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CrossofChrist
Guest
Old news. We already knew about Archbishop Mueller’s friendship with Gutierrez.
The Church’s position on Liberation Theology has stayed the same. If it means genuine compassion for the poor by encouraging an “all hands on deck” approach toward helping the needy, then it is acceptable. In fact I think that there are parts in the Catechism that use Liberation Theology terminology. OTOH, if it is a code word for Christian Marxism (pardon the oxymoron, it’s the easiest way to describe it), then it isn’t acceptable.
The Church’s position on Liberation Theology has stayed the same. If it means genuine compassion for the poor by encouraging an “all hands on deck” approach toward helping the needy, then it is acceptable. In fact I think that there are parts in the Catechism that use Liberation Theology terminology. OTOH, if it is a code word for Christian Marxism (pardon the oxymoron, it’s the easiest way to describe it), then it isn’t acceptable.
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Jotto
Guest
And which aspects of Marxist theory do you think are incompatible with Christianity?
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lynnvinc
Guest
I would think “the end justifies the means” aspect of Marxism would be incompatible with Christianity, and any smack of violence…which, of course, applies to capitalism, as well.
So in a way both Marxism and capitalism pretty much go against Christianity in being so uber-materialistic, and also both being based on industrialization (Marxism arising as a corrective for the extreme inhuman excesses of industrial capitalism), but both pretty much overlooking the “slow violence” from industrialization’s pollution, ultimately both harming the poor and others in that way – harmed victims as collatoral damage or “externalities.”
Don’t know much about liberation theology, but if it is in the Christian mould, then it would at least strive to balance material well-being – the accumulation of inanimate things – with how the system is helping or harming the body and soul.
Of course, Marx in his early writings (we read them in Classical Sociological Theory) did hedge about these types of problems, esp in his concept of one’s alienation under capitalism from work, products, self, others, and nature. So it seems his ideas were a tad better than, say, Adam Smith’s ideas. And Marx’s father had converted to the Lutheran faith, and you can see more Christian compassionate type of thinking in his early writings than in the works of those promoting savage capitalism.
But still there is a difference, bec the ultimate goal in Christianity (and I assume in liberation theology) is salvation of souls, including thru works of mercy and justice and by preventing the poor and oppressed from becoming angry and hateful. Jesus was merciful to the poor and suffering; he cared about our bodies, as well as our souls. His “man does not live by bread alone” does acknowledge that man needs food to live (but also needs more), and goes with “give us this day our daily bread.”
By contrast, the ultimate goal of capitalism and communism is material benefits – the former for the lucky and hard-working, and the latter for all.
Maybe it’s like this: While capitalism says the rich own the important things, and communism says all people own everything, the Judeo-Christian religion says in Psalm 95:
…God holds in his hands the depths of the earth
and the highest mountains as well.
He made the sea; it belongs to him,
the dry land, too, for it was formed by his hands…
God is ultimate owner of EVERYTHING, and we are to be his faithful and care-taking stewards – of creation, and esp of the poor and suffering.
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Tigg
Guest
Just for starters, a social gospel only that would advance revolution and coercion by the State, without regard for the salvific message of eternal life and the notion of a perfect society through the channels of humanism and materialism.
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manualman
Guest
In practice, LT neglects to recognize Original Sin and the universal need of humanity for a Savior.
Everybody loves a scapegoat. LT provides a handy one in that it typically posits that the ills of society are caused by the rich and powerful, who can then be opposed via various methods. It’s a subtle problem because the rich and powerful ARE sinful men. Just like the poor and weak are sinful men. Granted, the sins of the powerful often have an outsized effect on overall human flourishing compared to the individual sins of the poor and weak. But this is no reason to give oneself a pass!
LT too often starts with underlying utopian assumptions that suggest that if we just overthow those unjust oppressors everything would be great! But LT adherents then often fail to recognize and repent of their OWN sins and sinfulness. At that point, they are just another bunch of revolutionaries. More in an unending line of false messiahs. Much better to put one’s faith in the REAL Messiah, no?
I think it’s a Chesterton quote (which makes it older than LT, but it still applies): Reformers are generally right about what is wrong, but are almost always wrong about what is right. Fits LT to a tee.
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lynnvinc
Guest
A good movie to see is ROMERO. Archbishop Oscar Romero (acc to the film) was not into LT, but rather a bookish, moderate man. However due to the horrible excesses and evils in El Salvador – oppression of the peasant and brutal genocide against them – he came be more supportive of his LT priests (who were being tortured and murdered by the military) and their ideas, and was himself assasinated. A very powerful film.
I later also saw a TV clip about how the evil El Salvador army (aided by the U.S.), would use peasant infants for target practice – throw them up in the air and shoot them.
Another film about the atrocities in El Salvador is ROSES IN DECEMBER, about nuns and an American aid worker who were raped and murdered by the US-supported military.
If a country wants the US to come to its aid and suppress the oppressed now seeking to be free and gain some rights, all that country has to do is say, “communists.” It happened in Sri Lanka, where the Tamil insurgents most certainly were not communists, but just wanted equal (or at least some) rights acc to a more democratic form of gov. They wanted democracy. Horrible genocide and conflicts that have persisted. It devolved into mainly Buddhist Sinhalese military against Hindu, Muslim, and Christian Tamil civilians. Even the Sri Lankan president at the time admitted they had made a mistake to pursue a military path. However, the US was licking its chops at perhaps removing the Tamils (who had lived there for many generations) and putting a US military base there, or who knows what the motive – it probably went beyond a desire to eradicate all communists of the world, including those who are socially constructed as communists, but are actually not communists.
There are very evil things going on in the world which demand some Christian outcry, a standing up for righteousness. In the way of Christ.
I later also saw a TV clip about how the evil El Salvador army (aided by the U.S.), would use peasant infants for target practice – throw them up in the air and shoot them.
Another film about the atrocities in El Salvador is ROSES IN DECEMBER, about nuns and an American aid worker who were raped and murdered by the US-supported military.
If a country wants the US to come to its aid and suppress the oppressed now seeking to be free and gain some rights, all that country has to do is say, “communists.” It happened in Sri Lanka, where the Tamil insurgents most certainly were not communists, but just wanted equal (or at least some) rights acc to a more democratic form of gov. They wanted democracy. Horrible genocide and conflicts that have persisted. It devolved into mainly Buddhist Sinhalese military against Hindu, Muslim, and Christian Tamil civilians. Even the Sri Lankan president at the time admitted they had made a mistake to pursue a military path. However, the US was licking its chops at perhaps removing the Tamils (who had lived there for many generations) and putting a US military base there, or who knows what the motive – it probably went beyond a desire to eradicate all communists of the world, including those who are socially constructed as communists, but are actually not communists.
There are very evil things going on in the world which demand some Christian outcry, a standing up for righteousness. In the way of Christ.
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