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triumphguy
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Youâre welcome.Thanks for posting - I needed this todayI loved the line about the cry room being the âinfantâs ghettoâ!
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Chatter163
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I donât recall any post stating that parents tending to their children were distracted to an extent that they should consider not receiving communion. I see several posts where people ask if such people should refrain (sometimes referring to themselves, sometimes just in general, several of which were asked in a somewhat irritated tone), but nowhere do I see anyone, myself included, stating anything about children. These are situations that frequently cannot be helped. That was not what was being discussed here.
What was being discussed here, especially by me, was people who had not prepared themselves to receive communion by focusing on Our Lord, because theyânote the boldface hereâhad specifically been distracted by focusing on other things, e.g., thinking about work, personal affairs, household matters, etc. I mentioned that on occasion when I realized that I had done so repeatedly in the same Mass (most commonly during the homily, but also at other times, including the Canon of the Mass), I refrained. In light of the statements that I posted above from various Catholic sources, my point simply was thst when one has not put aside secular preoccupations for the better part of Mass, one might well be said to not have prepared onself properly to receive communion.
The result, not unpredictable, was a number of people angrily responding about child care and other personal situations. Many of them were punctuated with statements that they had never heard such a notion before. I am well aware that this is the case, and I indicated such. Given the state of catechesis today, and the contemporary tendency toward minimizing religious duties, it is no surprise. We (I include myself here) are a distracted people who have created a loud, busy, bustling world of distractions, and we tend to avoid anything that suggests that we slow down and meditate upon the supernatural. We dislike silence for this very reason. So when we hear that we should try to focus on Our Lord in the Blessed Sacrament, and mentally put aside wordly business, we resent it. Tending to small children cannot be helped. The duties of ushers and others involved in the Mass may also involve them being Marthas rather than Maries. I realize this, which is why I specifically talked about letting oneâs mind wander, and not these other necessary duties.
But I truly believe that most of us, whether naturally a Martha or a Mary, have at times not completely put aside our personal affairs during Mass, and mentally dwelt on them to such an extent that we were not properly prepared to receive. Popes, saints and catechisms (see above in this thread) have all spoken of the need to focus reverently and devoutly on Our Lord in the Most Holy Eucharist when receiving, and the need to put aside daydreaming and other such distrtactions. That is what the OP meant, I believe, and it is what I meant, nothing else.
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TrueLight
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Why are folks so quick to cry âscrupulousâ on this forum?
Really, itâs a personal decision. Each one knows his heart. What might distract one person, might not distract another. As we are not obligated to receive the Eucharist at every mass, I prefer to make a spiritual communion even before I kneel on the altar rails.
Look at this prayer of St Ambrose found in many missals as part of the âPrayers before communionâ.
This is the frame of mind I want to be in. If instead I am thinking of other things throughout the whole mass, I probably wouldnât receive. Instead, Iâd take the time during communion to pray. This maybe happened to me once or twice out of the 70 or so times I attended mass since my conversion.
When I had young children, I was perfectly able to tend to my kids (crying and all) and still maintain the proper disposition. So not everything distracts everyone in the same way.
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cothrige
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It seems to me that there is a touch of defensiveness being bandied about on this. Most of it seems, IMHO, to come down to a misunderstanding of what distraction might mean. I for one have refrained from reception in some cases due to distraction, and I know many others who have done the same. However, for me the question is not about external annoyances which cannot be avoided, like screaming children or that chatting couple that always manage to find the pew directly behind me, but rather willful distraction within myself. I might be angry about something and so donât focus on the Mass because I am stewing in my own self-righteousness or some other such thing. It all depends on whether I feel, in my own conscience, that I have actually done all I could to participate adequately during the sacrifice of the Mass. If I have doubts I will stay seated, otherwise I will not. I think of it in the same way I do in regard to arriving late for Mass. If, through my own fault, I am not present, either physically or mentally, during enough of the Mass I just wonât feel comfortable receiving Communion. It seems a matter of common sense to me.
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George_Stegmeir
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Not quite true. One must be completely free from mortal sin, and the only way anyone-including saints- can be sure is by going to Confession. Anything less than that is self delusion, which in itself (where sin is concerned) is sinful.
Considering the number of people I see in the Communion line at Sunday Mass versus the number of those I see in the Confession line on Saturday or during Mass on Sunday, we must indeed be living during an age of saintliness!
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ProVobis
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Maybe even holier. Even saints went to confession.
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Evan
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I have refrained for very similar reasons.
I have also found screaming, crying, fussing children to be a blessing during mass as they can remind me of the suffering souls in purgatory (I can hear the children voicing their cries) or children laughing, playing, dropping toys can remind me of the Church in Heaven enjoying a banquet with the Lord. But none of these are âdistractionsâ, they are sounds. Distractions are things that direct my thoughts to unworthy things. Family is the ecclisia domestica (the home church) and is not a distraction, but the basic building block of the the Church.
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thewanderer
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Chatter163:
I wasnât making any particular distinction between distractions because of tending to others vs distractions because of thinking of other things. I just wanted to understand why people do so. You have made the claim that people ought to refrain from receiving if they have been distracted (whether voluntarilly or involuntarily?) from the mass by thinking about other things. I realize you have posted some quotes from saints etc about the importance of paying attention in mass, as well as some quotes about the importance of receiving with the proper disposition, (Thank you for that, by the way, its always helpful to get actual quotes out in the open) ⌠I guess Iâm just still unclear as to how you got to the conclusion that it would necessarily be wrong to receive if one was distracted for a certain length of time during the mass. Is there any way for you to clarify your reasoning behind this? Since the reason to refrain from receiving is because of not being correctly disposed, how did you come to conclusion that if you do are distracted for a certain length of time during mass there is no possibility of becoming properly disposed to receive?
If anyone can find anything by the Church (or saints) about how when can tell whether they are properly disposed or not please post it here as that would really help!
I wasnât making any particular distinction between distractions because of tending to others vs distractions because of thinking of other things. I just wanted to understand why people do so. You have made the claim that people ought to refrain from receiving if they have been distracted (whether voluntarilly or involuntarily?) from the mass by thinking about other things. I realize you have posted some quotes from saints etc about the importance of paying attention in mass, as well as some quotes about the importance of receiving with the proper disposition, (Thank you for that, by the way, its always helpful to get actual quotes out in the open) ⌠I guess Iâm just still unclear as to how you got to the conclusion that it would necessarily be wrong to receive if one was distracted for a certain length of time during the mass. Is there any way for you to clarify your reasoning behind this? Since the reason to refrain from receiving is because of not being correctly disposed, how did you come to conclusion that if you do are distracted for a certain length of time during mass there is no possibility of becoming properly disposed to receive?
If anyone can find anything by the Church (or saints) about how when can tell whether they are properly disposed or not please post it here as that would really help!
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cothrige
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Well, from what I understand the Church has no rules about how much participation at any given Mass is required before receiving Communion. For that reason I donât think we can speak about how people shouldnât receive if they are distracted this or that much during the Mass. The Church doesnât say that, and so we shouldnât either. But, I donât think anybody is saying that, but rather I am reading these things as personal expressions of conscience regarding how attentive the person thinks they have been and whether they think they are then properly ready to approach the Sacrament. Taken that way it really doesnât seem to be a question of rules or requirements, but just one of asking yourself what you think you feel is right for you to do at that moment. Personally, I donât think you should be anymore scrupulous than you already feel compelled to be in this, and should receive anytime you are unaware of any actual cause not to.
BTW, you may find this commentary interesting jimmyakin.typepad.com/defensor_fidei/2007/10/arriving-late-c.html. It relates to the question of arriving late at Mass, but that is similar given that you surely havenât participated fully if you werenât there. I thought it was enlightening, and maybe you will find it useful.
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CB_Catholic
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There really is another reason to refrain from Communion other than mortal sin or not observing the fast, and it is far more important than distraction. If one is not at peace with his brother he must first reconcile with that brother before he approaches the altar.
Which is why it is not a good idea to have an argument with your spouse before Church.
Which is why it is not a good idea to have an argument with your spouse before Church.
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TrueLight
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Excellent point. How many people who are not talking to each other even in the same parish who go up for communion? Thank you for this reminder.There really is another reason to refrain from Communion other than mortal sin or not observing the fast, and it is far more important than distraction. If one is not at peace with his brother he must first reconcile with that brother before he approaches the altar.
Which is why it is not a good idea to have an argument with your spouse before Church.
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englishredrose
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or even worse when one is staying away because of an argument whilst the other continuesâŚ
I know the âruleâ and we have the same âruleâ but its one I very much dislike in that a) just about no one bothers with it and b) we receive communion when we are sick and an argument with our neighbour is aliken to sickness in my own book as such
Plus we all say
***âLord I am not worthy to receive you but only say the words and I shall be healedâ. ***
What does that mean or is it meaningless to people?
I know what it means but even by some comments on this thread suggest that people donât fully listen to what they are saying in the service.
I know the âruleâ and we have the same âruleâ but its one I very much dislike in that a) just about no one bothers with it and b) we receive communion when we are sick and an argument with our neighbour is aliken to sickness in my own book as such
Plus we all say
***âLord I am not worthy to receive you but only say the words and I shall be healedâ. ***
What does that mean or is it meaningless to people?
I know what it means but even by some comments on this thread suggest that people donât fully listen to what they are saying in the service.
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TrueLight
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We really arenât worthy that a God should become bread and wine allow us to ingest him. What have we done to deserve that?or even worse when one is staying away because of an argument whilst the other continuesâŚ
I know the âruleâ and we have the same âruleâ but its one I very much dislike in that a) just about no one bothers with it and b) we receive communion when we are sick and an argument with our neighbour is aliken to sickness in my own book as such
Plus we all say
***âLord I am not worthy to receive you but only say the words and I shall be healedâ. ***
What does that mean or is it meaningless to people?
But if I know that I had an argument with a woman a month ago and things are still not right between us and I refuse to speak to her (and Iâm not speaking of just putting distance), because I essentially hate her, yet every day I go to receive â that is a problem.
At some point, hatred and discord can become mortal sin, especially if you start wishing the person harm (and not just physical harm).
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ProVobis
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Staying away is a lot different than postponing the reception of communion. Sometimes it takes five minutes, sometimes several hours or days, before one can compose himself so to give full attention to the sacrament. Depends on the individual but you canât make that judgement for him/her, telling him/her that they must receive right then and there or it insults God.
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englishredrose
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but the idea of receiving communion when we are sick to help us in health - donât being sick include discord with our neighbour?
and no one can tell another they must or mustnât. Well the ordained can tell another they must not but otherwise no one else can either way and as friends of those hurting, we just can simply be there for them until they are ready. Though my one friend would go to Mass else where when away, but not in that one church. Though she does now and she be the first one as did so, who says I brought her back. All I did a few year ago was simply write on her Easter Card, hope to see you Easter Day. We had all stayed in touch.
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thewanderer
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Just so you know, I sent this question to the Ask an Apologist section, and if I get a reply I will post a link to it here.
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