Relativism

[edwest2]

Don’t you think it depends on which Catholic you ask? You’re asking a pretty broad question about Catholic point of view. We’re not a collective brain

If a Catholic is very conservative or very traditional, in my experiences (even on this forum), I’ve been told by these Cathlolics that there is only ONE brand of Truth: Theirs. And that relativism is a sin and heresy and blasphemy, yadda yadda. And that other people who don’t share their faith and morals are simply wrong.

But I don’t believe that’s a “Catholic viewpoint”. That is the viewpoint of some Catholics. Likewise, other Catholics do believe that relativism is a product of different things and that all people’s beliefs and values should be respected as long as they don’t violate other people’s rights.

Of course, the Catholic Church teaches that it’s views are the only right views. Every religion and culture believes that theirs the only right way, and relativity doesn’t apply.

Does that answer your question?

What if you joined a secular organization and they had a list of rules. The only condition for remaining a member is not breaking any rule, OK?

So, for those who see the Catholic Church as simply one of many, you need to understand that the Catholic Church is the church instituted by Jesus Christ. Also, the Catholic Church does recognize that other belief systems may have some aspects of the truth but that the Catholic Church has the fullness of truth.

Relativity is the false notion that there are always exceptions, and that black and white thinking is offensive to some. If you lived in a community and you wanted to live peacefully with your neighbors, would you steal from one of them?

Relativity allows the drug dealer to be unconcerned about his customers because he needs to make money and whatever happens to those people is entirely their fault.

Relativity leads to anarchy, with every person deciding what is right or wrong for himself.

Peace,
Ed

 

[PJM]

Originally Posted by Rence
Don’t you think it depends on which Catholic you ask? You’re asking a pretty broad question about Catholic point of view. We’re not a collective brain

If a Catholic is very conservative or very traditional, in my experiences (even on this forum), I’ve been told by these Cathlolics that there is only ONE brand of Truth: Theirs. And that relativism is a sin and heresy and blasphemy, yadda yadda. And that other people who don’t share their faith and morals are simply wrong.

But I don’t believe that’s a “Catholic viewpoint”. That is the viewpoint of some Catholics. Likewise, other Catholics do believe that relativism is a product of different things and that all people’s beliefs and values should be respected as long as they don’t violate other people’s rights.

Of course, the Catholic Church teaches that it’s views are the only right views. Every religion and culture believes that theirs the only right way, and relativity doesn’t apply.

Does that answer your question?

Friend do I understand yor position correctly?

You do not agree hat for every issue there can only be a single truth?

White is white? Sometimes?

Black is black? Sometimes?

One plus one = two? Sometimes?

The Catholic postion is founded on the concept of the reality [our perception of it] of ***absolute truths." ***What is your position founded on?

 

[Major_Tom]

Friend do I understand yor position correctly?

You do not agree hat for every issue there can only be a single truth?

White is white? Sometimes?

Black is black? Sometimes?

One plus one = two? Sometimes?

The Catholic postion is founded on the concept of the reality [our perception of it] of ***absolute truths." ***What is your position founded on?

Why not, I’ll bite…!

World War II. Lots of Americans served, certainly many of them were Catholic. Some folks decided to apply for Conscientious Objector status, and thus not actively serve. I’ll assume, for argument’s sake, that a few were Catholic. Was either one of these decisions (to serve or not to serve) wrong? According to your absolute world view premise, doesn’t one of these decisions (which are in opposition to each other) have to be considered wrong?

 

[Spirithound]

Why not, I’ll bite…!

World War II. Lots of Americans served, certainly many of them were Catholic. Some folks decided to apply for Conscientious Objector status, and thus not actively serve. I’ll assume, for argument’s sake, that a few were Catholic. Was either one of these decisions (to serve or not to serve) wrong? According to your absolute world view premise, doesn’t one of these decisions (which are in opposition to each other) have to be considered wrong?

No, it is not the case that one of the choices must be wrong. It might in fact be that serving in a particular battle might be wrong, or it might be permissible to serve in a particular battle. But if it is right, then it is permissible for everyone. If it is wrong, then it is wrong for everyone.

Being a Conscientious Objector might be permissible, or it might be wrong. If it is wrong, then there must be a moral imperative for everyone who fits that person’s profile to serve in that battle.

 

[Rence]

Friend do I understand yor position correctly?
You do not agree hat for every issue there can only be a single truth?

**No, I don’t agree that for every issue there can be only a single truth. Some issues are universally correct, such as 2+2=4 But people’s beliefs and values are molded by their life experiences. **

The Catholic postion is founded on the concept of the reality [our perception of it] of ***absolute truths." ***What is your position founded on?

I agree that the Catholic Church’s position teaches absolute truths, and imposes it on Catholics. But I can’t for the life of me understand how the Catholic Church expects non-Catholics to believe what the Catholic Church teaches as absolutely correct and true. Why would and why should non-Catholics be subject to the Catholic Church’s teachings about absolute truths? Shouldn’t their focus be on obtaining compliance from Catholics?

 

[PJM]

=Major Tom;6319419]Why not, I’ll bite…!

World War II. Lots of Americans served, certainly many of them were Catholic. Some folks decided to apply for Conscientious Objector status, and thus not actively serve. I’ll assume, for argument’s sake, that a few were Catholic. Was either one of these decisions (to serve or not to serve) wrong? According to your absolute world view premise, doesn’t one of these decisions (which are in opposition to each other) have to be considered wrong?

***Major Tom, thanks for responding

Your post reminded me to thank God for not making me to smart!

The answer to your question is:

Mark 12: 14 "And they came and said to him, “Teacher, we know that you are true, and care for no man; for you do not regard the position of men, but truly teach the way of God. Is it lawful to pay taxes to Caesar, or not? Should we pay them, or should we not?” But knowing their hypocrisy, he said to them, “Why put me to the test? Bring me a coin, and let me look at it.” And they brought one. And he said to them, “Whose likeness and inscription is this?” They said to him, “Caesar’s.” Jesus said to them, “Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s.” And they were amazed at him. "

Major the test question you pose is SUBJECTIVE, while “TRUTH” IS OBJECTIVE. One cannot use one form to address the other:thumbsup:***

Love and prayers friend,

 

[edwest2]

Rence:
The Catholic Church does not impose, it proposes. We join the Catholic Church because we believe it holds the fullness of truth. I’ve heard a number of conversion stories that say this. The Church will not force you to join. A priest will not be pounding on your door Monday because you missed Mass Sunday. The Church will not bully you into doing things. God will not force you to love Him.

Some believe that values are molded by personal experience. If some people want to reinvent the wheel, that’s fine. Some decide they are going to look around and decide for themselves. But, human beings have not changed. Yes, we have some new toys and time and labor saving devices but we still suffer from the same problems our ancestors did.

Relativism allows people to believe they can do it their way. However, there is either absolute truth or there isn’t. There is absolute truth. And there is a soul that will survive after you die.

Peace,
Ed

 

[PJM]

=edwest2;6321455]The Catholic Church does not impose, it proposes. We join the Catholic Church because we believe it holds the fullness of truth. I’ve heard a number of conversion stories that say this. The Church will not force you to join. A priest will not be pounding on your door Monday because you missed Mass Sunday. The Church will not bully you into doing things. God will not force you to love Him.

Some believe that values are molded by personal experience. If some people want to reinvent the wheel, that’s fine. Some decide they are going to look around and decide for themselves. But, human beings have not changed. Yes, we have some new toys and time and labor saving devices but we still suffer from the same problems our ancestors did.

Relativism allows people to believe they can do it their way. However, there is either absolute truth or there isn’t. There is absolute truth. And there is a soul that will survive after you die.

Peace,
Ed

***Well done Ed!

Its not important, but I AGREE***

 

[sedonaman]

… However, there is either absolute truth or there isn’t. …

At least this statement passes its own test, whereas a relativists would say there is no absolute truth, which itself claims to be an absolute truth.

 

[JanetF]

so-called “cafeteria” catholics are relativists in that they pick and choose which teachings to follow based on what they feel like following.