Regarding statues in Churches/Chapels

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I don’t think this belongs here, but I couldn’t figure out any other place to put it.

I recently visited a chapel on a university campus in Melbourne, Australia. There were some very strange things which I won’t mention.

There was a statue of Our Lady breast feeding baby Jesus, I was just wondering whether that was an appropriate image to have in a chapel. Any ideas?
 
You mean images, such as those painted by the great Masters, like these? Not only are images like that appropriate, but the Vatican recently asked a church in England that had covered up one of their breastfeeding Madonna paintings to uncover it, as there was no indecency in the eyes of the Church.



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There’s a lot of symbolism in the Bible about breastfeeding. There’s a wonderful passage of Scripture that tells us to “suck on the nipples” of God.

If Mary had not breastfed our Lord Jesus, He would have died. (or there would have been a wet nurse, I suppose). It’s a wonderful reminder of His humanity. As a woman, I take joy in the fact that Jesus did not spurn His mother’s breast or her milk; to me, this is more proof that our bodies and their natural functions are GOOD and sinless. (As a convert from evangelical Protestantism, I was raised with the idea that our bodies are somehow “sinful” and that the spiritual things are somehow “higher.” We were taught to ignore our bodies and concentrate on spirituality.)

In the U.S., we’re so used to ta-tas as sexual objects. Of course they are, but at various times in history, other parts of the body have been considered sexual (e.g., a woman’s ankle). It’s just our messed-up culture.

The fact is, women’s breasts are designed to feed babies, and there is nothing indecent in this act. I think that if these kinds of pictures were more common in the U.S., more young women might choose to breastfeed and to stick with breastfeeding past the first few weeks, and less young men would go goggle-eyed when a woman breastfeeds.
 
I agree with Cat, we need to see more art like this, not less. This are beautiful images of the life-giving love between mother and son.

However, I want to quiblle gently with the idea thst Jesus could ever have had a wet nurse. As you say, without nursing, a child back then would have died or would have lived with severe limitations from malnutrition. So a wet nurse also imparts her life into the child because the milk is produced by her body. Also, it was common in times that had wet nurses for the child to live with his nurse until he was about 3 in order that they could be together at night also. I truly doubt the Madonna would send Jesus away for 3 years!

I know completely that you are not saying that Cat! I just am always compelled to speak up when the subject turns to nursing! 😛
Cat said:
There’s a lot of symbolism in the Bible about breastfeeding. There’s a wonderful passage of Scripture that tells us to “suck on the nipples” of God.

If Mary had not breastfed our Lord Jesus, He would have died. (or there would have been a wet nurse, I suppose). It’s a wonderful reminder of His humanity. As a woman, I take joy in the fact that Jesus did not spurn His mother’s breast or her milk; to me, this is more proof that our bodies and their natural functions are GOOD and sinless. (As a convert from evangelical Protestantism, I was raised with the idea that our bodies are somehow “sinful” and that the spiritual things are somehow “higher.” We were taught to ignore our bodies and concentrate on spirituality.)

In the U.S., we’re so used to ta-tas as sexual objects. Of course they are, but at various times in history, other parts of the body have been considered sexual (e.g., a woman’s ankle). It’s just our messed-up culture.

The fact is, women’s breasts are designed to feed babies, and there is nothing indecent in this act. I think that if these kinds of pictures were more common in the U.S., more young women might choose to breastfeed and to stick with breastfeeding past the first few weeks, and less young men would go goggle-eyed when a woman breastfeeds.
Click to expand...
 
Just to add to what has been said, images of Mary nursing Jesus comprise an entire subcategory of religious art, with its own name - Maria Lactans. Here is a page of thoughts about Maria Lactans art, with links to many examples.
 
I have a 19th century icon from Cyprus of the Madonna nursing. I wish I had a pic of it but the artist didn’t know anything about the female anatomy (yes I know icons are stylized forms and are not meant to be realistic, but the breast comes out of her neck)
 
In St. Augustine, Florida, there is a lovely little shrine of Nuestra Señora de la Leche y buen parto (Our Lady of the Milk and Happy Delivery). The statue inside is a very reverent depiction of the nursing Mother and her Child:

missionandshrine.org/chapel.htm

As St. Augustine said, “she gave milk to our Bread.” 🙂
 
There is a famous and traditional Byzantine icon called The Milk-Giver.

And there’s also a painting called “The Mystical Galactation of St. Bernard.”

For that matter, what do you think the name of the wine Liebfraumilch means?
 
What I find even more wonderful than the fact that Mary is depicted as nursing Jesus, is that in many representations he is clearly a toddler, not an infant. None of this weaning at one year stuff.
 
Bluegoat said:
What I find even more wonderful than the fact that Mary is depicted as nursing Jesus, is that in many representations he is clearly a toddler, not an infant. None of this weaning at one year stuff.
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I wouldn’t get too excited about that, in some paintings he looks like he’s ready for retirement. It’s as though the artist had never seen a baby and used a middle aged midget for a model.
 
I have only recently learned of these images of our Blessed Mother. My daughter told me something interesting regarding her recent visit to her brother-in-laws house. Both brother-in-law and wife are professed atheists. Both come from families that do not practice any religion. However, the brother-in-law’s grandmother was a practicing Catholic at one time and received the Sacraments just prior to her death. Anyway, his wife’s parents recently returned from a trip to Rome and they brought back a tapestry of a Nursing Madonna, also called “The Madonna of the Green Cushion” by Andrea Solari. Her daughter just had her second child and she wanted to breast feed again. She tried breastfeeding with her first child but gave up too soon. Their first child is 5 years old and they believe that he is a “gifted” child who is very intellegent. She loves the image on the tapestry and hung it in the nursery. One day, her 5 year old pointed at the image and said, “That’s the Mother of God!”. What an unusual thing for a 5 year old to say, much less one who has never learned about God or the Mother of God from his parents. “Who told you that? Did your grandmother tell you that?” she asked her son. “No, I knew about it when I was dead”, he replied which was another strange statement coming from a child who never suffered any near death experience.
 
I guess I have mixed feelings about paintings like this. And no I’m not a prude. I realize there’s profound symbolism in them. Everything has its proper place.

I remember going to a Catholic Lenten retreat for Holy Week back in the 1980’s in a countryside a ways in the woods with a community group of Carmelites both American and Canadian. In a beautifully wood crafted Chapel which held about 200 people, there on the sanctuary wall above the altar, a huge crucifix with the naked black corpse of Christ.

I realize this is how Jesus was officially Crucified. I can only say it was a deeply humbling spiritual experience. Its not a crucifix I would think is appropriate in all Catholic parishes.
As I said before everything has its proper place.
 
centurionguard said:
I guess I have mixed feelings about paintings like this. And no I’m not a prude. I realize there’s profound symbolism in them. Everything has its proper place.

I remember going to a Catholic Lenten retreat for Holy Week back in the 1980’s in a countryside a ways in the woods with a community group of Carmelites both American and Canadian. In a beautifully wood crafted Chapel which held about 200 people, there on the sanctuary wall above the altar, a huge crucifix with the naked black corpse of Christ.

I realize this is how Jesus was officially Crucified. I can only say it was a deeply humbling spiritual experience. Its not a crucifix I would think is appropriate in all Catholic parishes.
As I said before everything has its proper place.
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I’m with you. I’m not particularly fond of these images. But God works in mysterious ways. My daughter is praying that the image on the tapestry will be an intrument in bringing her brother-in-law and family to conversion.
 
These art forms of the Madonna and child express the intimacy that Catholics know occurred between them. I also admire the painting of Mary hanging Christ’s diapers on the clothesline. Protestants do not “get it.”

Jim Dandy
Former Protestant
 
No one should ever be ashamed of such pictures. No Catholic should ever distance themselves from these pictures. They are extremely beautiful, sacred artwork, with a profound message. In a time when many people could not read and didn’t have Bibles at their disposal as part of their regular lives, sacred artwork like this served to educate ordinary Christians about Mary’s role in our salvation and our relationship to Mary and Her Son.

Remember the original state of man and woman in the garden.

The man and his wife were both naked, yet they felt no shame. (Genesis 2:25)

This is profound. They did not experience lust, or the shame that comes with being looked at by someone who lusts. They were in perfect harmony with each other and with God. Christ came, through Mary, to restore us to the way it was in the Garden. This is one of the reasons why Adam and Eve are portrayed naked on the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel, to remind the Church that Christ came, through Mary, to restore us to our original state. It is not just a metaphor. It is real.

And Jerusalem… Jerusalem in the Old Testament is a “Type” or “Prefigurement” of our Holy Church. Mary is the mother of Christ and Christ’s body is the Church, so when we say that Christ nursed at Mary’s breast, we too, as members of Christ’s body, recieve that spiritual milk.

Rejoice with Jerusalem, and be glad for her, all you who love her; rejoice with her in joy, all you who mourn over her; that you may suck and be satisfied with her consoling breasts; that you may drink deeply with delight from the abundance of her glory." For thus says the LORD: "Behold, I will extend prosperity to her like a river, and the wealth of the nations like an overflowing stream; and you shall suck, you shall be carried upon her hip, and dandled upon her knees. As one whom his mother comforts, so I will comfort you; you shall be comforted in Jerusalem. (Isaiah 66:10-13)

Mary is the Mediatrix of Grace. The grace won by Christ on the Cross, given to us through Mary, nourishes Christ’s body - you and I as members of the Church - in the same way that the milk from Mary’s breasts nourished the Child Jesus. And that’s the whole point of such images. We are Christ’s body, and Mary, our beautiful and loving mother, nourishes us with abundant grace.

These images are extremely beautiful, and in an age when people didn’t run out to Walmart for Enfamil at eleven o’clock at night, they taught the faithful about the beautiful doctrines of our Church. We should try to learn from these sacred and holy pieces of art and cherish them. No Catholic should ever be ashamed of or shy away from them.

-Tim-
 
Cormaria said:
I don’t think this belongs here, but I couldn’t figure out any other place to put it.

I recently visited a chapel on a university campus in Melbourne, Australia. There were some very strange things which I won’t mention.

There was a statue of Our Lady breast feeding baby Jesus, I was just wondering whether that was an appropriate image to have in a chapel. Any ideas?
Click to expand...
Also remember the reading from the Feast of the Dormition/Assumption

Luke 10:38-42, 11:27-28

At that time, Jesus entered a village; and a woman called Martha received him into her house. And she had a sister called Mary, who sat at the Lord’s feet and listened to his teaching. But Martha was distracted with much serving; and she went to him and said, “Lord, do you not care that my sister has left me to serve you alone? Tell her then to help me.” But the Lord answered her, “Martha, Martha, you are anxious and troubled about many things; one thing is needful. Mary has chosen the good portion, which shall not be taken away from her.” As he said this, a woman in the crowd raised her voice and said to him, “Blessed is the womb that bore you, and the breasts that nursed you!” But he said, "Blessed rather are those who hear the word of God and keep it!"
 
These blog posts reference these very concerns:
patheos.com/blogs/badcatholic/2011/10/the-best-porn-in-the-world.html
patheos.com/blogs/badcatholic/2011/10/puritanism-hedonism-and-nudity.html

The blogger says that these types of images are considered pornographic because our society has sexualized them. They are art–something beautiful. The blogger even suggest that being able to appreciate artwork like this is the opposite of viewing pornography.

The unease of seeing these images is nothing compared to the backlash about mothers breastfeeding in public.

So this actually is two huge issues here: the sexualization of art and the whole breastfeeding thing.
 
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