Religion vs Psychology

[Polluted]

One of the many arguments against Religion is that it’s simply a crutch. A Tool or a book of morals when talking about the Bible. I personally can’t stand when faith and Christ are seen in such a way. To act as if going to Church is nothing more than getting some morals and warm fuzzies to get through the week.

My problem is that I see many religious folks leaning on this outlook as well. It’s like when someone says “Thank God for your blessings because that helps you focus on the positive in your life”. While that’s true is that the MAIN reason we should give thanks to God? To remind ourselves?

Where has the magic gone in our faith. That essence that surpasses the material world? I mean bread and wine are transformed into the very blood and body of Christ. Jesus supposedly did all kinds of miracles and mystical things. The Catholic Church has entire religious sites, churches, and shrines that highlight some of the most supernatural events ever recorded.

And yet at the end of the day, so many faithful seem bound to this notion that their faith really is just a psychological pillow and crutch to lean on.

Where’s the magic going? In a secular world that screams it’s all horse pucky It’s sad to see so many faithful almost agreeing with them in their practice or how they see/preach the gospel.

 

[chaplainmom]

Our faith is not magical. Our faith is mystical. There is a very significant difference. Magical faith is immature and sees God as a Santa Claus that grants wishes. Mystical faith is mature and finds the presence of the Divine life of Jesus Christ suffering within each human person’s soul. The journey between the childhood magical faith and the mature mystical faith is a long hard road. It is wise not to judge where on this road another person is, but to rather keep walking one’s own path towards union with God. Fowler’s stages of Faith offers clarity on these different stages of faith. May Our Good Lord be with you on your journey.

amazon.com/Stages-Faith-Psychology-Development-Meaning/dp/0060628669

 

[Bill_Martin]

I always wondered what people were thinking when they say religion is a crutch.

If someone finds that religion makes life easier, then I’d question either the religion itself or his adherence to it. I have found nothing about Christianity that makes life here on Earth easier for me and a lot of things that make it more difficult. If I wanted a crutch, I’d find a religion that reinforced my own desires, gave the comfort of a merciful God when I was feeling down but not the justice of a just God when I did wrong, and that allowed convenient moral relativism when I harm others, but moral absolutism when someone harms me. Christianity is a poor crutch in this sense.

On the other hand, it is a crutch in the sense that we are all injured and ill through sin. But this is very different. In in the case of someone with a broken leg, a crutch doesn’t make life easier; it only makes life possible. It would be easier to sit on the couch all the time than to hobble around taking buses, going places, etc. Christ makes it possible for us to live, but never promised that it would be easy. The house that was built on the rock was hit by the same storm as the house built on sand.

 

[coachdennis]

I always wondered what people were thinking when they say religion is a crutch.

If someone finds that religion makes life easier, then I’d question either the religion itself or his adherence to it. I have found nothing about Christianity that makes life here on Earth easier for me and a lot of things that make it more difficult. If I wanted a crutch, I’d find a religion that reinforced my own desires, gave the comfort of a merciful God when I was feeling down but not the justice of a just God when I did wrong, and that allowed convenient moral relativism when I harm others, but moral absolutism when someone harms me. Christianity is a poor crutch in this sense.

On the other hand, it is a crutch in the sense that we are all injured and ill through sin. But this is very different. In in the case of someone with a broken leg, a crutch doesn’t make life easier; it only makes life possible. It would be easier to sit on the couch all the time than to hobble around taking buses, going places, etc. Christ makes it possible for us to live, but never promised that it would be easy. The house that was built on the rock was hit by the same storm as the house built on sand.

The choice is simple — choose a religion that helps you “escape” the realities of life or a religion that helps you “through” the realities of life. The former never works. As one wise person once said, “No one gets out of this life unscathed”

 

[AnneElizabeth]

One of the many arguments against Religion is that it’s simply a crutch. A Tool or a book of morals when talking about the Bible. I personally can’t stand when faith and Christ are seen in such a way. To act as if going to Church is nothing more than getting some morals and warm fuzzies to get through the week.

My problem is that I see many religious folks leaning on this outlook as well. It’s like when someone says “Thank God for your blessings because that helps you focus on the positive in your life”. While that’s true is that the MAIN reason we should give thanks to God? To remind ourselves?

Where has the magic gone in our faith. That essence that surpasses the material world? I mean bread and wine are transformed into the very blood and body of Christ. Jesus supposedly did all kinds of miracles and mystical things. The Catholic Church has entire religious sites, churches, and shrines that highlight some of the most supernatural events ever recorded.

And yet at the end of the day, so many faithful seem bound to this notion that their faith really is just a psychological pillow and crutch to lean on.

Where’s the magic going? In a secular world that screams it’s all horse pucky It’s sad to see so many faithful almost agreeing with them in their practice or how they see/preach the gospel.

I actually understand what you are talking about. Its like the difference between the notion that “niceness” is what Christianity is all about (superficial) vs. being crucified for the sake of love, real deep substantial nourishing love.

When I read Scriptures, and meditate and study up on the meanings (hence, not my own interpretation but the interpretation of several scholars though the centuries) and then I read up on psychology, the two are two separate belief systems.  Yet, this day and age the two have been merged- church leaders borrow ideas from it and inject it into teaching.. which to make things even more complicated with understanding the dilemma, the psychology actually helps and works for people sometimes.  So what to make about that!?   Makes one wonder what is the 'spiritual realm'?  What is the purely psychological?   Where do the two converge, separate and are they they same thing?

I don’t think anyone has any answers for you. Its like the question of this age, just like in centuries past people pondered and worked towards understanding: Is the earth flat? Should slaves be given freedom- are they really people just like us or do we have the right to keep them as slaves due to their race? Is the pharaoh truly a living god on earth? Are women really inferior to men? … You know, all those sorts of questions we take for granted now because, well, its no longer an issue. (… for most that is. I suppose you will always get someone here and there that doesn’t believe what is supposedly now common knowledge.) But each era has its questions as they discover more and more, more questions come and thus, they strive to understand more.

 Perhaps you are just looking to find something in your life with more substance and meaning.

Oh I should say that sometimes religion is a crutch… I never understood why people would use that as a put down for religion… unless they see weakness as a fault or something to be ashamed of. Heck, everyone needs a crutch now and again… that’s why people go to bars and meet up with friends after yucky day at work to talk and have some fun. That’s why people take out loans because they overspent or ends just didnt’ happen to meet up that week due to circumstances out of their control. That’s why people have affairs- they can’t get the other spouse to meet their needs so when the temptation comes they decide to grab the chance. So what is the big deal if religion is a crutch??? Not saying it should be or that it is, but even if it IS to someone… would that not be the better choice than drinking or smoking or drugs or ilicit sex (stds), being a gossip, being vain… etc. etc.

 

[AnneElizabeth]

The choice is simple — choose a religion that helps you “escape” the realities of life or a religion that helps you “through” the realities of life. The former never works. As one wise person once said, “No one gets out of this life unscathed”

I VERY much agree with this… I think too it can be said that people in that chosen religion (which ever one that is) can at times use it to ‘escape’, and sometimes not even realizing it. Though at other times with clarity it helps them through the realities of life.

So I don’t think it could be boiled down to the specific religion that is either an escape or a good guide through life but to the person. Seems like part of everyone’s fight is to seek that which is true, noble, holy, good… etc. to hold those thoughts captive, to be a berean. … if one is a Christian that is.

 

[Polluted]

I actually understand what you are talking about. Its like the difference between the notion that “niceness” is what Christianity is all about (superficial) vs. being crucified for the sake of love, real deep substantial nourishing love.

When I read Scriptures, and meditate and study up on the meanings (hence, not my own interpretation but the interpretation of several scholars though the centuries) and then I read up on psychology, the two are two separate belief systems.  Yet, this day and age the two have been merged- church leaders borrow ideas from it and inject it into teaching.. which to make things even more complicated with understanding the dilemma, the psychology actually helps and works for people sometimes.  So what to make about that!?   Makes one wonder what is the 'spiritual realm'?  What is the purely psychological?   Where do the two converge, separate and are they they same thing?

I don’t think anyone has any answers for you. Its like the question of this age, just like in centuries past people pondered and worked towards understanding: Is the earth flat? Should slaves be given freedom- are they really people just like us or do we have the right to keep them as slaves due to their race? Is the pharaoh truly a living god on earth? Are women really inferior to men? … You know, all those sorts of questions we take for granted now because, well, its no longer an issue. (… for most that is. I suppose you will always get someone here and there that doesn’t believe what is supposedly now common knowledge.) But each era has its questions as they discover more and more, more questions come and thus, they strive to understand more.

 Perhaps you are just looking to find something in your life with more substance and meaning.

Oh I should say that sometimes religion is a crutch… I never understood why people would use that as a put down for religion… unless they see weakness as a fault or something to be ashamed of. Heck, everyone needs a crutch now and again… that’s why people go to bars and meet up with friends after yucky day at work to talk and have some fun. That’s why people take out loans because they overspent or ends just didnt’ happen to meet up that week due to circumstances out of their control. That’s why people have affairs- they can’t get the other spouse to meet their needs so when the temptation comes they decide to grab the chance. So what is the big deal if religion is a crutch??? Not saying it should be or that it is, but even if it IS to someone… would that not be the better choice than drinking or smoking or drugs or ilicit sex (stds), being a gossip, being vain… etc. etc.

You captured the essence of what I was going for pretty well. What bugs me is simply for many it has become JUST a crutch and a crutch alone. And the practice itself has (at times) merged a psychological tool with the divine. At what point for us as believers does the divine become overshodowed by this phenomenon.

At what point for example does the sacrament of confession stop being this mystical sacrament which actually HEALS your bond to the complex and not fully understood web of the Trinity…and becomes simply allowing “You to forgive yourself” as one athiest friend of mine put it.

 

[AnneElizabeth]

You captured the essence of what I was going for pretty well. What bugs me is simply for many it has become JUST a crutch and a crutch alone. And the practice itself has (at times) merged a psychological tool with the divine. At what point for us as believers does the divine become overshodowed by this phenomenon.

At what point for example does the sacrament of confession stop being this mystical sacrament which actually HEALS your bond to the complex and not fully understood web of the Trinity…and becomes simply allowing “You to forgive yourself” as one athiest friend of mine put it.

I’m not sure you can’t say for everyone its become just a crutch. Again, that would be another generalization… you can’t tell by observing.

Again, I say its not a bad thing for people who are using it as a crutch. Its not the best, but its still good.
The divine will never be nor can be overshadowed by darkness. Its impossible. If it ever was, like that dark hour after Christ died, then God would have allowed it for a greater good. Romans 8:28

 

[Anony_Mous]

I am grateful that Jesus and God is a crutch for me to lean on or else I will inevitably fall without the Truth and Love to hold me up.
I am not ashamed to say “Yes! I need God, Yes! I need Jesus, Yes! I need the Truth to set me free, and it has!”

 

[multitude]

I used to believe it was simply a crutch. But if you really believe Christianity, it is hardly a crutch. There is nothing particularly comforting about the idea that you can, indeed, land in hell.

 

[fred_conty]

One of the many arguments against Religion is that it’s simply a crutch. A Tool or a book of morals when talking about the Bible. I personally can’t stand when faith and Christ are seen in such a way. To act as if going to Church is nothing more than getting some morals and warm fuzzies to get through the week.

My problem is that I see many religious folks leaning on this outlook as well. It’s like when someone says “Thank God for your blessings because that helps you focus on the positive in your life”. While that’s true is that the MAIN reason we should give thanks to God? To remind ourselves?

Where has the magic gone in our faith. That essence that surpasses the material world? I mean bread and wine are transformed into the very blood and body of Christ. Jesus supposedly did all kinds of miracles and mystical things. The Catholic Church has entire religious sites, churches, and shrines that highlight some of the most supernatural events ever recorded.

And yet at the end of the day, so many faithful seem bound to this notion that their faith really is just a psychological pillow and crutch to lean on.

Where’s the magic going? In a secular world that screams it’s all horse pucky It’s sad to see so many faithful almost agreeing with them in their practice or how they see/preach the gospel.

I don’t see it as a crutch for most people. I see it just as Jesus described it … “come to me all you who labor and are burdened and I will refresh you.”

Jesus invites us to come to him so that he may strengthen us. He left the sacraments to do just that as well as to make us one with him. He goes after the stray lambs and when he finds them, puts them on his shoulder and brings them back.

He tells us to love one another and help one another. In other words, to do what he did…“learn of me for I am meek and humble of heart.”

It is really about living the life he wishes us to live in him and he in us. The perfect example of this is Mary. It isn’t the outside, but the inside we should look at “keeping all these things in our heart” … the good news.

 

[AnneElizabeth]

I used to believe it was simply a crutch. But if you really believe Christianity, it is hardly a crutch. There is nothing particularly comforting about the idea that you can, indeed, land in hell.

I agree with you… its hardly easy to be a believing and adhereing Christian.

But I just wanted to note though that I think the OP didn’t mean it in the way you describe. From my understanding, and I could be wrong, the Op was not saying that Christianity is a crutch but that some people use it as a form of willy nilly idealistic namby pamby doctrine doesn’t matter, its about feelings type of thing. That there is no backbone, its just something people say they are and they go with the flow without any real commitment, but also that they are influenced by all of what is out there touted and shared (i.e. psychology based ideas). I guess basically that notion of "cafeteria catholic’ ? (I dont’ like that term, but maybe that might fit?) Meaning, for some, the notion of faith entails a fantasy like wishful thinking… wistful.

Am I totally off base OP or was that what you meant?

 

[multitude]

Except the thing is, most people nowadays subscribe to all sorts of ideals, ideologies. And for the most part, the secular world primarily subscribes to an age-old ideology; rationalism. Age of Enlightenment from the 18th century type of material and literature. The thing is, psychology had its beginnings at around that time. So… It is ironic accusing anyone of using religion as a crutch.