Required to believe?

[a_priori]

I came to Roman Catholicism at age 53. (It’s a long story.)

Anyway, I read posts that state things like “you are required to believe such and such to be a Catholic”. The term “required to believe” is odd to me. It’s as if you can turn it on or turn it off at will. Either you believe something or you don’t.

God said “Come let us reason together.” (Isaiah 1:18) This sounds a little different than “you are required to believe”.

Being “required to believe” sounds a little too quid pro quo for an infinite God relating to His people. Your mileage may vary.

To be Catholic, it is obviously necessary to generally assent to the teachings of the Church. We cannot have our cake and eat it too. However, I know no Catholic who agrees with 100% of everything the Church now teaches. But I think that’s OK. God knows the heart.

There should non-negotiables like respect for life, etc. But there are other areas that might not be so cut and dried.

Just my :twocents:

 

[Tietjen]

I came to Roman Catholicism at age 53. (It’s a long story.)

Anyway, I read posts that state things like “you are required to believe such and such to be a Catholic”. The term “required to believe” is odd to me. It’s as if you can turn it on or turn it off at will. Either you believe something or you don’t.

God said “Come let us reason together.” (Isaiah 1:18) This sounds a little different than “you are required to believe”.

Being “required to believe” sounds a little too quid pro quo for an infinite God relating to His people. Your mileage may vary.

To be Catholic, it is obviously necessary to generally assent to the teachings of the Church. We cannot have our cake and eat it too. However, I know no Catholic who agrees with 100% of everything the Church now teaches. But I think that’s OK. God knows the heart.

There should non-negotiables like respect for life, etc. But there are other areas that might not be so cut and dried.

Just my :twocents:

If the Church has defined a Truth, I believe it. I set aside personal opinion and submit myself to Christ’s Church. Why is that hard to believe? Certainly you you know of other Catholics who embrace the Church’s dogmas 100%. If not, that’s really sad. But on the flip side, you can now say that you DO know someone who “agrees with 100% of everything the Church now teaches.” Me.

 

[a_priori]

If the Church has defined a Truth, I believe it. I set aside personal opinion and submit myself to Christ’s Church. Why is that hard to believe? Certainly you you know of other Catholics who embrace the Church’s dogmas 100%. If not, that’s really sad. But on the flip side, you can now say that you DO know someone who “agrees with 100% of everything the Church now teaches.” Me.

It has been said here that to be Catholic you are “required to believe” that Adam and Eve were literal. Will I go to Hell if I interpret the story as metaphor and that the Earth is old?

There surely must be agreement on the big issues such as the nature of Christ, etc. But it did, after all, turn out that the Earth is not the center of the solar system.

 

[Joysong]

Being a convert, you probably never memorized the Act of Faith that many older Catholics learned from grade school.
**Act of Faith **
O my God, I firmly believe that Thou art one God in three Divine Persons, Father, Son and Holy Ghost; I believe that Thy divine Son became man, and died for our sins, and that He will come to judge the living and the dead. I believe these and all the truths which the Holy Catholic Church teaches, because Thou hast revealed them, who canst neither deceive nor be deceived.

So now you know TWO people who believe.

Generally speaking, most of our truths are contained within the Creed we profess every Sunday, and further defined in the Catechism.

Anyway, I read posts that state things like “you are required to believe such and such to be a Catholic”.

Whenever I have come across a statement like that, it is usually written by a radical extremist who distorts Catholic teaching to suit their own belief system. One is always safe in following the Catechism that truly defines our beliefs.

 

[a_priori]

Being a convert, you probably never memorized the Act of Faith that many older Catholics learned from grade school.
**Act of Faith **
O my God, I firmly believe that Thou art one God in three Divine Persons, Father, Son and Holy Ghost; I believe that Thy divine Son became man, and died for our sins, and that He will come to judge the living and the dead. I believe these and all the truths which the Holy Catholic Church teaches, because Thou hast revealed them, who canst neither deceive nor be deceived.

So now you know TWO people who believe.

Generally speaking, most of our truths are contained within the Creed we profess every Sunday, and further defined in the Catechism.

Whenever I have come across a statement like that, it is usually written by a radical extremist who distorts Catholic teaching to suit their own belief system. One is always safe in following the Catechism that truly defines our beliefs.

I get your point. I don’t think you get mine. Elsewhere someone referenced a declaration by Pius XII that Genesis is “real history” and gives an account of what “really happened”.

kolbecenter.org/what_church_teaches.pdf

That may be. But if one doesn’t believe the Genesis account to be literal, they cannot be Catholic? (BTW, the Genesis account can have its intended meaning without being literal but that’s a subject for another time and place I guess.)

 

[a_priori]

Whenever I have come across a statement like that, it is usually written by a radical extremist who distorts Catholic teaching to suit their own belief system. One is always safe in following the Catechism that truly defines our beliefs.

If this is aimed at my point of view you have misunderstood. I am not a radical extremist. I possess no “belief system” to defend. I am Catholic because I believe that, although some truth can exist elsewhere, the fulness of God’s revelation to mankind is ultimately in the person of Christ. The Catholic Church is (with eastern Orthodoxy) the oldest manifestation of Christianity. That’s why I’m here.

But litmus tests based on issues such as the literal nature and origin of the physical world just don’t make sense to me.

 

[Joysong]

I see. Then what you are contending is the creation account in Genesis, and not all other teachings? This article is the author’s sole opinon, and I would need to read Pius XII’s documentation to argue some of the points. You are not required to believe every website posting … only what the Church actually teaches, which, as I said, is in the CCC.

One of the problems with interpreting scripture privately is that the reader does not distinguish the literary form under which the sacred writer presented Truth, and there are many of these different forms. Not all writing is literally historical, and we need the Church, who is the guardian of Truth, to impart the interpretation to us through the Spirit’s guidance. We don’t know the actual names of the parents, but that they WERE is undisputed, and that there was a FALL due to supreme disobedience, is truth. Etc.

If this is aimed at my point of view you have misunderstood. I am not a radical extremist. I possess no “belief system” to defend.

Now who’s misreading, my friend? I was not at all referring to you, but to the posts you mentioned, where people who use this phraseology attempt to influence others and cause them to believe error, all in the name of “the Church teaches” and you MUST believe it.

 

[itinerant1]

I came to Roman Catholicism at age 53. (It’s a long story.)

Anyway, I read posts that state things like “you are required to believe such and such to be a Catholic”. The term “required to believe” is odd to me. It’s as if you can turn it on or turn it off at will. Either you believe something or you don’t.

As Catholics we are required to believe that which is stated in the Creed. If we can do that, we are doing just fine. (By the way, I have studied and agree with everything the Church teaches. I would hope that I’m not the exception.)

The creeds, such as the Nicene and Apostles Creeds state, We believe in One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church. When we believe and understand what this means, we accept the infallible teaching authority of the popes in matters of faith and morals. Genuine Catholics believe whatever the Church defines infallibly or ex cathedra. To doubt the teaching authority of the Vicar of Christ means we do not truly believe in One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church.

Theologians refer to those Church teachings that are certain as De Fide. There are matters of theology that are less than certain than what is considered De Fide. Catholics often confuse matters of faith and morals that are De Fide with those that are not.

In any case, what the Church teaches as a matter of faith and morals for Catholics to believe is most reasonable. We should not have any difficulty accepting these truths. The important thing then is to have a correct understanding of what we believe. We do not need the understanding of a theologian, but we ought to make the effort to understand as best as we can what it is that we believe.

Here is the key: Faith is the first step. Without faith we cannot properly understand. As St. Augustine said, understanding is the reward of faith. If our faith is weak then we need to pray to Jesus and Mary for a strenthening of our faith. Faith is something we have to nurture through prayer, frequent reception of the Sacraments, frequent reading of Scripture, and so on.

Faith–use it or lose it. Faith can be compared to muscles. If we do not exercise, they weaken and eventually atrophy.

If there is something that you are having difficulty understanding or believing we can discuss it, and maybe I can help. I’ve been around the block, so I know a few things.

God bless,

itinerant1 :tiphat:

 

[a_priori]

Now who’s misreading, my friend? I was not at all referring to you, but to the posts you mentioned, where people who use this phraseology attempt to influence others and cause them to believe error, all in the name of “the Church teaches” and you MUST believe it.

I apologize. This is why I prefaced my post with “If this is aimed at my point of view”. It is sometimes difficult to know how a post is intended so I put the disclaimer in. Obviously I misunderstood.

The question remains, what do you have to believe in order to be Catholic? Where is the line? It is in different places for different people it seems.

 

[Joysong]

Apology joyfully accepted.

I noticed an excellent point in the previous post that explains the problem with distortions:

Theologians refer to those Church teachings that are certain as De Fide. There are matters of theology that are less than certain than what is considered De Fide. Catholics often confuse matters of faith and morals that are De Fide with those that are not.

And in their confusion, transmit it to others as dogma.

What are we to believe? The essentials are in the Ten Commandments, the Precepts of the Church, the Creed, and the CCC. If any statements made in the CCC are unclear to you, it is best not to go on Catholic Answers, because for every positive teaching, there may be a negative from one of those extremists we dared to mention above … but go see your priest. If that does not erase the doubt, then as we do in medicine, get a ‘second opinion.’ And PRAY hard for guidance!

Kind regards,
Carole

 

[MrS]

There surely must be agreement on the big issues such as the nature of Christ, etc. But it did, after all, turn out that the Earth is not the center of the solar system.

I must have missed that … can you link to anything that has taken either theory (geo, or helio) and proclaimed it fact?

Regardless, it is not a big issue. The Real Presence, sacraments, atonement, eternal life, etc are much “bigger issues”.

As another poster stated… our Faith supports our beliefs. When the Church is right on all the other things (as Dr Hahn once said), I can assent to the one thing** I** have a problem with.

.

 

[Conservative]

I think Tietjen said it so well.
What Holy Mother the Church defines for us, we are required to accept and believe. Belonging to a church is like belonging to a club. You follow the rules. You are entitled to disagree with some rules but unless the club (in our case, the Church) offers the option, we’ve got to follow the rules. It’s what is called blind faith. and sometimes it’s hard. We’re just human. God gives us the gift of free will - to accept or not. Whether the story of Adam & Eve is precise or a metaphor, we are required, I think (since I’m no theologian) to accept as the Bible tells us. But it amounts to the first woman and man being tricked by evil into disobeying God. With that disobedience came the loss of all the gifts God offered in the Garden of Eden. Was it an apple? I wasn’t there - but the facts sure make sense. At this point, I just need to save my soul. Maybe that’s just blind or childlike faith.

Our Catholic Faith is unique in particular aspects - one being that we have a Pope who when he speaks on matters of Faith and Morals is infallible. Other faiths don’t have that. We may question but our salvation depends on following the rules.

It’s amazing, how everyone remembers baseball player Tug McGraw’s words of years ago that are often quoted - "you gotta’ believe !’ A baseball player’s words seem to have made the news, resonated through the years and inspired many with confidence when the chips are down …God’s or our Faith’s we put up for debate ???
Blessed are they who have not seen and yet have believed.

 

[John_Russell_Jr]

My understanding is we are required to believe in the deposit of faith - scripture and tradition, and to all the teaching on faith and morals by the popes - papal magisterium. If the pope stamps it it’s ok.