existence, then it must have been the true Church.

Now some may argue that the Catholic Church has deviated from its once true position. For me to argue all the ways in which the CC today teaches the same things it taught in the early days would go far beyond the scope of this post. If you want to bring up a question in particular, feel free, and I or some other Catholic will endeavor to respond accurately.

The Catholic Church’s continuity of teaching throughout 2,000 years of stormy history is to me a very palpable sign of the presence of the Holy Spirit in a very special way.

On the other hand, just look at the doctrinal contradictions among the many Protestant denominations. When Dr. Luther nailed his 95 Theses to the door of the Church in Wittenburg in 1517, there was set off a chain of splinter churches who disagreed on many fundamental tenets of Christian doctrine. This disagreement was palpable even in Luther’s day. Prince Phillip of Hesse called Luther, Calvin and Zwingli, three of the most influential reformers of the day (who by that time were calling themselves Protestants) to the Council of Marburg in 1529, in the hopes of resolving their disagreements. However, they couldn’t even agree, among other things, as to whether or not Christ is really present in the bread and wine. Luther famously inscribed the words from Matthew 14:22 (“THIS IS MY BODY”) in chalk on his desk to show how firmly he believed in the real presence. But a consensus was never reached. I don’t know about you, but the question of whether Christ is truly present in the consecrated bread and wine is a rather significant question that needs a clear answer for the Christian life.

But let’s take a step back and look at this in perspective. If we say that Christ founded one Church which then fell off the rails and no longer exists, what are we saying about Christ’s ability to found a Church? In Matthew 16:18, (a passage we Catholics like to use to defend the institution of the Papacy, but I am not directly addressing that issue at the moment) Christ said that the gates of hell would not prevail against his Church. If Christ intended his Church to survive even the powers of hell, he certainly knows how to get the job done. After all, he is God

The existence of many “churches” is a huge tragedy. It is contrary to Christ’s prayer to the Father at the Last Supper (Jn 17:20-21), and it is a cause of scandal to those who don’t believe in Christ (see Romans 2:24). As brothers and sisters in Christ, we need to drop our pride and our jealousy of one another so that we may together embark on a journey of faith that will lead us to the one Christ and the fullness of his Truth.

But we are not alone in this quest, for in doing so, we are doing the will of Christ and Christ himself will aid us.

May God bless all on this thread.

Iuventus

 

[Iuventus]

P.S. Happy Easter!!

 

[Nicea325]

I’ve seen a lot of sites on the Internet arguing why one should not become a Catholic. But then I’ve never seen what they think you should be instead. To me it seems like if the Catholic church is not the Church founded by Christ, then the Truth has not been preserved in any church. Because historically, the Catholic church is the first church, and everyone else have broken up from this one, at least that’s my knowledge. So if I seek to find The Church and The Truth, and I for some reason have found the Catholic church not to be the One, then whitch church should I go to??

Therefore I wonder if anyone who is not a Catholic or anyone who has converted from the Catholic church to another church could tell me which church you believe is the true one? Because I strongly want to believe that Christ has preserved His Truth along history, and if the Catholic church bears the Truth, then I see no reasons why one should not belong to it.

A lot of people make their choice of church based on which church best suits their beliefs and interests. But IF their is a Truth, then does it really matter what I think? I would rather obey to the Truth of the Lord than seeking the church with the best priest, songs or people.

To be honest,those websites stating reasons not be Catholic merely offer an opinion. I too offer tons of reasons not join this group or that group. Listen to your heart,not others.

God Bless

 

[GaryTaylor]

P.S. Happy Easter!!

I don’t know any GOOD reason not to be Catholic. I do see a lot a bad reasons which I believe is not mans better thinking and Pride to a great deal. I don’t how the idea of not having a Universal Church on earth for all Christisna is not the better thinking.

God Bless, Gary

 

[cheese_sdc]

Therefore I wonder if anyone who is not a Catholic or anyone who has converted from the Catholic church to another church could tell me which church you believe is the true one?

I don’t believe any religion/denomination is the “true” one.

 

[GaryTaylor]

I don’t believe any religion/denomination is the “true” one.

Should this statement be true, then this would mean there is no Truth. Being that Jesus Christ is the Sovereign Truth and He established His church through His Apostles who were given the Truth through Jesus Christ. Then His church established on earth is the Truth.

How could it be otherwise?

God Bless, Gary

 

[JonNC]

=Iuventus;7792152]I am a Catholic, new to CAF, and I would just like to say that I do enjoy talking with Protestants, because we are both trying very hard to stay true to the same Person. It is a great tragedy that we have confusion amongst ourselves, but we have hope that Christ will not abandon us.

Welcome to CAF, and I agree with these sentiments.

While it may be true that the Orthodox say the Catholic Church broke away from the one true Church, I know that the Catholic Church says the same thing about the Orthodox Church, and indeed all Protestantism. So the question remains: “Who’s right?” Did Catholicism betray the Church? Did Orthodoxy? How about Lutheranism? If they are all different, then which one contains the fullness of the Truth about Christ? This is the very question that Bettan89 wishes to raise, I think.

This is what I know for sure, that certainly the Church Triumphant has the fullness of truth. That amongst us in the Church Militant, there is indeed confusion and division, so that it is hard to know with certainty which, if any institutional organization has and preaches the fullness of truth.
That is why my encouragement to Bettan89 is to seek out, if he chooses, the teaching of the Catholic, Orthodox and any other communion. And if the one he chooses turns out to have error mixed with truth, that he recognize that our God is a merciful God, who understnads and forgives our weaknesses.

The existence of many “churches” is a huge tragedy. It is contrary to Christ’s prayer to the Father at the Last Supper (Jn 17:20-21), and it is a cause of scandal to those who don’t believe in Christ (see Romans 2:24). As brothers and sisters in Christ, we need to drop our pride and our jealousy of one another so that we may together embark on a journey of faith that will lead us to the one Christ and the fullness of his Truth.

But we are not alone in this quest, for in doing so, we are doing the will of Christ and Christ himself will aid us.

I completely agree.

May God bless all on this thread.

And also you,
Jon

 

[Bettan89]

Thanks for the responses.

To me the question about the true Church has become a really essential one in the light of the holy Communion. In order for the transition of the bread and wine into the body and blood of Christ to fully work, the priest has to be accurately consecrated/sacred. (sorry if I use the wrong expressions, English is not my native language, but I hope you understand what I mean) This then comes back to the apostolic succession of the bishops. Is it possible that both the Lutheran, Orthodox and Catholic churches have validly consecrated/sacred bishops?

One thing I know for sure, and that is that not all of the bishops in the Swedish Lutheran Church are valid. Unfortunately, in Sweden today it seems like anyone may become a priest, even women. Therefore I’ve started to doubt that the Communion in the church I currently attend is valid. And if it isn’t, then I can’t see how I can go on attending this church any more. It is really important for me that I recieve the body of Christ for real, not just for the purpose of memorising his death. Jesus didn’t establish the Communion only to be in memory of his death; he meant that it really turns into his body and blood every time the Mass is celebrated. If it DOES work in the Lutheran church as well, then why doesn’t lutherans pray to the tabernacle? To me it seems logical that Catholics do that, if it really is Jesus then why not? We do actually have a tabernacle in my church, but it seems to be merely for storing of the bread (or Jesus?) after the Mass…

Ps. I’m a girl. My name is Elisabeth. Bettan is a swedish nickname for this, but I’m called Beth in English.

 

[icamay]

I use to believe among the Universalists, who believe that you seek the religion which best fits you. I had a very uncomfortable “come to Jesus” experience with the Holy Spirit, and it was brought to my attention that I am not God, and my opinions do not count. Then, my spritual experience told me to seek out the one place I never allowed myself to venture - the Roman Catholic church. That is why I am converting. You can believe that, you can choose not to believe that, but it is the truth.

Now, how to explain this to my non- (and sometimes anti-) Catholic family?

I am blessed with some very good friends in my life who know that I do not tell stories. When I told the above account to one (not a Catholic), he said “you will be persecuted for the Truth. Jesus told us so. Just be prepared - this won’t be as easy as you like it to be.”

 

[cheese_sdc]

Should this statement be true, then this would mean there is no Truth.

No necessarily. It could be that we just haven’t figured it out yet.

 

[GaryTaylor]

No necessarily. It could be that we just haven’t figured it out yet.

But wouldn’t the original Truth from Christ and His Apostles bought Jesus Christs teachings into the first few generations which is well documentet no?

 

[Rawb]

I hesitate to post this. I’m not debating religion this weekend, there are more important things. Christ is entombed and we are in mourning yet awaiting His glorious Resurrection tonight. Still, I believe I can post this in a way that is only uplifting and supportive, which is all I’ve been trying to do this weekend.

I was Roman Catholic. I was devout Roman Catholic. I attended the Tridentine Mass, prayed the rosary (in Latin even). I tried to start college Catholic groups in my hometown. I studied my faith and I did know it. I loved and still do love the Catholic Church.

But my faith is weak. I couldn’t be part of a church that doesn’t help me to practice what she claims to teach. I didn’t understand why so much has been lost since Vatican II, and nobody had a very good answer for me. Still I tried to remain loyal to Rome. For a year or more I endured homilies that were either condemning of Rome and hardline traditional (a memorable one praised the Tea Party from the pulpit) and outright blasphemous. I ignored the hideous churches, void of sacred architecture and not in any way catechetical.

My Orthodox friend was patient. He never tried to get me to convert, until one night I burst out on him all my frustrations. He finally told me the only true way to explore Orthodoxy - “Come and See”. I went and saw a church where everyone acted respectfully towards Holy Communion. Where the priest didn’t shy away from his authority, and yet is funny and approachable. Where everyone talks about Christ and faith, even the men (of whom there are no shortage). Where popular piety hasn’t been abandoned.

Yet I wasn’t going to abandon Rome without doctrinal foundation. If Papal Infallibility fell apart, so does the Catholic Church. So I went to the Early Fathers. I didn’t find any quote definitive of Papal Infallibility or universal jurisdiction save perhaps one. One quote does not a doctrine make, and neither does it help that the man was known for writing in flowery language and was trying to suck up to Rome at the time.

It was very, very, very difficult to leave the Roman Catholic Church. I’ll freely admit to having cried. It was difficult to enter Orthodoxy, which at times seemed strange. Yet here I am, the journey over halfway over, and I couldn’t imagine not making prostrations, not venerating the icons when I enter, not being part of that popular piety.

There is a Western Bias in our culture that Orthodoxy left Catholicism, but from our perspective it was quite the opposite. There were Five Patriarchs and they divided into two groups of one and four. Who left who? Nevertheless I am infinitely grateful for the multitude of things I learned from Catholicism, a mother on my way to my true home.

So why am I not Catholic any longer? Because I found Christ’s True Church, a modern, historical, spiritual, rational, sin-loathing yet compassionate Church, preserved by the Holy Spirit from any innovation for 2,000 Years. May we all have a blessed Pascha.

 

[fhansen]

I’ve seen a lot of sites on the Internet arguing why one should not become a Catholic. But then I’ve never seen what they think you should be instead. To me it seems like if the Catholic church is not the Church founded by Christ, then the Truth has not been preserved in any church. Because historically, the Catholic church is the first church, and everyone else have broken up from this one, at least that’s my knowledge. So if I seek to find The Church and The Truth, and I for some reason have found the Catholic church not to be the One, then whitch church should I go to??

Therefore I wonder if anyone who is not a Catholic or anyone who has converted from the Catholic church to another church could tell me which church you believe is the true one? Because I strongly want to believe that Christ has preserved His Truth along history, and if the Catholic church bears the Truth, then I see no reasons why one should not belong to it.

A lot of people make their choice of church based on which church best suits their beliefs and interests. But IF their is a Truth, then does it really matter what I think? I would rather obey to the Truth of the Lord than seeking the church with the best priest, songs or people.

I was Protestant and converted to Catholicism (actually reverted). As non-Catholic churches often divided over theology and none could logically claim a direct historical relationship to the early church, it eventually became apparent that, whether I liked the idea or not, the only Churches that could lay legitimate claim to the title were the Roman Catholic and Orthodox Churches.

 

[AmateurPianist]

Therefore I wonder if anyone who is not a Catholic or anyone who has converted from the Catholic church to another church could tell me which church you believe is the true one? Because I strongly want to believe that Christ has preserved His Truth along history, and if the Catholic church bears the Truth, then I see no reasons why one should not belong to it.

Logically the only reason why I would stop attending my current fellowship and start attending another one would be if I were to believe the new one is superior to the existing one. That I think would be the case for anybody who changes one organization for another one.

If I believed that God selects one and only one Christian organization to “bear the Truth” (thereby excluding all other organizations), then of course I would want to be a part of the organization that God favours.

I have absolutely zero reasons to believe that this is actually what God is doing.

This type of question (why aren’t you us) pops up frequently on these forums. If I think about it, I find this type of question a little “off-putting” because I don’t know why one would ask this question outside of the assumption that one’s “us” is superior to the other’s “not us”.

 

[cheese_sdc]

But wouldn’t the original Truth from Christ and His Apostles bought Jesus Christs teachings into the first few generations which is well documentet no?

I don’t want to open that bag, not on your holiest of days. Enjoy your Easter.

 

[AmieLynn]

Because the new trend to church shop until one finds the church that they “feel comfortable” in or “enjoy the short service” cause don’t you know todays society is all about the fast easy path to instant gratification.

OTOH the Catholic Church is has a path to initiation that takes months so becoming a Catholic is not able to be done on a whim.

For every reason to “not be Catholic” there are many many reasons to be Catholic.

 

[babylonsfalling]

I’ve seen a lot of sites on the Internet arguing why one should not become a Catholic. But then I’ve never seen what they think you should be instead. To me it seems like if the Catholic church is not the Church founded by Christ, then the Truth has not been preserved in any church. Because historically, the Catholic church is the first church, and everyone else have broken up from this one, at least that’s my knowledge. So if I seek to find The Church and The Truth, and I for some reason have found the Catholic church not to be the One, then whitch church should I go to??

Therefore I wonder if anyone who is not a Catholic or anyone who has converted from the Catholic church to another church could tell me which church you believe is the true one? Because I strongly want to believe that Christ has preserved His Truth along history, and if the Catholic church bears the Truth, then I see no reasons why one should not belong to it.

A lot of people make their choice of church based on which church best suits their beliefs and interests. But IF their is a Truth, then does it really matter what I think? I would rather obey to the Truth of the Lord than seeking the church with the best priest, songs or people.

Most of those people would tell you that the Christian Church is the true church, meaning all churches which are legitimate, and they would probably say that the Catholic Church doesn’t qualify as legitimate.

If you believe your current church is teaching the truth, then you’re in the right church and you’re right that the truth is more important than songs, people and priests.

Those who are telling you not to be catholic are just trying to get others to share their contempt of RCC, probably so they feel better about being so full of contempt in the first place. After all, if they can get everyone hate RCC, then it’s easier for the initial haters to feel better and correct about their hatred…strength in numbers kind of thing. And in truth, most of these anti catholics are just ex-catholics on an insecurity-trip over leaving the church. All their “noise” is more for their benefit than anyone elses.

 

[jesuspsr]

Pray to the Holy Spirit for guidance