Refuting "once saved, always saved"

[PerfectTiming]

On another site I visit a question recently came up where a girl asked if we can lose salvation. I answered that of course we can, just because one once accepted Christ does not mean that if they reject Him in the future they will still be accepted into His kingdom. Then another girl also responded - she is a Baptist - and said “once saved always saved” and that if someone turns their back on Christ then they can’t have been saved in the first place.

I find this ridiculous, to be honest. Even Christ speaks of those who “believe for a while, and in time of trial they give up.” Luke 8:13. But I’m no theologian and I need help showing her where her fault is.

We frequently have discussions about things like this and I have little hope that she will open her eyes but I have to try. She is a very bright girl and very well-read in apologetics but sadly she trusts in sites that are full of fallacy.

So if anyone can help me that would be amazing.

 

[SteveGC]

Luke 15: 21-24 is a good refutation. Ask her if the prodigal son was, or was not, a true son of his father BEFORE he departed into wickedness, and then later returned in repentance. The obvious answer for any honest person is ‘yes, he most certainly was’. Hence, the parallel that the parable points to is clear. We, as Christians who are adopted into the family of God (regardless of the methods in which various people believe that comes to be), can later depart of our own free will into the world, and also return in repentance. And this pattern can endure throughout our lifetimes. Hopefully it does not, or atleast hopefully we are in the phase of true repentance when our life comes to an end.

 

[Edward_H]

See John Martinoni’s web site. He has a very thorough free downloadable talk on OSAS, among many others. Very good.

biblechristiansociety.com/account/download?return=%2Fdownload%2Fmp3%2Fonce_saved_always_saved.mp3

 

[vz71]

Have you noticed that she simply was not saved to begin with?

So apparently in this doctrine they hold, it does not matter what the behavior is or is not, because they really do not know if they have been saved or not.

Consider…
If this person is ‘saved’ and then falls away. The claim is that she was never saved.
So what if they are killed before falling away? Are they condemned because they ‘were not saved to begin with?’

On what basis is the condemnation?

 

[Godfollower]

On another site I visit a question recently came up where a girl asked if we can lose salvation. I answered that of course we can, just because one once accepted Christ does not mean that if they reject Him in the future they will still be accepted into His kingdom. Then another girl also responded - she is a Baptist - and said “once saved always saved” and that if someone turns their back on Christ then they can’t have been saved in the first place.

I find this ridiculous, to be honest. Even Christ speaks of those who “believe for a while, and in time of trial they give up.” Luke 8:13. But I’m no theologian and I need help showing her where her fault is.

We frequently have discussions about things like this and I have little hope that she will open her eyes but I have to try. She is a very bright girl and very well-read in apologetics but sadly she trusts in sites that are full of fallacy.

So if anyone can help me that would be amazing.

I say then, have they so stumbled, that they should fall? God forbid. But by their offence, salvation is come to the Gentiles, that they may be emulous of them. Now if the offence of them be the riches of the world, and the diminution of them, the riches of the Gentiles; how much more the fulness of them? For I say to you, Gentiles: as long indeed as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I will honour my ministry, If, by any means, I may provoke to emulation them who are my flesh, and may save some of them. For if the loss of them be the reconciliation of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?

For if the firstfruit be holy, so is the lump also: and if the root be holy, so are the branches. And if some of the branches be broken, and thou, being a wild olive, art ingrafted in them, and art made partaker of the root, and of the fatness of the olive tree, Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee. Thou wilt say then: The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in. Well: because of unbelief they were broken off. But thou standest by faith: be not highminded, but fear.

For if God hath not spared the natural branches, fear lest perhaps he also spare not thee. See then the goodness and the severity of God: towards them indeed that are fallen, the severity; but towards thee, the goodness of God, if thou abide in goodness, otherwise thou also shalt be cut off. And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again. For if thou wert cut out of the wild olive tree, which is natural to thee; and, contrary to nature, were grafted into the good olive tree; how much more shall they that are the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree? For I would not have you ignorant, brethren, of this mystery, (lest you should be wise in your own conceits), that blindness in part has happened in Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles should come in.

Romans 11:11-25.

The Bible clearly and unequivocally teaches that those who have been saved can be lost again. “Once saved, always saved” is a false teaching. It is incompatible with Scripture.

 

[rturner76]

For a long time I thought that grace was all that was required to be “saved” then I started looking at "salvation differently. In the Gospel of Luke the 17th chapter it says in verse 20-22

20And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:

21Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

22And he said unto the disciples, The days will come, when ye shall desire to see one of the days of the Son of man, and ye shall not see it.

I started to re-read what JESUS said about salvation and the kingdom of heaven. I concluded that The kingdom of heaven is within you right now. As long as you keep the two commandments prescribed. Love the Lord with all your heart soul and mind. Love your neighbor as yourself. You are a member of the kingdom of heaven which is rules by Jesus who sits at the right hand of the father.

When you turn your back on these two laws, you turn your back on the kingdom and are no longer living there. You can come back “home” whenever you decided with your actions to live by those 2 laws.

So…I beleive Jesus was talking about what is going on right here right now. Not necissarily what happens when you die.