Resumption of public Mass

[ChuckB]

Just found out the our bishop has identified May 30/31 as the target date for the resumption of public Mass in our diocese. He has indicated that there will be strict physical distancing procedures in place along with seating and “traffic flow” restrictions in the church. He also suggested that if the crowd exceeds the new “limited capacity” of the church building, people may have to be turned away. The governor of our state is slowly beginning the process of “opening” the state again. It will be interesting to see if there is a spike in Covid-19 infections that derails the bishop’s plans.

I am not Catholic myself, but I attend Mass with my Catholic wife every Sunday, and have for many years. I’m surprised at how much I’ve missed it.

 

[TheLittleLady]

As one article I read said, “do not plan on frequently attending Mass” for awhile.

I do not want to be the usher who has to declare “no more inside”.

 

[ChuckB]

I do not want to be the usher who has to declare “no more inside”.

I’ve thought about that myself since I have a monthly spot on the usher/greeter schedule. Many of our parishioners are “older,” a demographic that is not only more vulnerable, but for some reason that I just can’t wrap my head around, also more resistant to taking precautions against the virus. When I have to tell cranky old Mr. Jones that his usual pew is not available due to social distancing restrictions, or that he can’t enter the church without a mask, or that the church has already reached it’s Covid-19 capacity and he’s out of luck…well, it’s not going to be a fun conversation.

 

[TheLittleLady]

I read where one suggestion is that there is a list for each Mass. As it is almost certain that the obligation to attend Mass will remain suspended for an indeterminate time, simply because of distancing and capacity of the church building. With that in mind, it could be done by last name, A and B names go on Monday, etc. The challenge I see, as a parish staffer, is many immigrant families (1/3 of our parishioners) have multiple “last names”. Husband has two names, wife has two names, kids have a combo name.

Another suggestion was randomly drawing parish family ID numbers (in our database) to make a roster. Families may only get a Sunday Mass every 4 - 6 weeks.

It is not going to be simple!

 

[Tis_Bearself]

That doesn’t work well for those of us who do not go to the same parish each week, or who may be in a town other than our parish when Sunday Mass time rolls around.

I plan to simply find a place offering a Mass at a time when it’s likely uncrowded (early morning for example) and go there early.

I don’t anticipate daily Mass being a problem as it draws 40 people at most; they will probably move it out of the little chapel and into the big worship space so people can sit farther apart. The Sunday Mass is going to be the only issue.

 

[TheLittleLady]

Drop ins, visitors, that is another big challenge in this planning. We are a tourist town and he is re-opening hotels and the state parks next week. Visitors will come flooding in.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I think the bottom line is at some point we just need to go out and be around people again, in masks if necessary, and live our lives and take what comes. Which may very well be not much of anything if we’re all in masks and handwashing all the time.

 

[Usige]

We are starting meetings to dig into details and there are certainly challenges. As I quipped with the pastor, “Does the Health Department expect a husband, wife and 4 kids to be spread out over 24 feet?” It’s not going to be as simple as putting tape every 6 feet on the pews and then counting the marks.

We are trying to figure out how we are going to distribute families, but just counting doesn’t work since we have many families of one and a couple dozen of 10+. We will also run into problems if we assign people to a 7:30 am mass when they live 30 minutes away and normally attend a later mass because it’s a challenge to gets all the kids up and ready for an early mass. One thing we are trying to do is look to see what data we have about when regular families are normally attending. The other problem we are facing is that not every family in the parish register actually attends regularly so if we have 2400 families, but only 1600 regularly attend which ones are they since it doesn’t make a ton of sense to reserve a 100 spots at mass for people that won’t show up.

I certainly don’t envy the people that are assigned to handle control. Our driveway is a quarter mile long and it could be a good 500 - 600 foot walk from parts of the parking lot to the entrance. We are trying to figure out if we are going to have to put drop arms on the entrance to avoid people making it all the way to the doors to the nave just to be turned away.

All of it is extremely annoying as the local confirmed case rate is between .8 - 1.3 case/thousand people. We’ve had 8 deaths out of some 75,000 people in the parish boundaries and I believe all but 2 were residents in four nursing homes. Unfortunately our local health department is using numbers from larger urban areas that have 4-5x the infection rate and a higher proportion of high risk individuals.

We will essentially be turning people away for months despite the fact that we have never had an outbreak as sever as neighboring cities.

 

[Horton]

We will start having Mass this weekend. There will be designated pews to sit in. A family living together, (mom, dad, & kids) can all sit together in a pew. Couples can sit together and singles sit alone. With couples & singles there will only be 3-4 to a pew. Ushers will only count how many come it and guide to open seats, collection baskets will not be passed, people can drop their offering in a box, no sign of peace, no holding hands during the Our Father (which I hope sticks), and communion in the hand only, no precious blood.

There will be tape on the floor to indicate spacing for when to go up for communion. No socializing before or after Mass. It is recommended we wear a mask. We may wear gloves if we choose to. The pews will be wiped down between every Mass.

Because numbers will be restricted our priests are increasing the number of Masses offered. There will be two daily Masses and nine weekend Masses. Once all the seating is taken people will be turned away. While the obligation is still suspended people can go to any Mass during the week in order to go to a Mass.

If this weekend does not go well, we may try something different for the next weekend like an online sign up roster or some type of scheduling process.

I’m not certain I will try to go to a weekend Mass as I have elderly parents at home and a 5 day old newborn grandson I want to still be able to visit. I’ll most likely go to a weekday Mass to keep more distance from others.

 

[Gertabelle]

Colorado is slowly lifting restrictions, though counties in the Denver metro area are still under stay-at-home orders through May 8. The Archdiocese is working on plans with parishes for how masses might resume after that.

“A general dispensation from the Sunday obligation will remain.”

Our governor has also made it clear that folks in the group with high risk for complications from Covid19 should continue to follow the most stringent safety measures. I still expect to see our elderly parishioners at the front of the line to get into masses once they’re open again.

My parish has been open for prayer during the day. They have signs at the entrances requiring people wash their hands before entering and wear masks inside the building.

I was wearing a mask, as were most others. Then a family I know came in – mom and five kids (pre-teen to adult) – and not one of them was wearing a mask. They seemed determined to take the path to the front of the church that brought them the closest to as many people as possible.

Another family came in – mom, dad, four kids (also pre-teen to adult) – and only the mom was wearing a mask.

I’m 52 and have asthma, so I’m in a slightly more at-risk-for-complications group. So I wear a mask. The elderly people I saw in the church were also wearing masks.

But are others going to be willing to practice charity by making efforts to keep their germs to themselves?

 

[Diaconia]

But are others going to be willing to practice charity by making efforts to keep their germs to themselves?

Some will, and some won’t. But, those who don’t are not deliberately intending to bring risk to others, in my view.

For those with underlying health concerns, they should probably continue to stay at home for a bit longer.

We are opening up Masses on May 10th here, and are going through all the logistical planning presently to make this happen. It’s quite an undertaking.

May the Mother of God spread her mantle of protection over all of you,
Deacon Christopher

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Some will, and some won’t. But, those who don’t are not deliberately intending to bring risk to others, in my view.

Yes, I agree. While I wear a mask myself, mostly because my town requires you to do so in order to enter businesses like the grocery store, I think we need to be careful about accusing others of a lack of charity or a lack of precaution if they do not do so. It’s not like people who aren’t in masks are actively coughing or sneezing on others or getting in their faces.

 

[Usige]

Colorado is slowly lifting restrictions, though counties in the Denver metro area are still under stay-at-home orders through May 8.

I live in the one county in the Denver Metro Area that was exempted from the extension and “lifted” the stay-at-home order this past Monday. It also happens to be the one county that is not part of the arch diocese. Today we were told that because the governor is still barring gatherings of more than 10 people that we should not expect masses to resume before June or July at the earliest. Reading his last order, there is no mention of churches in his safer-at-home plan.

Given that Douglas and El Paso counties have infection and death rates roughly 2.5 - 4x lower than Denver and Aurora, don’t anticipate that masses in the Archdiocese will resume anytime soon. In parish finance councils we are not expecting giving to start come out of the current slump until September. The unspoken assumption is that we will not see any meaningful return to mass before August.

But are others going to be willing to practice charity by making efforts to keep their germs to themselves?

Be careful imputing moral culpability to people. Unless they knew they had the virus there is no moral requirement that they do things on the off chance that they could impact you. If someone has a higher risk, it is that person’s responsibility to make a choice based on their risk without insisting that others lower their risk. No one has the responsibility to do something to make it easier for you at the cost of themselves. Yes they could lower your risk if they choose, but it is morally neutral if they don’t.

 

[ChuckB]

But are others going to be willing to practice charity by making efforts to keep their germs to themselves?

No one has the responsibility to do something to make it easier for you at the cost of themselves. Yes they could lower your risk if they choose, but it is morally neutral if they don’t.

Well, I guess we know YOUR answer.

Just out of curiosity, what is it going to “cost” you to put on a mask so that some at-risk person might feel more comfortable about going to Mass? If your bishop decrees that masks are required at Mass, are you going to comply?

 

[Cor_ad_Cor]

Here’s my masking question regarding returning to Mass (which I have no plan to do until at least late summer, regardless of decisions made by anyone else): how to receive the Eucharist… process and say “amen” while masked and slip the Host under as I’m stepped to the side? Not receive at all?

 

[Usige]

Well, I guess we know YOUR answer.

Actually you don’t KNOW, but rather are inferring something simply because I don’t argue for doing so.

put on a mask so that some at-risk person might feel more comfortable

The reason the CDC says they recommend (versus require) that people wear a mask is primarily to enforce the idea of social distancing. As one doctor wrote, they are desperate and willing to try anything at this point. There are no studies on what impact, if any, home made masks make on spreading respiratory diseases. Seeing someone wearing a mask is about other people’s comfort, but both the CDC and WHO both state that non-medical masks have no known efficacy for stopping the spread from asymptomatic people.

That “feeling of comfort” can lead people at risk into a false sense of security. Say you are at risk and will only attend mass if 100% of people are wearing a mask; no exceptions. Even at 100% compliance it is not know if the person at risk has lowered their risk 90%, 50%, 10% or not at all.

The point being, if you are at risk then forcing everyone to wear untested masks can lead you to have a higher risk because you believe you are suddenly safer. If you are compromised, you are compromised and should asses the risk based solely on the highest risk you will tolerate regardless of what others might be doing. Purely from what is known and tested, you are at no higher risk from someone coughing into their elbow than you are someone coughing with a mask on that they made from a tee-shirt.

 

[Penitent60]

you could do what my church did…divvy up the congregation into the appropriate numbered groups and added enough Masses to cover the lot. Extra work for our priests but much appreciated by us the laity.

 

[Usige]

you could do what my church did…divvy up the congregation into the appropriate numbered groups and added enough Masses to cover the lot. Extra work for our priests but much appreciated by us the laity.

Might I ask roughly how many parishioners you are talking about? Just wondering if that is really only an option for smaller to mid sized parishes or ones with a larger number of priests. I think our initial spit ball estimate was each of our 2 priests would have to cover 6 or 8 masses each if we run at 1/3 capacity.

 

[Gorgias]

well, it’s not going to be a fun conversation.

Nope. And, for some, there will be a decision point: “did I sign up as an usher because I wanted to minister, or because my buddies were doing it and it was ‘easy’ or ‘fun’?”

As I quipped with the pastor, “Does the Health Department expect a husband, wife and 4 kids to be spread out over 24 feet?”

Depending on the particular children, Mom and Dad might welcome them being spread out across a pew!

We will essentially be turning people away for months despite the fact that we have never had an outbreak as sever as neighboring cities.

Which, in the long run, is better than becoming known as having caused an outbreak more severe than your city had seen before… no?

I think our initial spit ball estimate was each of our 2 priests would have to cover 6 or 8 masses each if we run at 1/3 capacity.

That presumes 100% normal attendance at 1/3 seating capacity, though, right? Do you think you’ll get those kinds of numbers?

 

[EricPH]

If it was just me at risk, I would put my faith in God and go. The terrible part about this virus, is that I can unknowingly become a carrier and pass it onto others.