Receivng Communion on your Hand

[corsair]

This “snipet” is borrowed from this morning’s post on Rorate-Caeli blogspot.

"In his sermon on September 20, 2009 in the Cathedral, Juan Luis Cardinal Cipriani Thorne, Archbishop of Lima, made the following statement:

“The most respectful way of receiving the Eucharist is kneeling and on the tongue. We must recover a sense of respect and reverence due to the Eucharist, because the love to Jesus is the center of our Christian lives. Our souls are at stake.”

 

[paperwight]

This “snipet” is borrowed from this morning’s post on Rorate-Caeli blogspot.

"In his sermon on September 20, 2009 in the Cathedral, Juan Luis Cardinal Cipriani Thorne, Archbishop of Lima, made the following statement:

“The most respectful way of receiving the Eucharist is kneeling and on the tongue. .”

Well, that’s only his personal opinion. It’s not what the Church as a whole teaches. Perhaps he holds this opinion because of teaching in his childhood, perhaps in reaction to a particular problem he’s seen in his diocese. But it still remains only his opinion.

Oddly enough, this Sunday notices were up in our church with a directive from OUR Archbishop,headed ‘Update on Swine Flu’, saying that communion on the tongue ‘is to be strongly discouraged’.

When the swine flu situation is over, I doubt very much if many would want to go back to COTT, having been made so aware of the health risks.

If the Vatican ever changed the discipline and made COTT mandatory, I foresee discontent and even rebellion. I hope the Vatican would not be so foolish as to risk it.

 

[lawanda]

Well, that’s only his personal opinion. It’s not what the Church as a whole teaches. Perhaps he holds this opinion because of teaching in his childhood, perhaps in reaction to a particular problem he’s seen in his diocese. But it still remains only his opinion.

Oddly enough, this Sunday notices were up in our church with a directive from OUR Archbishop,headed ‘Update on Swine Flu’, saying that communion on the tongue ‘is to be strongly discouraged’.

When the swine flu situation is over, I doubt very much if many would want to go back to COTT, having been made so aware of the health risks.

If the Vatican ever changed the discipline and made COTT mandatory, I foresee discontent and even rebellion. I hope the Vatican would not be so foolish as to risk it.

 

[almightyservant]

This puzzles me. Did you really mean to write ‘prostrate oneself’? I’ve never seen that happen at Benediction. The only time I’ve seen prostration was during an Ordination.

What country are you in?

Let me clarify what I mean by prostration as I believe there are different types. What I mean by prostration is not what one would see during an ordination. It is rather what I think some call a double genuflection or a genuflection where both knees make contact with the ground. As for what country I’m from, I’m from the USofA. From my understanding a simple genuflection would do, and I should have just left it at that for greeting our Lord and kneeling to avoid causing any confusion.

 

[lawanda]

when the swine flu is over???, again I will say this. our church and many of other churches have never taken away the cup of wine they still offer both the bread and the wine, swine flu or not. it doesn’t matter we still are offered both. and in our church we recieve both in the hand or on the tongue. we don’t criticize one another for choosing one or the other . but the swine flu has not affected our church’s way of serving the lord in anyway.

 

[I_Believe]

Don’t worry - our wonderful Holy Father is slowly but surely getting us back to where we need to be, and trying to un-do some of the damage done by the post Vatican II “spirit” .

~Liza

Good point
And that is exactly why I don’t waste time arguing about it anymore. I’ve seen enough awareness among those in full communion with Rome to see that there is indeed a new liturgical movement within the Church.

It took quite a long time to for this mess to get this bad, and it will take time to correct it.

 

[diggerdomer]

It took quite a long time to for this mess to get this bad, and it will take time to correct it.

The same can be said for the good work the Council of Trent did and everything that followed it.

 

[KingTheoden]

In the early Church, it was also customary to go to confession by confessing your sins to the entire congregation, and by doing some pretty harsh public penances. Do you want to go back to that too?

I too have wondered why progressives stop short of advocating this, particularly the harsh penances

Sure, why not? It would probably keep people more honest and less likely to sin, wouldn’t it? Especially since most people in those tiny communities knew their neighbours very well indeed. It was hard to get away with anything, so people tended not to try. Today, in our anonymous societies, it is very easy to hide what we are doing privately.

Actually, I’m surprised this kind of confession hasn’t come up among the traditionalists, considering it was part of the Traditional Church for so long.

Anyway, since communion in the hand has been practiced for the past 40 years, we are not “going back” to anything since it is something going on already.

Couple points. The normal progression of doctrine that gives a fuller understanding of a teaching does imply certain things. For starters, as we gain such better understanding, we thus approach things slightly differently. Eucharistic adoration is a good example of this.

Furthermore, it became clear to the early Church that open air confessions had very serious problems to the point that such directly frustrated the salvation of those truly seeking it. So, private confession to the priest developed, first in Ireland if I am not mistaken. This format allows a candid confession without fear of other men ostracizing you in the community.

Finally, Communion in the hand is on the way out for many, many reasons. First, even with modern hosts crumbs are common. Additionally, people steal consecrated hosts and perform heinous acts on them. Reception on the tongue prevents this to a much greater degree.

Now, because there are flu concerns in my diocese, we receive temporarily in the hand. There is also no touching during the sign of peace or hand holding. So Sacred Blood either. I feel this is very fair and charitable. But as a general rule, probably 1/5 to 1/10 normally would receive on the tongue at my parish. A good start.

Father Z has a post about this from Lima, btw!

 

[Diane_Lynn]

Well, that’s only his personal opinion. It’s not what the Church as a whole teaches. Perhaps he holds this opinion because of teaching in his childhood, perhaps in reaction to a particular problem he’s seen in his diocese. But it still remains only his opinion.

Oddly enough, this Sunday notices were up in our church with a directive from OUR Archbishop,headed ‘Update on Swine Flu’, saying that communion on the tongue ‘is to be strongly discouraged’.

When the swine flu situation is over, I doubt very much if many would want to go back to COTT, having been made so aware of the health risks.

If the Vatican ever changed the discipline and made COTT mandatory, I foresee discontent and even rebellion. I hope the Vatican would not be so foolish as to risk it.

I have taken communion on my tongue since I first received when a youngster. I also knelt at the altar and felt I was giving homage to Jesus in taking it that way.

What I see today is a rather silly argument and actually not medically correct when addressing the issue of which is best for taking communion…in the hand or on the tongue.

During flu season everyone is advised to wash their hands often so as to help prevent the spread of germs. I wonder if everyone taking communion in the hand has done just that or is it possible that when the communion is placed on the hand of an infected person the server might become a receiver of the germs and then a transmitter if any contact had been made hand to hand. The risk would seem to be lessened if from hand to tongue since from my experience the host goes from the chalice directly to the tongue without skin to skin contact that might later transfer germs to others.

The communion cup I am told is less affected since it is wiped after each lip touches it and the wine acts as a disinfectant although I have to suppose that is not completely true.

Personally during flu season I never take the offering of the blood of Christ but limit myself to the host. I think it is safer to do that alone and on the tongue.

Diane

 

[diggerdomer]

Originally Posted by m134e5
In the early Church, it was also customary to go to confession by confessing your sins to the entire congregation, and by doing some pretty harsh public penances. Do you want to go back to that too?
I too have wondered why progressives stop short of advocating this, particularly the harsh penances

Quote:!

Where is there evidence that it was customary in the early church to confess publicly? I’m curious, I don’t know of any. Yes, there was definitely public penance, but I’m not aware of customary public confession (apart from specific religious communities that may have practiced this…although I admit I’m equally ignorant of any specific historical examples of this being done). Thanks.

 

[diggerdomer]

Finally, Communion in the hand is on the way out for many, many reasons. First, even with modern hosts crumbs are common. Additionally, people steal consecrated hosts and perform heinous acts on them. Reception on the tongue prevents this to a much greater degree.

I’ve never witnessed any of this, but assuming it does or has occurred I can’t imagine that the mode of reception prevents abuses. If one is interested in stealing the host/bread one could do it easily in hand or on the tongue. Actually, I imagine it would be easier on the tongue because if one receives in the hand it would be pretty easy to observe if one puts it one’s mouth. There’s no realistic way I know of that any parish minister would know that someone once receiving it on the tongue (whether from the minister or from their own hand) actually swallowed it or left Mass to do whatever with it.

Anyone?

 

[diggerdomer]

During flu season everyone is advised to wash their hands often so as to help prevent the spread of germs. I wonder if everyone taking communion in the hand has done just that or is it possible that when the communion is placed on the hand of an infected person the server might become a receiver of the germs and then a transmitter if any contact had been made hand to hand. The risk would seem to be lessened if from hand to tongue since from my experience the host goes from the chalice directly to the tongue without skin to skin contact that might later transfer germs to others.

I am not sure if I agree. As a minister of communion, isn’t it easier to ensure you don’t contact someone’s hand than that you don’t inadvertently contact someone’s tongue or lips? By the way, the host does not come from the chalice. The chalice/cup contains the Precious Blood. Let’s be realistic, I think it’s much easier to ensure there’s no physical contact when you’re placing the bread/host in a hand rather than in someone’s mouth. Thoughts?

The communion cup I am told is less affected since it is wiped after each lip touches it and the wine acts as a disinfectant although I have to suppose that is not completely true.

I’ve heard this too but I wonder if it’s valid. I just today heard out bishop supports not offering the cup, which leads me to believe that there must be some flu-related reason for this, despite the wiping of the cup that is the norm. Do others have any evidence that wiping the cup is a safeguard against the flu? From what I’ve seen this seems to be an urban legend or otherwise dubious claim. Thanks.

 

[Ockham]

*At Sunday Mass on September 20, at the Cathedral Basilica of Lima, Cardinal Juan Luis Cipriani exhorted the faithful to adore Holy Eucharist at the more than 70 adoration chapels that were build throughout the Archdiocese of Lima on occasion of the Year of the Eucharist and the Continental Mission, thus making Perú’s capital city a “Eucharistic city”.

‘Lima is a Eucharistic city with more than 70 adoration chapels, where the Lord is exposed, where you can visit Him, because He hears you and helps you. We must adore Him and let your heart be filled with joy and the beauty of his wisdom’ the Cardinal mentioned during his homily.

The Archbishop explained that the most solemn and recommended way of receiving Communion is kneeling and on the tongue. In this sense, the faithful who participated at Mass at the Cathedral received Communion under these indications.

‘The most respectful way of receiving the Eucharist is kneeling and on the tongue. We must recover a sense of respect and reverence due to the Eucharist, because the love to Jesus is the center of our christian lives. Our souls are at stake.’ he mentioned.*

arzobispadodelima.org/notas/2009/setiembre/200909a.html

 

[I_Believe]

*At Sunday Mass on September 20, at the Cathedral Basilica of Lima, Cardinal Juan Luis Cipriani exhorted the faithful to adore Holy Eucharist at the more than 70 adoration chapels that were build throughout the Archdiocese of Lima on occasion of the Year of the Eucharist and the Continental Mission, thus making Perú’s capital city a “Eucharistic city”.

‘Lima is a Eucharistic city with more than 70 adoration chapels, where the Lord is exposed, where you can visit Him, because He hears you and helps you. We must adore Him and let your heart be filled with joy and the beauty of his wisdom’ the Cardinal mentioned during his homily.

The Archbishop explained that the most solemn and recommended way of receiving Communion is kneeling and on the tongue. In this sense, the faithful who participated at Mass at the Cathedral received Communion under these indications.

‘The most respectful way of receiving the Eucharist is kneeling and on the tongue. We must recover a sense of respect and reverence due to the Eucharist, because the love to Jesus is the center of our christian lives. Our souls are at stake.*’ he mentioned.

arzobispadodelima.org/notas/2009/setiembre/200909a.html

The Good Bishop has his priorities in order

 

[hansard]

I wonder whether Jesus gave his flesh to his disciples in the hand or on the tongue?
Ah, to know the answer to that would be to solve this problem once and for all time.

 

[Ockham]

Popes and saints throughout the centuries have insisted on holy communion on the tongue while kneeling. Jesus gave the keys of heaven to St. Peter; Pope Benedict is his successor. You can only receive holy communion from the Pope on the tongue while kneeling. Problem solved.

 

[hansard]

Got that everyone? After 175 posts, the problem is declared solved, based on the traditions of the Popes and saints.

Of course, it means that every Catholic Priest in my Diocese (all of whom are Doctors or Masters in Theology) are in defiance of the Holy Traditions of the Church, in defiance of the Holy Father and, by virtue of succession, in defiance of Jesus himself.

No, I am not being flippant (for once). This is a serious matter of protocol, respect for tradition and submission to authority. There should be a ruling on this, once and for all. The Pope needs to do more than lead by example: Benedict needs to issue an edict or proclamation on the correct manner of receiving communion.

 

[Ockham]

Communion in hand is an indult. Research the subject and you’ll indeed find quotes from popes and saints to guide you. It doesn’t matter how many pages this thread or how many other threads occur on this subject. To be Catholic is to respect authority and the authoritiy on this subject is clear.

 

[hansard]

Erm, no, the authority on this matter is not clear at all. The very extensive debate on a worldwide forum such as this should hint at the lack of clarity.
Many, many ordained clergymen are abusing the most sacred sacrament, right under the noses of their Bishops and, by extension, under the stewardship of the Pope.

On the other, more reasonable hand, we could look at it this way:
The current Pope allows communion in the hand, therefore he has instituted a new tradition, or decided to allow the continuation of a change in tradition, under his full authority. Therefore, communion in the hand is allowable, simply because the current Pope has not disallowed it.

Problem solved indeed. This gets everyone off the hook. If the Pope ain’t against it explicitly, he must be for it implicitly.

 

[Diane_Lynn]

I wonder whether Jesus gave his flesh to his disciples in the hand or on the tongue?
Ah, to know the answer to that would be to solve this problem once and for all time.

But was not the hand of Jesus in and of itself a Holy Vessel???