Repenting question

[ajk19]

If someone who was not Catholic and had in fact rejected Catholic teachings, were to be on his or her death bed after a particularly sinful and ungodly life, and then have a change of heart, and confess to God his apologies for everything, and accept Christ as his Lord and Savior right there and then, would he still be saved or not?

 

[yinekka]

God wills that all should be saved; the only unforgivable sin is the sin against the Holy Spirit - final impenetance i.e. not asking to be forgiven. Ultimately though whether or not anyone is saved is up to God…

 

[ajk19]

I asked because the church states that in order to be saved you must be a part of it. That if you willingly reject it, then you can’t be saved. Which would then mean that this person couldn’t be because he rejected the Church.

I personally don’t believe that though at all, in fact it’s part of why I could never see myself coming back to the church now. I left a while back for some other reasons, but now I feel in my heart I made the right decision.

 

[pigtown]

My Grandfather was not Catholic but he made sure that my Mom went to Mass regularly. When he was on his death bed he asked for a priest. I never knew him but from what my Mom told me the family was surprised that he’d want to see a priest but one was called, went to the house and baptized my Grandfather. Immediately afterwards, he went into a coma and never came out of it. So, the last thing that he was aware of was being baptized into the Catholic faith.

 

[ajk19]

For the record, in the case I mention he does not accept the Church or anything like that, but just God.

 

[trustinyou]

I asked because the church states that in order to be saved you must be a part of it. That if you willingly reject it, then you can’t be saved. Which would then mean that this person couldn’t be because he rejected the Church.

I personally don’t believe that though at all, in fact it’s part of why I could never see myself coming back to the church now. I left a while back for some other reasons, but now I feel in my heart I made the right decision.

whether you believe it or not,most christians are part of the church,(broken badly though) and as they return to her , our Lord says to st. faustina,“my wounds heal”…the good thief would be a good example of the end of ones life…i have always heard that in church to,how about you?

 

[ElizabethPH]

I asked because the church states that in order to be saved you must be a part of it. That if you willingly reject it, then you can’t be saved. Which would then mean that this person couldn’t be because he rejected the Church.

I personally don’t believe that though at all, in fact it’s part of why I could never see myself coming back to the church now. I left a while back for some other reasons, but now I feel in my heart I made the right decision.

It seems many Catholics that don’t practice their faith anymore for whatever original reason must keep coming up with excuses to keep away.

Good news!! You are still part of the Church whether you believe it or not.

 

[Kitty_Chan]

It seems many Catholics that don’t practice their faith anymore for whatever original reason must keep coming up with excuses to keep away.

Good news!! You are still part of the Church whether you believe it or not.

Elizabeth and et el

I will start by saying Im probably going to to open a can of worms here but something struck me in this thread. And it doesnt necessarily have to do directly with you ajk19.

Lately I have been thinking of similarities and differences. Today the Pastor spoke about fighting the good fight it being Rememberance Day and all. Fighting not for the fight but for things that matter. Chosing our battles and picking the good fights. The fights that end in unity rather than separation.

Sooo . . . .When its said like above

A - one is still part of the Church whether they still believe or not.

Or its said

B - One is still saved whether they still believe or not.

In both cases each has become Christs and in both cases each has to chose to remain that way.

A sees being with the Church as being with Christ
B sees being with Christ as being with the Church

Either way, the most important part is being witth Christ.

 

[ajk19]

It seems many Catholics that don’t practice their faith anymore for whatever original reason must keep coming up with excuses to keep away.

These are not excuses, I have plenty of reasons why I am no longer a Catholic. All of which I feel are legitimate as any other, and I wholeheartedly stand by them.

And just because I’m not a Catholic anymore, does not mean I can’t practice my own faith in Christ. Does it need work, absolutely I will admit that. There is a lot that needs improvement, but none of it has to do with being a Catholic.

Good news!! You are still part of the Church whether you believe it or not.

God’s Church yes, the Catholic Church (which I don’t believe to be God’s Church anymore) no. God does not reside in a church. His church, exists anywhere there is a believer in Him who acts accordingly to that belief. Being a member of a Church (be it Catholic or otherwise), has nothing to do with it.

 

[ajk19]

whether you believe it or not,most christians are part of the church,(broken badly though) and as they return to her , our Lord says to st. faustina,“my wounds heal”…the good thief would be a good example of the end of ones life…i have always heard that in church to,how about you?

I will never ever ever return to the Catholic Church. I don’t need a Church (and all that goes with it) to be saved. I believe that faith in Christ own and leading a life that is in accordance to His wants and needs, to be enough for me. Besides the Bible says: “Knock and it will be opened to you”, not “Knock and it will be opened to you provided you enter the Catholic Church”.

 

[MarcoPolo]

I will never ever ever return to the Catholic Church. I don’t need a Church (and all that goes with it) to be saved. I believe that faith in Christ own and leading a life that is in accordance to His wants and needs, to be enough for me. Besides the Bible says: “Knock and it will be opened to you”, not “Knock and it will be opened to you provided you enter the Catholic Church”.

If Christ founded a Church that shines like a light on a hill, which He did, it would be important for you to identify which Church that is if you want to live in accordance to His wants. It would be important for you to identify whether or not that Church is visible and structured with overseers or perhaps a conglomeration of persons who simply profess Christ as the Savior, or something else.

Instead of saying “I will never ever ever return to the Catholic Church” and broadcast a personal barrier you have set for yourself, I recommend phrasing the future of your faith more along the lines of “I will always always do my best to follow Christ.” Other Protestants, would you agree with my advice??

As to your original example, the answer would be unclear as to whether the person is saved or not on his deathbed, even if he consciously rejected the concept of what the Catholic Church is in his own mind. Culpability and ignorance are factors taught in Scripture and the Catholic Church. He may very well be saved.

 

[ajk19]

See this is what I take issue with, you are basically saying that simply calling on Christ in his case is not good enough, when the Bible says differently.

 

[ajk19]

Instead of saying “I will never ever ever return to the Catholic Church” and broadcast a personal barrier you have set for yourself, I recommend phrasing the future of your faith more along the lines of “I will always always do my best to follow Christ.” Other Protestants, would you agree with my advice??

No I stand by what I said, in fact I’ll go even further and say that leaving the Church is what Christ wanted me to do. So in that sense I am following Him.

 

[puzzleannie]

I asked because the church states that in order to be saved you must be a part of it. .

that is not an accurate statement of Catholic Church teaching. please check out past threads on the topic and the articles on the CA homepage on salvation for the accurate teaching.

 

[ajk19]

No thanks I think I know well enough what the Church’s stance is regarding salvation. I am aware of the fact that there are “exceptions” for people who may not know the “truth” of the Catholic faith and all that sort of thing. In any case, I reject this idea wholeheartedly.

 

[1ke]

I asked because the church states that in order to be saved you must be a part of it. That if you willingly reject it, then you can’t be saved. Which would then mean that this person couldn’t be because he rejected the Church.

That’s not what you asked. You stated that on his deathbed he accepts the Faith and asks forgiveness.

If you did not mean that he is reconciled with the Church– knowing it is God’s Church and necessary for Salvation-- they he does not have true repentance.

We do not know who is saved and who isn’t, only God does. But God does tell us what constitutes grave sin, and rejecting the Church is one of those things.

I personally don’t believe that though at all, in fact it’s part of why I could never see myself coming back to the church now. I left a while back for some other reasons, but now I feel in my heart I made the right decision.

I am sorry to hear that. Rejecting Christ’s Church is very serious indeed. I hope you will reconsider before you find yourself in the “deathbed” situation.

 

[1ke]

For the record, in the case I mention he does not accept the Church or anything like that, but just God.

Then it depends upon his full knowledge and free will. Clearly by you subsequent posts you already know this. So, I’m not sure why you even asked the question.

The Church is necessary for salvation and anyone who is saved is saved through the Church.

Since no one knows the interior knowledge and heart of the person in question no one can state whether or not he is “saved”. If he freely and knowingly rejected the Faith and obstinately refused to be reconciled, then he will have to answer for that at judgment. You cannot accept Christ and reject His Body.

 

[clmowry]

If someone who was not Catholic and had in fact rejected Catholic teachings, were to be on his or her death bed after a particularly sinful and ungodly life, and then have a change of heart, and confess to God his apologies for everything, and accept Christ as his Lord and Savior right there and then, would he still be saved or not?

Only God knows.

There is no rule that can tell us one way or another.

Chuck

 

[ajk19]

That’s not what you asked. You stated that on his deathbed he accepts the Faith and asks forgiveness.

I never said he accepts the “faith”, all I said is he accepts God into his life, no more, more less.

The Church is necessary for salvation and anyone who is saved is saved through the Church.

Sorry I don’t buy that one bit. Only God can save, not some Church.

 

[1ke]

I never said he accepts the “faith”, all I said is he accepts God into his life, no more, more less.

You stated that the person “rejected Catholic teaching” and on his deathbed “had a change of heart”.

Your OP was ambiguous as to whether that “change of heart” included repenting for rejecting the Catholic Faith and whether when he confesses “to God his apologies for everything” rejecting the Faith is included in that apology for “everything”.

So, it was important to ask for clarification.

Sorry I don’t buy that one bit. Only God can save, not some Church.

Christ and his Church are One.