Resignation

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And people wonder why people in their late teens are leaving the church in droves, including an 18 yearold brother of mine by the way. Anyone who expects an 18 yearold to be as mature in handling all this manusha as a 48 yearold is a couple beers short of a six pack. This kind of stridentness caused all 3 of my brothers to leave the church. Resurection life gobbled up one of them.
Any person should be able to see the possibility of the sin of scandal especially someone who wants a leadership position in the Church.

Everyone needs to live by the rules, they are not age specific.

Also, if someone wants to hold a position of leadership then they better be mature enough to do so.

Lowering the bar for them is hypocritical. Why should they live the rules at 48 if it is not expected of them at 18?
 
I am born raised and live in Grand Rapids. I can tell you the historys of the west side and some northeast side parishes till you’d fall asleep from boerdom. I have ancestors that help build StJames( Obrien RD is named after him) St may’s in marne, St Joseph the worker, and shirttail wise St Adelberts Go to St Francis Xavier in GR and look at who donatedd the bptismal gates, Im his direct descendent… Maria is a transsexual woman, which means in mind and soul she is a female, but in anatamy she is male. Just utter the word transsexual near where I live and listen to all the mayhem it will cause. These people think their highschool education makes them know everything. I am transsexual myself and VERY slowly transitioningand I have gotten static myself for my feminine hairstyle.The only reason nothing has been done to me is that I am healthy and strong enough to stuff anyone who attacks me into a garbage can at my will. If I were you Maria Id do some research and maybe look for a chapel like a Dominican chapel to get involved in. Do your reasearch and see what you can get involved with.
That explains much, thank you. My comments assumed that Maria was genetically female. The imposition of transexuality into the mix creates a completely different set of circumstances. However, though the Church would not be able to endorse such a lifestyle, no human being should ever be threatened with physical violence or treated with indignity or disrepect.

Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+
 
Again… it has NOTHING to do with age. I have two sons in the exact age category give or take, and they haven’t left. They have been taiught the TRUTH, not the lies of Satan that many are teaching our young ones today. Thus their love of the Church will keep them here for life. And BTW, I have a full six pack:D.
My parents taught the truth also. But teaching in the household I grew up in meant drving it into you. We were given lectures at the dinner table about the evilness on John Calvin, and King Henry the 8th. We had comparisons talked about at the dinner table how people in early times that converted to the Roman church wwere successfull while peoples who converted to Arianism fell by the wayside. The head knocking approach to teaching Catholicism to some teens doesn’t work,especially for teens who think for themselves and are not mind numbed robots.
 
That explains much, thank you. My comments assumed that Maria was genetically female. The imposition of transexuality into the mix creates a completely different set of circumstances. However, though the Church would not be able to endorse such a lifestyle, no human being should ever be threatened with physical violence or treated with indignity or disrepect.

Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+
For you information and edification. Transsexuality is not a lifestyle. Its a deep deep down intrinsic feeling of being trapped in the wrong body,and wrong role in life. So many feel so much out of sorts that by the age of 20 half of all transsexuals have attempted suicide at least once. The only reason I have never attempted my self being transsexual myself is my parents saying while I was growing up that all who commit suicide go to Hell, so that struck fear in me. Oficially the church has no official definative stand on the issue. In a later post Ill pull up a secret Vatican document that even okays the surgery for some people. Thankyou for being considerate.
 
Any person should be able to see the possibility of the sin of scandal especially someone who wants a leadership position in the Church.

Everyone needs to live by the rules, they are not age specific.

Also, if someone wants to hold a position of leadership then they better be mature enough to do so.

Lowering the bar for them is hypocritical. Why should they live the rules at 48 if it is not expected of them at 18?
Let me explain a few things for you. I do live by every rule set forth in the Bible, the Catechism, Dogma, and Doctrine. I am not involved in any scandal, I simply cannot afford to pay for housing by myself. It’s not like I sleep in the same bed with anyone. I need a hospital bed and a breathing machine at night. Also, I only get $472 a month if I do not work. I was making upwards of $1500 a month. Even so, I simply cannot afford to pay rent alone. Or do you believe that everyone should live alone? I guess dorms should be outlawed, then. Oh, by the way, I am in university, it is just to dangerous for me to live in a dorm, in case you do condone dorms. I did not resign from my church due to maturity level, I resigned because it was too dangerous for me to remain active in that specific church. I do firmly believe that I will be hired for another job at another church shortly, because I have several interviews scheduled over the weekend. Also, my qualifications exceed the requirements and due to situations beyond my control, I am legally obligated to take lower pay. I, personally, believe that a person should teach proper church teaching and I will admit that I did not teach all of church teaching simply because young children should not be exposed to any discussion on sex or sexuality, that is up to the parents. Also, everything about myself is now properly aligned with church teaching. I will, also, agree that lowering the bar is hypocritical.
 
Nope. Age has nothing to do with it. Teaching what the Church teaches is all anyone here is asking her to do. If that is what you call an “intricate detail”, then we must disagree, because I see it as a MAJOR detail. And that is the big picture.
You are mostly right that teaching what the church teaches is all anyone is asking me to do if you are, in fact, referring to the majority of the posters on this forum. However, at the church I used to work at, that was not all anyone was asking. They did far more, far worse. I have been raped on church property, beaten on church property, threatened on church property, over a period of several years, by men who claim to be Catholic, by men who think I am a danger or a threat to their children and think that I am disposable, worthless. And, if you in any way try to justify what these men have done, these sick, evil, perverted men, then you are less of a person than I thought you were. However, I do not expect that you will, so I will take what say seriously and address you as such. I almost forgot, I do teach what the church teaches and I do so properly and without a second though. I will not sugar coat or liberalize what the church teaches, I am a staunch Conservative and devout Catholic and, now, nothing will ever change this. I used to have some questions or disagreements, now I have none, no qualms about Church teaching. However, I still have the right to disagree with Church officials and parishioners on the interpretation of Church teaching. However, I will, always, do so in a respectful manner no matter how I am treated. I shall not, ever, fully condone anything that the Pope says unless it is an infallible statement, of which there have only been two stated by Popes in all of Church history. Absolute infallibility is nothing that any Pope can lay claim to for that is not, truly or by church definition, infallibility.
 
So many feel so much out of sorts that by the age of 20 half of all transsexuals have attempted suicide at least once.
Also, 70% of all Transsexual/Transgendered Women will attempt suicide at least once, on average two or three times, in their lifetimes. And roughly 50% of those Transsexual/Transgendered Women, who attempt suicide, will be successful in their suicide attempts. In addition, throughout the world, an average of 8% to 12% of Transsexual/Transgendered Women will be murdered. And most of the time, these Transsexual/Transgendered Women are not simply murdered, they are brutally slaughtered. That gives an average of 45% of Transsexual/Transgendered Women dead by either Murder or Suicide. So only 55% of Transsexual/Transgendered Women die by either Medical Negligence or Natural Causes. For every non-Transsexual/Transgendered Woman death by Natural Causes occurs in 98% to 99.99% of cases across the world.
 
For you information and edification. Transsexuality is not a lifestyle.
I recognize that, like homosexuality, transsexuality is an orientation as well as a lifestyle that often proceeds from that orientation.

Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+
 
Let me explain a few things for you. I do live by every rule set forth in the Bible, the Catechism, Dogma, and Doctrine. I am not involved in any scandal, I simply cannot afford to pay for housing by myself. It’s not like I sleep in the same bed with anyone. I need a hospital bed and a breathing machine at night. Also, I only get $472 a month if I do not work. I was making upwards of $1500 a month. Even so, I simply cannot afford to pay rent alone. Or do you believe that everyone should live alone? I guess dorms should be outlawed, then. Oh, by the way, I am in university, it is just to dangerous for me to live in a dorm, in case you do condone dorms. I did not resign from my church due to maturity level, I resigned because it was too dangerous for me to remain active in that specific church. I do firmly believe that I will be hired for another job at another church shortly, because I have several interviews scheduled over the weekend. Also, my qualifications exceed the requirements and due to situations beyond my control, I am legally obligated to take lower pay. I, personally, believe that a person should teach proper church teaching and I will admit that I did not teach all of church teaching simply because young children should not be exposed to any discussion on sex or sexuality, that is up to the parents. Also, everything about myself is now properly aligned with church teaching. I will, also, agree that lowering the bar is hypocritical.
I am sorry but opposite sexes living together do cause scandal.

From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

2284 Scandal is an attitude or behavior which leads another to do evil. The person who gives scandal becomes his neighbor’s tempter. He damages virtue and integrity; he may even draw his brother into spiritual death. Scandal is a grave offense if by deed or omission another is deliberately led into a grave offense.

2285 Scandal takes on a particular gravity by reason of the authority of those who cause it or the weakness of those who are scandalized. It prompted our Lord to utter this curse: “Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a great millstone fastened round his neck and to be drowned in the depth of the sea.” Scandal is grave when given by those who by nature or office are obliged to teach and educate others. Jesus reproaches the scribes and Pharisees on this account: he likens them to wolves in sheep’s clothing.

As you can see in paragraph 2285, the scandal is grave when it is committed by those who are to teach others, as a youth minister does.

So until you can afford to live on your own you should avoid all leadership (if not all lay ministerial) positions.
 
I am sorry but opposite sexes living together do cause scandal…
I know that there are many public colleges which have coeducational dormitories and coed rooms, but I don;t know if there are any Catholic colleges which have this.
 
MariaTS, I am very, very sorry for what you have had to endure at your current parish. Nothing, and I mean nothing, ever justifies that sort of treatment. About your being a transseuxual though, I have a sincere question-- if God made you as a certain gender, as far as your anatomy, doesn’t that mean that He intended for you to be that gender, no matter what you feel yourself to be? (I’m just trying to understand, as I don’t know your thinking on this matter.)
 
Many eons ago when I was a Newspaper carrier. I had a little old Polish lady for a customer, yes and Catholic too( No non Catholic Polish in my neck of the woods). She had living in her house a guy maybe about 20 years her junior, who was like a permanent border. They lived under the same roof, but different bed rooms. It was purely a financial arrangement and nothing else. Wondering what the church would think of that…
 
MariaTS, I am very, very sorry for what you have had to endure at your current parish. Nothing, and I mean nothing, ever justifies that sort of treatment. About your being a transseuxual though, I have a sincere question-- if God made you as a certain gender, as far as your anatomy, doesn’t that mean that He intended for you to be that gender, no matter what you feel yourself to be? (I’m just trying to understand, as I don’t know your thinking on this matter.)
Then what does God intend for someone who is intersexual to be then?
 
I recognize that, like homosexuality, transsexuality is an orientation as well as a lifestyle that often proceeds from that orientation.

Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+
homosexuality has an orientation towards others of the same sex and many different lifestyles…transexuals can have any of the orientations (hetero,homo,bi or non sexual) and live in many different lifestyles but mostly that of just doing their best of blending in to a ‘normal’ community life
 
Then what does God intend for someone who is intersexual to be then?
You’re answering a question on one subject (transexuality-- which is a matter of one’s self-understanding) with a question on another subject (intersexuality-- which is a matter of one’s actual anatomy ). Intersexuality is an entirely different issue.

Feelings can be very, very powerful, but do they determine objective reality, i.e. “I was born a man, but I feel as if I’m a woman; therefore, I am a woman”? If God decided that you would be born as a man, are you not a man, even if you feel conflicted about the fact?
 
Feelings can be very, very powerful, but do they determine objective reality, i.e. “I was born a man, but I feel as if I’m a woman; therefore, I am a woman”? If God decided that you would be born as a man, are you not a man, even if you feel conflicted about the fact?
Even if one goes to the radical extremes of surgical and hormonal intervention they are still the sex they were born as they can not change their DNA.
 
Even if one goes to the radical extremes of surgical and hormonal intervention they are still the sex they were born as they can not change their DNA.
ByzCath, this makes sense, from all angles-- Biblically, scientifically, logically, and philosophically.
 
MariaTS, I am very, very sorry for what you have had to endure at your current parish. Nothing, and I mean nothing, ever justifies that sort of treatment. About your being a transsexual though, I have a sincere question-- if God made you as a certain gender, as far as your anatomy, doesn’t that mean that He intended for you to be that gender, no matter what you feel yourself to be? (I’m just trying to understand, as I don’t know your thinking on this matter.)
God made me a certain sex and he also made me a certain gender. However, that certain sex does not match that certain gender. God did intend for my gender to be female and he did intend for my sex to be male, why should I change either? Why should I claim anything different. I know that I am a girl and I also know that having a penis does not make me any less of a girl. I don’t need to change my sex to be a girl because I am already a girl in my fathers eyes. I live as a girl because that is what my father wishes of me. I have asked him and he has shown me. I am, of course, referring to my father up in heaven.
 
You’re answering a question on one subject (transexuality-- which is a matter of one’s self-understanding) with a question on another subject (intersexuality-- which is a matter of one’s actual anatomy ). Intersexuality is an entirely different issue.

Feelings can be very, very powerful, but do they determine objective reality, i.e. “I was born a man, but I feel as if I’m a woman; therefore, I am a woman”? If God decided that you would be born as a man, are you not a man, even if you feel conflicted about the fact?
Well, Transsexualism is a form of Intersexualism. Also, I will give you a personal example, God did not intend for me to be a man, he intended for me to be a girl. I have received this answer in prayer. I am in no way conflicted about anything, I am gifted in every aspect of my life that my father in heaven has given me no matter what about my life. Gender and Sex are different and will always remain so. Everything different about me is something that I should cherish because God created me out of love and he will always provide for me as long as I first help myself. I was not born a man nor was I born a woman, I was born a divinely loved child of God. God made my soul, my mind, my heart, my brain, and every part about me that is not disabled to be female. Also, disability is a gift that far too few people will ever experience.
 
You’re answering a question on one subject (transexuality-- which is a matter of one’s self-understanding) with a question on another subject (intersexuality-- which is a matter of one’s actual anatomy ). Intersexuality is an entirely different issue.

Feelings can be very, very powerful, but do they determine objective reality, i.e. “I was born a man, but I feel as if I’m a woman; therefore, I am a woman”? If God decided that you would be born as a man, are you not a man, even if you feel conflicted about the fact?
Well some forget, the brain is a sexual organ, also, which contributes to a popular theory in the part of the medical commonity that deals with gender issues, that transsexual the true ones are intersexual. I have a firend who is male to female transsexual, who when she was still living as a male but contemplating transitioning back in the late 1970s was in a bad car crash. Because of some head injury the did a brain scan on my friend. She still living as a male then was the only brain scan that day. When they got the results of the scan, evey thing was fine in relation to possible brain injury, but the doctor found one interesting thing they couldn’t get over. The scan was was identical to a typical adult female! Lets stop judging books by their cover people!
 
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