Received a rose but specific request rejected?

[houston1]

Well, first realize that we’ve all been there. Sometimes we’re just so in love with the Church that we go overboard…yes, you CAN go overboard. Everyone knows someone at their parish who trots along after the priest, who has to consulted or pouts whenever a new committee is formed, who has to be the one who decided what fabrics will be used, who has to run all the social events, who has to sing louder, prayer faster, jump in FIRST in communal prayer…etc.
The prince of lies would have us think that we are being uber faithful. While he sits back and giggles.
We’ve all been there. Don’t be too hard on yourself. My late husband was chronically unemployed. 13 years. I prayed that St. Joseph Novena to death…no pun intended. He died before he ever got a job. It was so dog-eared I had it laminated.
It just didn’t work. Not because St. Joseph didn’t pray for me…because the person who would have received the help didn’t want it.
Years later, my prayer was answered in another way…St. Joseph introduced me to a Joseph…my present husband.
There’s a calling for everyone. Some are called to pray and be contemplatives. Some are called to police the silver. Find the one that suits your particular talents. You certainly have a love of the Lord and a strong desire to serve. Just be “small” about it. You will find far more joy in it. FAR more joy…
Peace, dear one!

Thanks again. You certainly understand the dynamics of parish life. I really appreciate your sharing your encouraging story of how St. Joseph answered your prayer. I am ready let go and move on . . . .

houston1

 

[pianistclare]

Thanks again. You certainly understand the dynamics of parish life. I really appreciate your sharing your encouraging story of how St. Joseph answered your prayer. I am ready let go and move on . . . .

houston1

God bless you. I have a suggestion even though you didn’t ask me:
I have always been employed by the church. It’s been my experience that priests don’t really need more “religious” items. They are deluged with them from well-wishing parishioners.
Often, these things are re-gifted (though of course, not engraved items).
One thing that every priests needs, are gasoline cards to keep in the glove box of his car. They put a ridiculous amount of miles on their cars…ministering to the sick, the lonely, Diocesan meetings in far-flung parishes. And the cost of gas is really high in some places. 2 or 3 $25 gift cards for gas (or AMEX cards) will run the same as a beautiful crucifix, and will help him in his ministry. Or, for something more personal, a gift card to a fine men’s shoe store. They go through dress shoes and running shoes as well.
Just a couple of ideas.

 

[Sirach2]

Sirach2,

Now, I have a very specific question for you (and Dave) concerning my soon-to-be pastor. Since I cannot see my situation objectively, I will follow whatever you (and Dave, if he wants to offer his opinion) recommend that I do. My pastor’s birthday is coming up soon and I had planned (along with my husband and son) to give him a nice crucifix with his initials and a Scripture verse on it. Last year, we sent him a nice gift card with a letter. Question: should I acknowledge his birthday with this gift? If not, should I acknowledge it at all and, if so, in what manner? FYI. I generally like giving gifts to people and have given gifts to other priests in the past with no problem or worries, on my part.

Here’s an account of St. Ignatius’ vision of the serpent.

It was while he was living at the hospital at Manresa that the following strange event took place. Very frequently on a clear moonlight night there appeared in the courtyard before him an indistinct shape which he could not see clearly enough to tell what it was. Yet it appeared so symmetrical and beautiful that his soul was filled with pleasure and joy as he gazed at it. It had something of the form of a serpent with glittering eyes, and yet they were not eyes. He felt an indescribable joy steal over him at the sight of this object. The oftener he saw it, the greater was the consolation he derived from it, and when the vision left him, his soul was filled with sorrow and sadness.

Up to this period he had remained in a constant state of tranquility and consolation, without any interior knowledge of the trials that beset the spiritual life. But during the time that the vision lasted, sometimes for days, or a little previous to that time, his soul was violently agitated by a thought that brought him no little uneasiness. There flashed upon his mind the idea of the difficulty that attended the kind of life he had begun, and he felt as if he heard some one whispering to him, “How can you keep up for seventy years of your life these practices which you have begun?” Knowing that this thought was a temptation of the evil one, he expelled it by this answer: “Can you, wretched one, promise me one hour of life?” In this manner he overcame the temptation, and his soul was restored to peace.

Can I ask why you refer to him as your “'soon to be pastor?” Is he a seminarian assigned to your parish or something? Is he the one for whom you plan to give a birthday gift? Or is it your regular pastor - not sure here. Anyway, I don’t see a problem getting a gift for your pastor, since it is something you have done before. And certainly, since it is his birthday, he may appreciate your family’s remembrance of it. Usually folks just do this at Christmas, so be careful that it is not overly expensive so as to overwhelm him. Fit the gift for the occasion as a kindly gesture. Since it is from the family, I can’t see a problem here. Just don’t sign your own name.

 

[houston1]

God bless you. I have a suggestion even though you didn’t ask me:
I have always been employed by the church. It’s been my experience that priests don’t really need more “religious” items. They are deluged with them from well-wishing parishioners.
Often, these things are re-gifted (though of course, not engraved items).
One thing that every priests needs, are gasoline cards to keep in the glove box of his car. They put a ridiculous amount of miles on their cars…ministering to the sick, the lonely, Diocesan meetings in far-flung parishes. And the cost of gas is really high in some places. 2 or 3 $25 gift cards for gas (or AMEX cards) will run the same as a beautiful crucifix, and will help him in his ministry. Or, for something more personal, a gift card to a fine men’s shoe store. They go through dress shoes and running shoes as well.
Just a couple of ideas.

piantistclare,

Thank you. Again, you certainly have great insight. Given my attachment, I await advice as to whether I should give my pastor anything. Since you also seem to be in tune with this, I am thinking you believe that it’s okay to give him something and that this won’t reinforce my attachment. I really like your gift card ideas. I was planning on giving more than the amount that you have listed, though, if that’s okay.

God bless you.

houston1

 

[houston1]

Here’s an account of St. Ignatius’ vision of the serpent.

Can I ask why you refer to him as your “'soon to be pastor?” Is he a seminarian assigned to your parish or something? Is he the one for whom you plan to give a birthday gift? Or is it your regular pastor - not sure here. Anyway, I don’t see a problem getting a gift for your pastor, since it is something you have done before. And certainly, since it is his birthday, he may appreciate your family’s remembrance of it. Usually folks just do this at Christmas, so be careful that it is not overly expensive so as to overwhelm him. Fit the gift for the occasion as a kindly gesture. Since it is from the family, I can’t see a problem here. Just don’t sign your own name.

Oops . . . we just have one priest who I refer to as both “soon-to-be-pastor” and “pastor.” He is turning 65 and has been a priest for 40 years. I like pianistclare’s ideas on the useful items that priests normally need. I was actually planning on giving more than what she mentioned. I’ve given more than that amount in the past and my soon-to-be-pastor didn’t seem uncomfortable by it at all.

Thanks a bunch. I feel like today is a new day!

houston1

 

[pianistclare]

piantistclare,

Thank you. Again, you certainly have great insight. Given my attachment, I await advice as to whether I should give my pastor anything. Since you also seem to be in tune with this, I am thinking you believe that it’s okay to give him something and that this won’t reinforce my attachment. I really like your gift card ideas. I was planning on giving more than the amount that you have listed, though, if that’s okay.

God bless you.

houston1

Oh sure! I do think it’s absolutely ok to give gifts…they work really hard, and prayers are always needed and welcome, but the occasional treat is a beautiful gesture.
One thing about the gift cards…it’s not a constant reminder of the person who gave it, but it has the added benefit of when he does think of your family, he will remember your thoughtfulness and appreciate that you view his as a person and not someone on a pedestal. Many priests are really uncomfortable with that, it’s a lot of pressure. We respect them all of course, but they are someone’s son, someone’s brother, just like us. Sometimes funny, sometimes cranky, and sometimes lonesome. A gift that makes him feel like a valued friend is wonderful.
Having said that, many fail to give the priests a stipend for weddings baptisms, funeral, etc. So the “mad” money they get is most welcome. Some put it towards a vacation, or something that people wouldn’t ordinarily know they like, as in a hobby.
Best wishes!

 

[IrishAm]

I think of Sarah’s response in the Book of Tobit to her multiple husbands dying on their wedding night to her – to paraphrase her words of despair, “perhaps I was not good enough for them; or perhaps they were not good enough for me.” She trusted God and the Angel Raphael (to whom I pray regularly) walked in with the one truly meant for her.

 

[houston1]

I think of Sarah’s response in the Book of Tobit to her multiple husbands dying on their wedding night to her – to paraphrase her words of despair, “perhaps I was not good enough for them; or perhaps they were not good enough for me.” She trusted God and the Angel Raphael (to whom I pray regularly) walked in with the one truly meant for her.

IrishAm,

I’ve read the book of Tobit but did not consider your point. Sarah went through numerous situations giving rise to expectation and then followed by heartache until, at last, her good one came for her. Thanks for sharing your point of view.

I will also pray to the Angel Raphael. I will also pray for you. God bless you.

houston1

 

[houston1]

Here’s an account of St. Ignatius’ vision of the serpent.

Can I ask why you refer to him as your “'soon to be pastor?” Is he a seminarian assigned to your parish or something? Is he the one for whom you plan to give a birthday gift? Or is it your regular pastor - not sure here. Anyway, I don’t see a problem getting a gift for your pastor, since it is something you have done before. And certainly, since it is his birthday, he may appreciate your family’s remembrance of it. Usually folks just do this at Christmas, so be careful that it is not overly expensive so as to overwhelm him. Fit the gift for the occasion as a kindly gesture. Since it is from the family, I can’t see a problem here. Just don’t sign your own name.

Sirach2,

I was just pondering the experience that you shared about how St. Ignatius had a vision of a serpent and noted that he felt sad after the vision left him. Perhaps this is the discernment rule involving how the beginning, middle, and end of a thought/idea must bring consolation in order to conclude the source is from the good angel.

I will have to review my thoughts in this way as they arise again.

Thanks for sharing.

houston1

 

[InLight247]

Houston, I have been praying for you and glad to see the discussion head to a constructive direction. In the other thread you said

I do have an attachment but more of an attachment to my idea of how the relationship should develop and not trusting God to work it His way, the better way: i.e., my attitude toward God is effectively this, “God, I did thus and so. Now you owe me. Do your part.”

You know we are supposed to do God’s will, not ours. That’s why we pray “thy will be done”, not “my will be done”. You also know God does not owe anyone anything. When we do good things for God, we should say “your useless servant simply did what he ought to do”, not “God now you owe me”. Whoever engages in contemplation seeks union with the Beloved. We are to do our best to keep the purity of hearts, to please our Beloved.

You may not be convinced this is also an attachment toward the particular priest. In your perspective, you think it is God who put this idea in you for a special relationship with this priest. You said when you attach to the idea, you feel peace; therefore, the idea must be from God. This may not be true. St. Ignatius uses peace and joy as an indication of the source, however, not the feeling of peace and joy always means the desire is from God. Ignatius’ serpent vision proves this. An idea or a desire could be from God, from self, or from the enemy. That’s why discernment is not easy.

For example, if a boy has a crush on a girl, every time he sees her his heart beat raises up, his hands sweat, his heart trembles. Whenever he imagines they are together, he feels peace and joy. Whenever he imagines her rejection he feels anxiety and sadness. Does this mean the boy’s desire is from God, and God destined the girl for him? Not necessary.

 

[houston1]

Houston, I have been praying for you and glad to see the discussion head to a constructive direction. In the other thread you said You know we are supposed to do God’s will, not ours. That’s why we pray “thy will be done”, not “my will be done”. You also know God does not owe anyone anything. When we do good things for God, we should say “your useless servant simply did what he ought to do”, not “God now you owe me”. Whoever engages in contemplation seeks union with the Beloved. We are to do our best to keep the purity of hearts, to please our Beloved.

You may not be convinced this is also an attachment toward the particular priest. In your perspective, you think it is God who put this idea in you for a special relationship with this priest. You said when you attach to the idea, you feel peace; therefore, the idea must be from God. This may not be true. St. Ignatius uses peace and joy as an indication of the source, however, not the feeling of peace and joy always means the desire is from God. Ignatius’ serpent vision proves this. An idea or a desire could be from God, from self, or from the enemy. That’s why discernment is not easy.

For example, if a boy has a crush on a girl, every time he sees her his heart beat raises up, his hands sweat, his heart trembles. Whenever he imagines they are together, he feels peace and joy. Whenever he imagines her rejection he feels anxiety and sadness. Does this mean the boy’s desire is from God, and God destined the girl for him? Not necessary.

InLight247,

on everything you say.

Since I posted on the other thread, I have concluded that I have attachment for the priest, my desire, and everything related to this. I made the comment that you mention above before I realized the whole thing was attachment. Thanks be to God, through you, Sirach2, and others I have come to clearly see this.

Furthermore, last night I reviewed a commentary which I have read many times in the past regarding St. Ignatius’s 3 classes of men written by the late Fr. John Hardon. This article provides of list of questions in order to determine whether one is attached to a particular creature. My answers to many of these questions was “yes” related to this priest. Here is a link to the article.

therealpresence.org/archives/Christian_Spirituality/Christian_Spirituality_023.htm

Thanks be to God that I can now move on in doing what is most pleasing to Him. And, now I have peace.

Thanks for praying for me. I have been remembering you in my Mass intentions and other prayers, too. May God bless you.

houston1