Refusing vaccinations that come from aborted fetal tissue

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hamburglar

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My friend, who is in medical school, was promoting vaccinations and said that parents who refused to vaccinate their children are foolish. I chimed in and said that if/when I become a parent, I would choose not to use vaccines that come from aborted fetal tissue and linked to the following websites:

catholiceducation.org/articles/medical_ethics/me0044.html

rtl.org/prolife_issues/LifeNotes/VaccinesAbortion_FetalTissue.html

She then said that it would be wrong for me to refuse certain vaccines to my children, that vaccines are no longer derived from fetal tissue, and that since the Pontifical Academy for Life declared that it is okay for parents to use the vaccines in question, it is settled matter and I have no right to choose what I believe is best for my children. My basic position was that Catholics are free to disagree whether they want to use the vaccines with illicit origins, but that the final decision lies with the parent, not the government or anyone else and that Catholics must use alternative vaccines where available. I personally believe that there are not justifiable proportionate reasons for using the vaccines and therefore it was my right to choose not to vaccinate myself or my children with these vaccines because I recognize it as material cooperation in the grave evil of abortion, just as it is her right to choose to use the vaccines if she believes there are justifiable proportionate reasons to do so.

Am I correct in my reasoning and that the final decision should be made by the parents?
 
hamburglar said:
My friend, who is in medical school, was promoting vaccinations and said that parents who refused to vaccinate their children are foolish. I chimed in and said that if/when I become a parent, I would choose not to use vaccines that come from aborted fetal tissue and linked to the following websites:

catholiceducation.org/articles/medical_ethics/me0044.html

rtl.org/prolife_issues/LifeNotes/VaccinesAbortion_FetalTissue.html

She then said that it would be wrong for me to refuse certain vaccines to my children, that vaccines are no longer derived from fetal tissue, and that since the Pontifical Academy for Life declared that it is okay for parents to use the vaccines in question, it is settled matter and I have no right to choose what I believe is best for my children. My basic position was that Catholics are free to disagree whether they want to use the vaccines with illicit origins, but that the final decision lies with the parent, not the government or anyone else and that Catholics must use alternative vaccines where available. I personally believe that there are not justifiable proportionate reasons for using the vaccines and therefore it was my right to choose not to vaccinate myself or my children with these vaccines because I recognize it as material cooperation in the grave evil of abortion, just as it is her right to choose to use the vaccines if she believes there are justifiable proportionate reasons to do so.

Am I correct in my reasoning and that the final decision should be made by the parents?
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The parents should always have the final say-so, but why they may or may not want their child to be vaccinated is a separate question. If they do not want the child to receive a vaccine whose origins are morally questionable, that is their prerogative. However the articles seem to indicate that using such vaccines is permissible because the benefit outweighs the moral question.

My 2 cents. :twocents:
 
My question is, how does the average person know the source of the material used in a vaccination? I’m quite sure the source does not appear on the lable, and much information about such things on the internet is not reliable.
Denying a child the protection of vaccination under such circumstances would be heinous!
And yes, I am a parent with grown children.
 
George_Stegmeir said:
My question is, how does the average person know the source of the material used in a vaccination? I’m quite sure the source does not appear on the lable, and much information about such things on the internet is not reliable.
Denying a child the protection of vaccination under such circumstances would be heinous!
And yes, I am a parent with grown children.
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Don’t worry, this isn’t made up. The Vatican has addressed this very concern. Give me some time and I can find the link, if you want it.
 
I called the pediatrician’s office to find out what brands they used. I requested a different brand. Not so tough 🤷
 
Miserissima said:
I called the pediatrician’s office to find out what brands they used. I requested a different brand. Not so tough 🤷
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This is good to know. This is something I will be thinking about before too long here, and it’s good to know there are acceptable alternatives. Do you have any more information you can share?

EDIT: I might add that it is ok to use the standard vaccines, since it is seen as remote cooperation, but if there are alternatives I would use them.
 
TCEL said:
This is good to know. This is something I will be thinking about before too long here, and it’s good to know there are acceptable alternatives. Do you have any more information you can share?

EDIT: I might add that it is ok to use the standard vaccines, since it is seen as remote cooperation, but if there are alternatives I would use them.
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I’m looking for the links I used, try these:

cogforlife.org/vaccineListOrigFormat.pdf

And this has a chart of U.S. Produced Vaccines from Aborted Cell Lines near the bottom:
rtl.org/prolife_issues/LifeNotes/VaccinesAbortion_FetalTissue.html

I had a link with a more comprehensive list…I’ll keep looking for it.

Just do your prep work, make sure you call ahead and when you’re there, they put it in the chart. I had a small situation once where the doctor looked at me like I had three eyes when I confirmed which vaccine she was going to use (it was the wrong one). After she insisted there was no difference, I finally told her that it was my choice, and if she was going to vaccinate them that day, she’d use the brand I requested, please.
 
Found it!

christianpatriot.com/vaccines.htm

I think you could do a bit of Googling on “fetal cell vaccination alternatives” because this website notes, " No alternatives for Chickenpox, Rubella, Hepatitis-A, Ebola or HIV in U.S." but I think that there have been advances in research since this webpage was published.
 
TCEL said:
EDIT: I might add that it is ok to use the standard vaccines, since it is seen as remote cooperation, but if there are alternatives I would use them.
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If an alternative exists -the Pontifical Acd. for Life noted one is choose such.
 
hamburglar said:
My friend, who is in medical school, was promoting vaccinations and said that parents who refused to vaccinate their children are foolish. I chimed in and said that if/when I become a parent, I would choose not to use vaccines that come from aborted fetal tissue and linked to the following websites:

catholiceducation.org/articles/medical_ethics/me0044.html

rtl.org/prolife_issues/LifeNotes/VaccinesAbortion_FetalTissue.html

She then said that it would be wrong for me to refuse certain vaccines to my children, that vaccines are no longer derived from fetal tissue, and that since the Pontifical Academy for Life declared that it is okay for parents to use the vaccines in question, it is settled matter and I have no right to choose what I believe is best for my children. My basic position was that Catholics are free to disagree whether they want to use the vaccines with illicit origins, but that the final decision lies with the parent, not the government or anyone else and that Catholics must use alternative vaccines where available. I personally believe that there are not justifiable proportionate reasons for using the vaccines and therefore it was my right to choose not to vaccinate myself or my children with these vaccines because I recognize it as material cooperation in the grave evil of abortion, just as it is her right to choose to use the vaccines if she believes there are justifiable proportionate reasons to do so.

Am I correct in my reasoning and that the final decision should be made by the parents?
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If the only vaccine available to prevent a particular disease has been produced from aborted fetal tissue the Church allows such vaccinations.

I don’t understand your question about leaving it to the parents. If there is no law to make a particular vaccination compulsory for all then naturally the parents have the final decision.
 
Miserissima said:
Found it!

christianpatriot.com/vaccines.htm

I think you could do a bit of Googling on “fetal cell vaccination alternatives” because this website notes, " No alternatives for Chickenpox, Rubella, Hepatitis-A, Ebola or HIV in U.S." but I think that there have been advances in research since this webpage was published.
Click to expand...
If that’s the Christian Patriot Movement, I wouldn’t consider them a very reliable source. They have some views that are, shall we say, way out of the box.
 
agnes_therese said:
If that’s the Christian Patriot Movement, I wouldn’t consider them a very reliable source. They have some views that are, shall we say, way out of the box.
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I gave two other links. I don’t like the site itself, but cross referencing the chart I linked to with the other two sites and it’s kosher.
 
hamburglar said:
My friend, who is in medical school, was promoting vaccinations and said that parents who refused to vaccinate their children are foolish. I chimed in and said that if/when I become a parent, I would choose not to use vaccines that come from aborted fetal tissue and linked to the following websites:

catholiceducation.org/articles/medical_ethics/me0044.html

rtl.org/prolife_issues/LifeNotes/VaccinesAbortion_FetalTissue.html

She then said that it would be wrong for me to refuse certain vaccines to my children, that vaccines are no longer derived from fetal tissue, and that since the Pontifical Academy for Life declared that it is okay for parents to use the vaccines in question, it is settled matter and I have no right to choose what I believe is best for my children. My basic position was that Catholics are free to disagree whether they want to use the vaccines with illicit origins, but that the final decision lies with the parent, not the government or anyone else and that Catholics must use alternative vaccines where available. I personally believe that there are not justifiable proportionate reasons for using the vaccines and therefore it was my right to choose not to vaccinate myself or my children with these vaccines because I recognize it as material cooperation in the grave evil of abortion, just as it is her right to choose to use the vaccines if she believes there are justifiable proportionate reasons to do so.

Am I correct in my reasoning and that the final decision should be made by the parents?
Click to expand...
It is a ridiculous claim to say that parents don’t have the right to make choices for their children. There are many dangers associated with the chemical in vaccines, aside from the fact that there are still vaccines that use aborted fetal tissue. Now it is tissue that has been cloned I believe, or so they will say, it isn’t from the original baby. Ah, the lies we can tell ourselves.
 
UbiCaritas15 said:
It is a ridiculous claim to say that parents don’t have the right to make choices for their children. There are many dangers associated with the chemical in vaccines, aside from the fact that there are still vaccines that use aborted fetal tissue. Now it is tissue that has been cloned I believe, or so they will say, it isn’t from the original baby. Ah, the lies we can tell ourselves.
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If vaccinations are not compulsory by law then yes parents have to decide.
However, the benefits of mass vaccinations far out-weight the risks of having them and in my personal view parents who refuse to have their children vaccinated are deliberately risking the lives of their children.
 
thistle said:
If vaccinations are not compulsory by law then yes parents have to decide.
However, the benefits of mass vaccinations far out-weight the risks of having them and in my personal view parents who refuse to have their children vaccinated are deliberately risking the lives of their children.
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A lot of people bring up the herd immunity theory, but there is just as much science that disagrees with the efficacy. I certainly think each person is entitled to his own opinion, but we are just beginning to see the effects of heavy (because the vaccine schedule has quadrupled since 1980) metal toxicity poisoning in the population; not to mention the unknown effects of preservatives and animal DNA being injected into people.

As far as recent dealings with outbreaks of illness across the US, the children most adversely affected by illness are the ones who have already been “immunized.”

But the compulsory thing, it seemed that the post was referring to the Pontifical Academy for Life’s decision negating the decision of the parent. The law of the land wasn’t involved in that equation.
 
UbiCaritas15 said:
A lot of people bring up the herd immunity theory, but there is just as much science that disagrees with the efficacy. I certainly think each person is entitled to his own opinion, but we are just beginning to see the effects of heavy (because the vaccine schedule has quadrupled since 1980) metal toxicity poisoning in the population; not to mention the unknown effects of preservatives and animal DNA being injected into people.

As far as recent dealings with outbreaks of illness across the US, the children most adversely affected by illness are the ones who have already been “immunized.”

But the compulsory thing, it seemed that the post was referring to the Pontifical Academy for Life’s decision negating the decision of the parent. The law of the land wasn’t involved in that equation.
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Personally speaking, I believe vaccinations for all known childhood diseases should be compulsory. Again in my view, parents who do not allow their children to be vaccinated are deliberately risking their lives.
As for you comment that those vaccinated have suffered more I absolutely do not believe that at all.
Benefits of vaccination far outweigh the risks.
 
thistle said:
Personally speaking, I believe vaccinations for all known childhood diseases should be compulsory. Again in my view, parents who do not allow their children to be vaccinated are deliberately risking their lives.
As for you comment that those vaccinated have suffered more I absolutely do not believe that at all.
Benefits of vaccination far outweigh the risks.
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Honestly, I believe that parents who deliberately “shield” their children from vaccinations risk the lives of other people’s infants far more than they risk their own children’s health. Which, in my opinion, makes the choice not to vaccinate one’s children almost heinous.

I totally agree with you.
 
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