Research Pertinent to the Boy Scouts of America Policy Change Debate

[buffalo]

Research Pertinent to the Boy Scouts of America Policy Change Debate

A National Association for Research and Therapy of Homosexuality White Paper

Michelle Cretella, M.D. and David C. Pruden, M.S.
The National Association for Research and Therapy of Homosexuality (NARTH) is a professional, scientific organization that offers therapeutic assistance to those who struggle with unwanted homosexuality. As an organization, NARTH disseminates educational information, conducts and collects scientific research, promotes effective therapeutic treatment, and provides referrals to those who seek our assistance.

In keeping with NARTH’s commitment to science and education, NARTH offers the following synopsis of scientific research on homosexuality that may be helpful to the national council of the Boy Scouts of America as it deliberates a change in policy that would allow homosexually-identified youth as members.[1]

****The development of homosexuality is influenced by environment. ****

.

Homosexuality is not an unchangeable biologically determined trait like race. The American Psychological Association reports, “There is no consensus among scientists about the exact reasons that an individual develops a heterosexual, bisexual, gay or lesbian orientation. Although much research has examined the possible genetic, hormonal, developmental, social, and cultural influences on sexual orientation, no findings have emerged that permit scientists to conclude that sexual orientation is determined by any particular factor or factors. Many think that nature and nurture both play complex roles…”[2]
The environment, including family dynamics, peer interactions and other social factors, can contribute significantly to the formation of one’s sexual orientation. Sexual orientation is not fixed at birth but rather is environmentally influenced and unfolds slowly across childhood, adolescence and even into adulthood for some individuals.[3]

more…

 

[SaintFrancis333]

This should be promoted more openly. It always pains me coming across the argument that someone was “born” that way. God does not create people to fail. He gives us all crosses but we choose whether or not to carry said cross.

 

[Dakota_Roberts]

This should be promoted more openly. It always pains me coming across the argument that someone was “born” that way. God does not create people to fail. He gives us all crosses but we choose whether or not to carry said cross.

God doesn’t make people gay anymore than he makes some people blind, deaf, stupid or missing limbs.

 

[StJudeprayforme]

Regardless of what one thinks the causes of homosexuality are, reparative therapy, which NARTH promotes, has been shown to be psychologically damaging, and really shouldn’t be promoted, especially for minors.

On the issue of the Boy Scouts: Scouting is a character development program first and foremost (if you ever work for the Scouts, they will emphasize this in the training…) I don’t see how having openly gay scouts hurts this end, if anything, the BSA’s contact with religious groups (including many Catholic parishes) may bring young men who have had little to no contact with religion into contact with it (this is actually something that is advertised in many of the speeches I have heard at Eagle Courts of Honor.) If a young man who struggles with homosexual tendencies is brought into contact with the Church through scouting, I think that is a good thing, and the inclusion of them in scouting I think is in line with the Church’s call to avoid unjust discrimination.

 

[fix]

Regardless of what one thinks the causes of homosexuality are, reparative therapy, which NARTH promotes, has been shown to be psychologically damaging, and really shouldn’t be promoted, especially for minors.

On the issue of the Boy Scouts: Scouting is a character development program first and foremost (if you ever work for the Scouts, they will emphasize this in the training…) I don’t see how having openly gay scouts hurts this end, if anything, the BSA’s contact with religious groups (including many Catholic parishes) may bring young men who have had little to no contact with religion into contact with it (this is actually something that is advertised in many of the speeches I have heard at Eagle Courts of Honor.) If a young man who struggles with homosexual tendencies is brought into contact with the Church through scouting, I think that is a good thing, and the inclusion of them in scouting I think is in line with the Church’s call to avoid unjust discrimination.

And if the scout is not open to proper formation what about the other kids? Do they have rights? Is it unjust discrimination to protect all and not partake of one who has an agenda contrary to the moral norm?

 

[fix]

Premature sexual identity labeling comes with associated risks for youth.

That part of the OP is a good point that is often left out. People are quick to talk about unjust discrimination or how wonderful it is to include children who mistakenly self identify as “gay”. But, the point is this false identification is harmful. The truth is they need help not public affirmation of their mistaken identity.

 

[buffalo]

Regardless of what one thinks the causes of homosexuality are, reparative therapy, which NARTH promotes, has been shown to be psychologically damaging, and really shouldn’t be promoted, especially for minors.

.

Source?

 

[StJudeprayforme]

And if the scout is not open to proper formation what about the other kids? Do they have rights? Is it unjust discrimination to protect all and not partake of one who has an agenda contrary to the moral norm?

I don’t think many young boys at age 12 have an agenda. Very few new people join scouting after the age of 14. Most of the older boys, the ones who are capable of “having an agenda”, have been in the program for a while.

buffalo:

Source?

nytimes.com/2009/08/06/health/06gay.html?adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1369238887-CD7jYMLaDt/IdKRP5xP76A

From the NYT, but based off of the AP wire report, so little editorial bias. You will notice that the APA in its resolution told psychiatrists to be more open to people of religious faith, and told them to consider celibacy as an option, so this isn’t exactly the stereotype of the APA that you get from NARTH. The APA panal reviewed 83 studies conducted since 1960 on conversion therapy, so I would say its findings are based on the evidence.

 

[fix]

I don’t think many young boys at age 12 have an agenda. Very few new people join scouting after the age of 14. Most of the older boys, the ones who are capable of “having an agenda”, have been in the program for a while.

Then there is no need for a 12 year old to disclose his sexual desires.

 

[StJudeprayforme]

Then there is no need for a 12 year old to disclose his sexual desires.

I don’t particularly care to know about the sexual desires of anyone, regardless of age. This doesn’t mean that for one reason or another the boy of 12 might be openly gay. If he is, I still doubt he has any agenda.

In all honesty, the whole debate is about the boys who are in high school more than anything else, and as I have noted above, very few new guys join at this age. The issue arises when you have a boy of 16, who has been with the troop since he was 12, or even 6 if he did cub scouts, and decides to come out. He is likely friends with all of the other guys in the troop and has one leadership role or another, and could be well on his way to Eagle or even have it.

Kicking him out at this point does little good for anyone. It could end relationships that are stabilizing factors in his life, and also create a bad taste in his mouth for the scouting movement, which as a whole does a lot for the good of young men. If he creates issues by pushing an agenda, you take him aside and talk to him about it. This is the same thing you would do with any scout who is pushing an agenda and becoming a distraction to others.

 

[Dakota_Roberts]

And if the scout is not open to proper formation what about the other kids? Do they have rights? Is it unjust discrimination to protect all and not partake of one who has an agenda contrary to the moral norm?

Agenda? At that age the agenda is to fit in and have fun.

Then there is no need for a 12 year old to disclose his sexual desires.

By the time that 12 year old is 16 something may have slipped out.

 

[buffalo]

[LGBT rights claims and bogus science: yet another example](http://www.turtlebayandbeyond.org/2...claims-and-bogus-science-yet-another-example/)

Last week we reported about a hopelessly un-scientific “LGBT Survey” published and promoted by the EU’s Fundamental Rights Agency (FRA) as part of a larger effort to push its absurd “anti-discrimination” agenda, in particular a directive that would eliminate important civil freedoms such as the freedom of conscience and the freedom of contract.

This has angered several political figureheads of the homosexualist agenda. However, when asked to provide a substantial argumentwhy the FRA Survey (which cost the European taxpayer 370.000 Euro, i.e. roughly 5 US$ for each of the replies received) was not “bogus”, they remained conspicuously silent. Are they still searching for arguments, or are they aware that they have none?
The leading Austrian newspaper “Die Presse” commented:

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[buffalo]

I don’t think many young boys at age 12 have an agenda. Very few new people join scouting after the age of 14. Most of the older boys, the ones who are capable of “having an agenda”, have been in the program for a while.

nytimes.com/2009/08/06/health/06gay.html?adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1369238887-CD7jYMLaDt/IdKRP5xP76A

From the NYT, but based off of the AP wire report, so little editorial bias. You will notice that the APA in its resolution told psychiatrists to be more open to people of religious faith, and told them to consider celibacy as an option, so this isn’t exactly the stereotype of the APA that you get from NARTH. The APA panal reviewed 83 studies conducted since 1960 on conversion therapy, so I would say its findings are based on the evidence.

Are you kidding - you do know the AP is the NYT?

Did you view this? Was Never Done," Says Former A.P.A. President in Interview

 

[buffalo]

Then there is no need for a 12 year old to disclose his sexual desires.

Correct - a chaste same sex attracted individual of any age is under no obligation to do so.

Fact: The earlier a boy starts flirting with homosexuality the greater the chance he will adopt it.

 

[buffalo]

I don’t particularly care to know about the sexual desires of anyone, regardless of age. This doesn’t mean that for one reason or another the boy of 12 might be openly gay. If he is, I still doubt he has any agenda.

In all honesty, the whole debate is about the boys who are in high school more than anything else, and as I have noted above, very few new guys join at this age. The issue arises when you have a boy of 16, who has been with the troop since he was 12, or even 6 if he did cub scouts, and decides to come out. He is likely friends with all of the other guys in the troop and has one leadership role or another, and could be well on his way to Eagle or even have it.

Kicking him out at this point does little good for anyone. It could end relationships that are stabilizing factors in his life, and also create a bad taste in his mouth for the scouting movement, which as a whole does a lot for the good of young men. If he creates issues by pushing an agenda, you take him aside and talk to him about it. This is the same thing you would do with any scout who is pushing an agenda and becoming a distraction to others.

The he needs to be discrete. In fact, even those boys whose hormones may be confusing them at this age, given enough time they normalize. It is damaging to encourage them to “come out”.

 

[buffalo]

Religious leaders, families urge Scouts to stay with tradition as vote on gay membership looms

IRVING, TX, May 22, 2013 ([LifeSiteNews](http://www.lifesitenews.com))  – As the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) prepare to vote Thursday on  whether to allow openly homosexual members, thousands of current and  former scouts and dozens of religious leaders are urging the  organization to stand up to “intimidation” by gay activists and stay  true to its roots.
Nearly 19,000 scouts, former scouts, and members of scouting families  signed a petition to the BSA, urging the group to “uphold the values  that have defined the organization for over 100 years.”
“The Boy Scouts should once again stand firm on moral principles that  have successfully shaped our nation’s boys into leaders for  generations,” said Alliance Defending Freedom (ADF) spokesman David  Cortman, whose group delivered the petition to the BSA. “This is the  expressed desire of thousands of Scouts and their families who have  signed this petition. The Constitution protects the Boy Scouts’ freedom  to promote the values that have defined the organization and to ensure  that its leaders and members adhere to those values.” 
A group of fifty U.S. religious leaders have also signed a [joint statement](http://touchstonemag.com/merecomments/2013/05/statement-religious-leaders-boy-scouts/) encouraging the BSA to maintain its current standards.
“We strongly support the Boy Scouts of America current prohibition on  open homosexuality and retaining it without revision,” the statement  reads. “Nearly 70 percent of BSA troops are hosted by churches and  religious institutions. Upholding traditional morality is vital for  sustaining this partnership, for protecting Scout members, and for  ensuring BSA has a strong future.”

more…

 

[StJudeprayforme]

[LGBT rights claims and bogus science: yet another example](http://www.turtlebayandbeyond.org/2...claims-and-bogus-science-yet-another-example/)

Sorry if I don’t take a blog that seems to focus on hyped up stories seriously.

Are you kidding - you do know the AP is the NYT?

Did you view this? “Unbiased, Open Research [on Homosexuality] Was Never Done,” Says Former A.P.A. President in Interview

False. The AP is owned by 1,400 national newspapers and is the standard for journalism in the United States, and is generally speaking considered to be the most unbiased source for news in the US.

Yes. That is why the APA did a survey of 83 research studies to account for biases.

The he needs to be discrete. In fact, even those boys whose hormones may be confusing them at this age, given enough time they normalize. It is damaging to encourage them to “come out”.

There is a difference between encouraging someone to come out and believing it is wrong to stigmatize them when they do come out. I don’t think the BSA is encouraging teenage boys to come out by simply saying that they aren’t going to kick them out.

Also, are you implying that homosexuality normalizes itself out for anyone who doesn’t come out? This is simply false. While we may not know the cause of homosexuality, and while there are certainly cases where it is a phase, there are plenty of people who it is something that they have to deal with for their entire lives. To imply otherwise stands in opposition to official Church documents that recognize this.

A group of fifty U.S. religious leaders have also signed a joint statement encouraging the BSA to maintain its current standards.

You will notice that there is not a single Catholic priest or bishop on that list.

 

[buffalo]

NY Times Exposes the “Gay Marriage” Myth

              **... and no one seems surprised**




                                                                   **NY Times Exposes the "Gay Marriage" Myth **

              **... and no one seems surprised**

                       
                  

                 by Tom  Hoopes                   *Thursday, February 11, 2010 6:20 PM Comments [(97)](http://www.ncregister.com/blog/ny_times_exposes_the_gay_marriage_myth/#blogComments)*                                                                                                      I found it ironic that *The New York Times* blew the lid off of homosexual “marriage” just when I was talking about it with my Christianity in Mass Media class.

You hadn’t heard that The New York Times utterly destroyed the homosexual marriage argument and left it in fragments on the ground? They did — while pretending they weren’t. “Many Successful Gay Marriages Share an Open Secret,” is the Jan. 29 story by Scott James.
Here’s how it begins:
“When Rio and Ray married in 2008, the Bay Area women omitted two words from their wedding vows: fidelity and monogamy.”
The story said:
“A study to be released next month is offering a rare glimpse inside gay relationships and reveals that monogamy is not a central feature for many.” The report offers five sentences of rationalization for every sentence of factoid. But the gist remains: Those who argue for heterosexual marriage were right all the time. Homosexual “marriages” aren’t really marriages in the way we define them.
The article even says that homosexual marriage may end marriage altogether, though it doesn’t put it quite that way: “Some experts say boundary-challenging gay relationships represent an evolution in marriage — one that might point the way for the survival of the institution.”

more…

 

[buffalo]

Sorry if I don’t take a blog that seems to focus on hyped up stories seriously.

False. The AP is owned by 1,400 national newspapers and is the standard for journalism in the United States, and is generally speaking considered to be the most unbiased source for news in the US. You are correct, my bad

Yes. That is why the APA did a survey of 83 research studies to account for biases. APA is biased itself

There is a difference between encouraging someone to come out and believing it is wrong to stigmatize them when they do come out. I don’t think the BSA is encouraging teenage boys to come out by simply saying that they aren’t going to kick them out.

Also, are you implying that homosexuality normalizes itself out for anyone who doesn’t come out? This is simply false. While we may not know the cause of homosexuality, and while there are certainly cases where it is a phase, there are plenty of people who it is something that they have to deal with for their entire lives. To imply otherwise stands in opposition to official Church documents that recognize this. Yes indeed, many gender confused teens by age 25 are normal.

You will notice that there is not a single Catholic priest or bishop on that list.

So?

Catholic Medical Association

Question:

What are the warning signs that a child is at risk
for developing SSA?
Answer:
If a child exhibits symptoms of GID, which include
identi!cation with the opposite sex, limited ability to bond with same-sex p
eers, lack of rough-and-tumble play in boys, cross-dressing, discomfort with their own sex, and social anxiety, he or she is at highrisk. If GID in childhood is left untreated, approx imately 75% of children will go on todevelop same-sex attractions.
15

Question:

Can SSA be prevented?
Answer:
Yes. Early identi!cation of at-risk children, along with appropriate psychothera-
py and parental support, are key factors leading to successful prevention and treatment ofthe emotional pain in these children and adolescents.
16

How effective is therapy for SSA?
Answer:
While there are no guarantees, there have been numerous reports of successful
therapy for SSA. 24 Success depends on many factors including the professional expertise of the mental-health professional, the relationshipbetween therapist and client, the length of treatment, the presence of other psychological problems, substance-abuse problems, or sexual addiction. It is impossible to predict ou
tcomes. A recent study of 200 men and women who had sought professional help to deal with SSA found that 64% of the men and 43% of the women subsequently identi!ed themselves as heterosexual. 25 Failure to achieve one’s goal in therapy can be discouraging. However, contrary to claims made by the opponents of therapy, studies do not show an in crease in psychological distress as a result of therapy.
26

 

[StJudeprayforme]

So?

Catholic Medical Association

Question:

What are the warning signs that a child is at risk
for developing SSA?
Answer:
If a child exhibits symptoms of GID, which include
identi!cation with the opposite sex, limited ability to bond with same-sex p
eers, lack of rough-and-tumble play in boys, cross-dressing, discomfort with their own sex, and social anxiety, he or she is at highrisk. If GID in childhood is left untreated, approx imately 75% of children will go on todevelop same-sex attractions.
15

Question:

Can SSA be prevented?
Answer:
Yes. Early identi!cation of at-risk children, along with appropriate psychothera-
py and parental support, are key factors leading to successful prevention and treatment ofthe emotional pain in these children and adolescents.
16

How effective is therapy for SSA?
Answer:
While there are no guarantees, there have been numerous reports of successful
therapy for SSA. 24 Success depends on many factors including the professional expertise of the mental-health professional, the relationshipbetween therapist and client, the length of treatment, the presence of other psychological problems, substance-abuse problems, or sexual addiction. It is impossible to predict ou
tcomes. A recent study of 200 men and women who had sought professional help to deal with SSA found that 64% of the men and 43% of the women subsequently identi!ed themselves as heterosexual. 25 Failure to achieve one’s goal in therapy can be discouraging. However, contrary to claims made by the opponents of therapy, studies do not show an in crease in psychological distress as a result of therapy.
26

1. I am not disputing the fact that for some people homosexuality is a phase. I think you also need to admit that for some people it is not.
2. The APA surveyed 83 studies on conversion therapy. It also called for therapists to be more open to celibacy as an option. I’m fine with admitting that they might be biased, as long as you admit that NARTH might be biased as well. Surveying 83 different studies does its best to account for bias. Also, I don’t really see why many people who support the Church’s teaching are so in favour of conversion therapy to the point of ignoring a lot of the evidence against it. Regardless of whether or not homosexuality is curable for most people, homosexual sex is still in violation of the Church’s moral norms even if it is something that cannot be taken away.
3. I don’t really value the contribution of Evangelical Protestants on anything related to homosexuality. Generally speaking, while they came to the same conclusion as the Church in regards to homosexual genital activity, they are also pretty homophobic and stand in opposition to the Church’s call against unjust discrimination. The list of religious leaders you linked to were almost exclusively Evangelicals, with the exception of some of the more conservative Anglican groups. I’m sorry if their opposition to something doesn’t really convince me that much as an orthodox Catholic.