Religious Freedom

[Corki]

That is simply not true.

Sullibe is correct. MariaTS, You are confusing infallibility with ex cathedra. The Church exercises infallibility when pronouncing on matters of faith and morals. All of the matters Sullibe mentioned have been covered by the Church’s ordinary exercise of infallibility. Ex Cathedra statements are much rarer and are the Church’s extraordinary exercise of infallibility.

Please provide some documentation for your statement that the Church does not teach that Catholics have to believe Church teaching.

 

[st_lucy]

It is very illogical to believe everything in a book that was written 4000 years ago by men and only men who had a sexist agenda.

Are you calling Jesus a sexist?

I am not a he/she, I am a girl, please respect that. No single religion is the Truth, to say that is ignorant at best. If you think that people are only happy by listening to lies and propaganda, you are shrouded in ignorance.

Oh please get over yourself, I think the poster was only being polite since he/she could not see through the computer screen and tell your gender.

As a Catholic you need to know that we are the Truth and to say other wise is not believe in your faith and you probable should not be running around telling people you are truly catholic, because you causing confussion for others.

Do yourself a favor and go learn a little more about the Catholic Faith before you continue on your rampage here.

Also God is most certainly a male, because that is what Jesus said, who I am very sure knows a little more about this than you.

 

[Greg57]

Why are so many Catholics opposed to religious freedom? Many are so fixated on the false belief that Catholicism is the one true religion of the one true God that they are unable to accept other religions. Many think Catholicism should be the national religion of the USA. The reason why the USA is so great is because it has no official national language or national religion. Catholics, Jews, Buddhists, Muslims, they all have one God, it’s most likely that it is the exact same God. They both have faith in God/Allah/Yahweh. Even the religions that believe in no God or multiple God’s should be tolerated. There are many different ways into Heaven or into the Spirit World and all should be cherished and respected.

We are opposed to religious freedom? Wow…I never thought that the Church was opposed to religious freedom. In fact, Vatican II had a whole document comprised on the importance of religious freedom. I guess you must have missed that one. It’s called “Dignitatis humanae” in case you want read it and educate yourself.

The fact is, the Catholic Church is NOT a denomination. It is the Church that has its historical roots since the time of the Apostles. It can trace its origin all the way back to Pentecost which is recorded in the book of Acts. Either Christ is believed or He isn’t. And you are wrong in your assumption that there are many different ways into Heaven or into the ‘spirit’ world (whatever that’s supposed to mean). That isn’t what Jesus tells us. He specifically says that it is easier for a camel to squeeze through the eye of a needle than it is for a rich man (or woman - or anyone having more material ‘stuff’) to enter Heaven. You need to rethink your position.

 

[St_Francis]

None of this is false, it is simply based on what many Catholics have said, most assuredly not what most or all Catholics have said.

I think this is the crux of your problem. “Many Catholics” may *say *whatever they want to, but just because some or even all Catholics say something does not make what they are saying part of Catholic teaching.

Church teaching is what Christ taught the Apostles. It has been handed down through the Church which Christ founded in order to protect the truths He taught, because otherwise the situation we see the Protestants being in would have occurred a millenium and a half earlier.

It is no more possible for “whatever” to change the truths which Christ taught than it would be for “many” people to proclaim that gravity pulls things up and have that be correct.

if you want to find out what the Church actually teaches, I would suggest you read what the Church has written to tell us what the Church teaches. The Baltimore Catechism is an easier read and I find it to be more clear, but many people love the current Catechism of the Catholic Church.

 

[St_Francis]

… To claim more than an insignificant minority of Catholics believe this would be nonsense, but I never claimed that now did I?

To claim that some Catholics are against religious freedom might be accurate, but that would not change the truth that the Church has ever proclaimed religious freedom as shown by the fact that the Church has always forbidden forced conversions.

If some Catholics claim the Church does not teach religious freedom, they are simply wrong, they are not somehow changing what the Church teaches.

 

[MariaTS]

Are you calling Jesus a sexist?

Oh please get over yourself, I think the poster was only being polite since he/she could not see through the computer screen and tell your gender.

No, I’m not calling Jesus a sexist, I’m calling the men who wrote the biblical stories sexist.

How many boys do you know that are named Maria? Also, only one in four million people are hermaphrodites.

 

[st_lucy]

No, I’m not calling Jesus a sexist, I’m calling the men who wrote the biblical stories sexist.

How many boys do you know that are named Maria? Also, only one in four million people are hermaphrodites.

Well the bible was written by those God put in charge, to which would fall back on Him. Are you saying that God is sexist because He picked sexist men to write about him.

And by being hispanic I know quite a few men named Maria which is also very popular among asians as well. Not to mention being a chat room we can pick what ever name we want, by the way I am not really st. lucy.

 

[CWBetts]

I do not think you got the context of that earlier post. Also, me believing that the Christian God is female is no different than you believing that the Christian God is male. God/Goddess built us in Hir(Him/Her) image, God/Goddess has to be both male and female.

God is without gender. That being said, it is improper to refer to God in the feminine. His incarnation was male. He has always been referred to as male. Your post leads me to believe that you have allowed your thinking to become poisoned by the New Age movement.

 

[Corki]

No, I’m not calling Jesus a sexist, I’m calling the men who wrote the biblical stories sexist.

The Bible contains the inspired word of God. Are you saying the word of God is sexist or that the Bible authors were not divinely inspired?

 

[Dale_M]

How many boys do you know that are named Maria?

It is actually not uncommon in many traditionally Catholic countries (but not the United States) for Catholic parents to use Maria as a middle name for boys. For example, the author of the famous novel All Quiet on the Western Front is Erich Maria Remarque.

Similarly, it is not uncommon for male religious to adopt the name of a female saint as their “middle” name.

 

[MariaTS]

The Bible contains the inspired word of God. Are you saying the word of God is sexist or that the Bible authors were not divinely inspired?

I do not believe that the biblical authors were divinely inspired, no. Also, I have found my answer so I will post here no longer.

 

[CWBetts]

I do not believe that the biblical authors were divinely inspired, no. Also, I have found my answer so I will post here no longer.

If you hold thi, then you really should not identify yourself as Catholic.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

I do not believe that the biblical authors were divinely inspired, no. Also, I have found my answer so I will post here no longer.

Well, you are entitled to your ‘belief’ and ‘your’ answer, but one can only pray that the belief and answer are correct and truthful. Unfortunately, with your first sentence you have shown that your belief (about the author(s) of the Bible) is not a correct one, which does not appear to indicate that ‘your’ answer will be correct or truthful either.

That’s the difference between looking for ‘your’ answer and ‘the’ answer. There is only one Truth; there are many lies, half-truths and distortions. If you go looking for something that suits ‘you’, you’re likely to wind up with lies, half-truths or distortions. If you go looking for the Truth–whether or not it personally ‘suits’ you. . .you’ll be more likely to find it. May God give you insight and the courage to face that Truth.

 

[Aboveallbereal]

I do not believe that the biblical authors were divinely inspired, no. Also, I have found my answer so I will post here no longer.

Much of what you write seems to be informed by a subjective and inchoate anger so it is perhaps unwise to assume that you actually mean what you say here but frankly Maria if you do mean it then what are you so exercised about what the Church or catholics think on these issues since you are not a Roman Catholic.

That said you would not be alone is supposing you could invent your own socially liberal politically correct Jesus as a transcentalised personification of your own beliefs and claim that you remain within the Church. This kind of narcissistic self worship is a commonplace and is the de facto “religion” of millions of nominal catholics.

 

[Crimsonflyboy]

Well back to the point at hand - religious freedom. Blessed Pope Pius IX taught against religious liberty in his encyclical Quanta Cura which was promulgated December 8, 1864. This encyclical was accompanied with the Syllabus of Errors. This is what Blessed Pope Pius IX had to say about religious liberty as quoted from his encyclical Quanta Cura:

For you well know, venerable brethren, that at this time men are found not a few who, applying to civil society the impious and absurd principle of “naturalism,” as they call it, dare to teach that “the best constitution of public society and (also) civil progress altogether require that human society be conducted and governed without regard being had to religion any more than if it did not exist; or, at least, without any distinction being made between the true religion and false ones.” And, against the doctrine of Scripture, of the Church, and of the Holy Fathers, they do not hesitate to assert that “that is the best condition of civil society, in which no duty is recognized, as attached to the civil power, of restraining by enacted penalties, offenders against the Catholic religion, except so far as public peace may require.” From which totally false idea of social government they do not fear to foster that erroneous opinion, most fatal in its effects on the Catholic Church and the salvation of souls, called by Our Predecessor, Gregory XVI, an “insanity,”(2) viz., that “liberty of conscience and worship is each man’s personal right, which ought to be legally proclaimed and asserted in every rightly constituted society; and that a right resides in the citizens to an absolute liberty, which should be restrained by no authority whether ecclesiastical or civil, whereby they may be able openly and publicly to manifest and declare any of their ideas whatever, either by word of mouth, by the press, or in any other way.” But, while they rashly affirm this, they do not think and consider that they are preaching “liberty of perdition;”(3) and that “if human arguments are always allowed free room for discussion, there will never be wanting men who will dare to resist truth, and to trust in the flowing speech of human wisdom; whereas we know, from the very teaching of our Lord Jesus Christ, how carefully Christian faith and wisdom should avoid this most injurious babbling.”

The Catholic Church has always taught that all religions are not equal and must not be treated as such. Our Lord said “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me.” Our Lord did not say I am one of the ways, one of the truths, and one of the lives. Our Lord made it very clear that the only way to reach Heaven was through Jesus Christ and His Church, not through Jesus Christ or Buddha or Hinduism or Mohammed or your own conscience. This is not to say that it should be illegeal to be a non-Catholic. However governments of the world have an obligation to foster souls toward heaven and must proclaim The Catholic Church to be the true faith. Governments also have an obligation to allow non-Catholic faiths to practice their faith, but must not promote these non-Catholic faiths. For governments to promote non-Catholic faiths is to lead souls astray and is against that governments obligation to protect and lead souls to heaven. Hope this answers your question.

 

[CWBetts]

Well back to the point at hand - religious freedom. Blessed Pope Pius IX taught against religious liberty in his encyclical Quanta Cura which was promulgated December 8, 1864. This encyclical was accompanied with the Syllabus of Errors. This is what Blessed Pope Pius IX had to say about religious liberty as quoted from his encyclical Quanta Cura:

For you well know, venerable brethren, that at this time men are found not a few who, applying to civil society the impious and absurd principle of “naturalism,” as they call it, dare to teach that “the best constitution of public society and (also) civil progress altogether require that human society be conducted and governed without regard being had to religion any more than if it did not exist; or, at least, without any distinction being made between the true religion and false ones.” And, against the doctrine of Scripture, of the Church, and of the Holy Fathers, they do not hesitate to assert that “that is the best condition of civil society, in which no duty is recognized, as attached to the civil power, of restraining by enacted penalties, offenders against the Catholic religion, except so far as public peace may require.” From which totally false idea of social government they do not fear to foster that erroneous opinion, most fatal in its effects on the Catholic Church and the salvation of souls, called by Our Predecessor, Gregory XVI, an “insanity,”(2) viz., that “liberty of conscience and worship is each man’s personal right, which ought to be legally proclaimed and asserted in every rightly constituted society; and that a right resides in the citizens to an absolute liberty, which should be restrained by no authority whether ecclesiastical or civil, whereby they may be able openly and publicly to manifest and declare any of their ideas whatever, either by word of mouth, by the press, or in any other way.” But, while they rashly affirm this, they do not think and consider that they are preaching “liberty of perdition;”(3) and that “if human arguments are always allowed free room for discussion, there will never be wanting men who will dare to resist truth, and to trust in the flowing speech of human wisdom; whereas we know, from the very teaching of our Lord Jesus Christ, how carefully Christian faith and wisdom should avoid this most injurious babbling.”

The Catholic Church has always taught that all religions are not equal and must not be treated as such. Our Lord said “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me.” Our Lord did not say I am one of the ways, one of the truths, and one of the lives. Our Lord made it very clear that the only way to reach Heaven was through Jesus Christ and His Church, not through Jesus Christ or Buddha or Hinduism or Mohammed or your own conscience. This is not to say that it should be illegeal to be a non-Catholic. However governments of the world have an obligation to foster souls toward heaven and must proclaim The Catholic Church to be the true faith. Governments also have an obligation to allow non-Catholic faiths to practice their faith, but must not promote these non-Catholic faiths. For governments to promote non-Catholic faiths is to lead souls astray and is against that governments obligation to protect and lead souls to heaven. Hope this answers your question.

Note that there is no blanket condemnation of Protestants. Yes, the Fullness of Truth subsists in the Catholic Church alone, but neither is it indicated that Protestants are damned by default. DO not read more into this than what is there.