Resurrection? Why?

[M0nkey]

Correct, but where is it, who is it?

 

[Vico]

simplynoone,

Thank you for explaining, and I do not want to digress. What you stated in our first post is what I was addressing:

“Jesus admits in the above parable that a man coming to life would do no good… so what is the point that so many think he, Jesus, did actually raise from being 3 days/nights in the tomb?”

My answer was that it was to fulfill the scriptures, to which you replied:

“Hosea 6:3 is the only place in the Tanakh where it is spoken of a resurrection that takes place on the third day that can be related to the NT resurrection. Notice it says “us.” … that means it is not one individual raised. It is speaking of something far more profound and true to Life… not the resurrection of the physically dead.”

My comment to that is:
The pronoun “us” does not preclude resurrection of the physically dead, as many could resurrect. Also the general pattern of resurrection occurring in three days is established, which is what happened in the New Testament at the resurrection of Jesus.

You also said:

"That Amos 3:7 says the secret is with the prophets means that anything that is to happen will be first stated by the prophets. "

My comment to that is:
That is an inaccurate understanding of Amos 3:7; as God may reveal his secret to the servants his prophets, but that also implies that is not revealed to those that do not love God. Too, the prophets may not reveal all those secrets to the general public. All wisdom is not contained in the Bible alone, but in the tradition of the Church which is the Mystical Body of Christ.

You referred to both Luke 16:19-31 and Amos 3:7 in your first post. As quoted earlier from the Tanakh, some people would not believe it even if they witnessed a resurrection. (And some that actually witnessed that Jesus Christ was resurrected, did at first have difficulty believing it, such as doubting Thomas; and that is not the only account that occurs in the New Testament, some had difficulty recognizing the resurrected Jesus, such as Mary (see John 20:14). Yet, many believed what they saw when Lazarus was resurrected (John 11:43-46) and from which event the Pharasees decided to kill Jesus.

HEB 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things to be hoped for, the evidence of things that appear not. (Douay)

 

[ryanoneil]

You say the words of the Tanakh point to the Christ… and yet the only evidence I am ever shown by anyone is the words of the NT.

Yes. The Tanakh prepared Israel for a Messiah who would conquer the devil, make atonement for sin, and renew the heart of man through the founding of a New Covenant. The NT records the fulfillment of this message.

When Jesus, a Jewish man, was speaking to his Jewish disciples to say that elias has already come, he was not joking for Elias is rather the Greek literalist interpretation of the greek Sun god personified, Helios (Elijah is the Conceptual Metaphor written by a Jewish author that is brilliant considering what “was for to come”). The Greek mentality of the messiah has come and still… the kingdom of God is taken by violence. When he spoke of the Son of man, the disciples understood this to mean the words that John (the Baptist, as he is called) was speaking to… also found in Ezekiel 18:20-28. It is the same conceptual metaphor spoken of in Job… that if we pay attention to the judgments of God Who is the only teacher of true Justice (via cause and effect), we can understand what it is stated in Job 40:14.

Please excuse me. I don’t understand what you are saying. Can you clarify please?

Moses was taught by the “mouth” of God obviously because if one REALLY takes the time to try and understand the Laws that he gave, it would become apparent that he gave the children of Israel gold… for the Laws are based on Justice and Mercy. The Word in Ezekiel 18:20-28 is speaking to Grace understood that comes through the Law of God. The belief in Jesus can not do anything for anyone just as the belief in Moses, as a saviour, can not do anything for anyone given that Jesus and Moses are dead… the Law of God is eternal; and just as Jesus pointed to the Laws given of Moses as the perfect place to start for learning the Law of God, so should we do the same (of course, unless one jumps out of faith to what will seem the scary void of fully trusting God’s judgment, one will never truly understand why it is the only Saviour is God which is testified to in Isaiah).

Jesus is the mouth of God and Jesus is not dead. He has risen and ascended to heaven. I don’t disagree with you about the Law (the 10 commandments) being a good place to start, and that God is our Saviour.

(But the LORD was pleased to crush him in infirmity.) If he gives his life as an offering for sin, he shall see his descendants in a long life, and the will of the LORD shall be accomplished through him. Because of his affliction he shall see the light in fullness of days; Through his suffering, my servant shall justify many, and their guilt he shall bear. Therefore I will give him his portion among the great, and he shall divide the spoils with the mighty, Because he surrendered himself to death and was counted among the wicked; And he shall take away the sins of many, and win pardon for their offenses. (Isa 53:10-12)

Obviously this doesn’t negate Ezekiel 18:20-28, but it does speak to the Christ making atonement for sin.

So, when one believes in Jesus, this is what I mean in saying that I am baffled as to why so many point to death as though it is the way to Life. We all will die… but the Tanakh is not speaking to that… it is speaking to Life, which we have now.

We must die to ourselves in order to live. Through baptism we die to sin (with Christ) and come to new life, by the power of the Holy Spirit. This is the renewal of heart God promised.

I will sprinkle clean water upon you to cleanse you from all your impurities, and from all your idols I will cleanse you. I will give you a new heart and place a new spirit within you, taking from your bodies your stony hearts and giving you natural hearts. (Ezek 36:25-27)

Through the Eucharist, we also celebrate the New Covenant.

Then he took the bread, said the blessing, broke it, and gave it to them, saying, “This is my body, which will be given for you; do this in memory of me.” And likewise the cup after they had eaten, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in my blood, which will be shed for you. (Luke 22:19-20)

This is the fulfillment of:

The days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah. It will not be like the covenant I made with their fathers the day I took them by the hand to lead them forth from the land of Egypt; for they broke my covenant and I had to show myself their master, says the LORD. But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD. I will place my law within them, and write it upon their hearts; I will be their God, and they shall be my people. No longer will they have need to teach their friends and kinsmen how to know the LORD. All, from least to greatest, shall know me, says the LORD, for I will forgive their evildoing and remember their sin no more. (Jer 31:31-34)

 

[Vico]

simplynoone, you said:

After all, there is nothing of proof anyone has shown me saying that Jesus did in fact raise from the dead… where is he?

Note that Jesus ascended, as were Henoch and Elias.

Acts 1:9 - “After Jesus said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight.”

2 Kings 2:11 - “And as they went on, walking and talking together, behold, a fiery chariot and fiery horses parted them both asunder: and Elias went up by a whirlwind into heaven.”

Hebrews 11:5 - “By faith Henoch was translated that he should not see death: and he was not found because God had translated him. For before his translation he had testimony that he pleased God.”

 

[ryanoneil]

Hi simplynoone!

The bread is the Word and that is not Jesus unless someone changed the Tanakh to the name, “Jesus.” Jesus was a man and unless Jeremiah 17:5 is now changed from a curse to a blessing, than the only way to understand the Word (the Tanakh) is by the “mouth” of God… and who is God?

No one changed the Tanakh. God revealed that Jesus is his word. Jesus and the Word are one and the same, and they are no different. One’s heart does not turns away from the LORD when trusting in Jesus the Word.

Isaiah 45:18-25 … It is to be taught by the “mouth” of God, Proverbs 2:1-7. The children of Israel learned… they did via experience and the Laws given by Moses were set up perfectly for making one aware of how it is we can be taught from the “mouth” of God… this is to govern ones own life in the Voice of rationality rather than being governed by the mouths of other men. If one is sensitive to the Voice of God, then they will learn what true Justice is and from this knowledge stems the just and righteous man. Job, again, speaks to this perfectly. That so many judged him because he had lost everything had nothing to do with righteous judgment. Job refused to be the hypocrite before God and he learned where it is salvation comes from, that would be God; and it is salvation is already given to us from the beginning. That God did not give us all we needed from the beginning is saying that God was lacking in judgment. The best example for the process of learning comes from the Tanakh … that Jesus did not sin is all a matter of how it is we are perceiving the Just Law of God. That he was perfect from birth is only to say that He was aware of how it is we learn to walk in God’s ways… and this is echoed in what Ezekiel, the prophet called the Son of man, said… chapter 18 verses 20-28.

I like much of what you are saying and it makes sense, except God giving us all we need from the beginning (but I think I understand the spirit you are saying it in). Yes he revealed himself in the garden, but he has continued to reveal himself throughout history through Covenants.

God is the Holy Spirit. The bread of Life is the Word of the People, the Jewish, found in the Tanakh. Only God can give the breath of Life though. The Son, Israel (unless you want to argue with the foundation, Exo 4:22,23 and Hosea 11:1), has given us the bread (the knowledge they have learned via submitting TO LEARNING the ways of God) and Jesus, as one of the Son confirmed this in Matthew 5:17-19.

I don’t disagree with you, but I would add that “The Son” is not restricted to Israel as a whole. The Son also refers to the individual king who is from the line of David (2 Samuel 7:14). He is the “Anointed One” and “Messiah”.

The Father and I are one is simply to say that he is being led by God… the Law of God brings forth knowledge of the experiences that are before us. Psalm 19 and Psalm 119. If the Law of God is in the heart, then it is in the mind… and to that person, truly they are at one with the Father… which is to say, they are led by God. All that is attributed to Jesus that is being taken from the literalist perspective is not at all of God… but rather it is what man’s idea of what they think God should be. That is the Christ, the Greek’s messiah.

The Jewish Messiah is Israel, the People. Job 40:14 and that is because God is not a man, but He is the Creator of the Heavens and the earth and He established His ways from the beginning… all that we need has been given… What God creates is indeed Good. Ecclesiastes 7:29

All that is attributed to Jesus is from God. He attributed the name I AM to himself. The Jews collectively may think themselves Israel’s Messiah, but that is a term reserved for their theocratic king (1 Samuel 24:7). That title is reserved for Jesus who is the king from the line of David. There is more to Jesus being one with God than you think.

Are you and your word one? Are you and the breath that carries your words one? Are they seperate once they leave your mouth?
Are God and his word one? Is the breath he breathed (that created life) one? Or were they seperate once they left his mouth?

Jesus is God’s Word and the Holy Spirit is his breath. They are one yet they are distinct. They were with him from the beginning, yet they were begotten by and proceed out from him, similair to the way your breath and word go out from you.

Another way of thinking about it is by reading Ge 2:24. There is three in one. **For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh. **

I don’t know if this makes any sense to you, but this is the way the mystery was described to me (in case you never heard it put this way).

They died and were buried amongst their own… I am unsure why this is such a hard thing for people to understand when it is not really all that uncommon of a practice. That is how I would interpret the above… I am not sure how else it could be taken since it clearly says they lived their lives and then died. There is nothing at all here that would make me think they are still living and/or will live again… how is it that you see it another way? I am curious.

In the case of Abraham, the gathering is described as a separate event from the physical death of the body or the burial.

 

[ryanoneil]

After all, there is nothing of proof anyone has shown me saying that Jesus did in fact raise from the dead… where is he?

I hope you don’t mind my two cents in this conversation. Where is Jesus? In heaven!

Jesus said to him in reply, “You have said so. But I tell you: From now on you will see ‘the Son of Man seated at the right hand of the Power’ and ‘coming on the clouds of heaven.’” (Mat 26:64)

Jesus is drawing from Ps 110:1 and Dan 7:9-14. Both envision a royal messiah who reigns with God in a heavenly throne room, who is triumphing over his enemies.

 

[simplynoone]

Correct, but where is it, who is it?

If you are having to ask me, then I can only take it that you need not wonder if you are part of it. No worries… you are just as valuable for you are part of the created, the creation of God. Genesis 9 has the inferred commandments for the rest of us, mankind… live your life in (what should be) common sense. That is the blessing given to mankind. The covenant between God and the house of Israel along with the house of Judah is the signature on the covenant between God and mankind that assures mankind will remain on the earth… nothing more, nothing less.

 

[simplynoone]

simplynoone,

Thank you for explaining, and I do not want to digress. What you stated in our first post is what I was addressing:

My answer was that it was to fulfill the scriptures, to which you replied:

My comment to that is:
The pronoun “us” does not preclude resurrection of the physically dead, as many could resurrect. Also the general pattern of resurrection occurring in three days is established, which is what happened in the New Testament at the resurrection of Jesus.

You also said:

My comment to that is:
That is an inaccurate understanding of Amos 3:7; as God may reveal his secret to the servants his prophets, but that also implies that is not revealed to those that do not love God. Too, the prophets may not reveal all those secrets to the general public. All wisdom is not contained in the Bible alone, but in the tradition of the Church which is the Mystical Body of Christ.

You referred to both Luke 16:19-31 and Amos 3:7 in your first post. As quoted earlier from the Tanakh, some people would not believe it even if they witnessed a resurrection. (And some that actually witnessed that Jesus Christ was resurrected, did at first have difficulty believing it, such as doubting Thomas; and that is not the only account that occurs in the New Testament, some had difficulty recognizing the resurrected Jesus, such as Mary (see John 20:14). Yet, many believed what they saw when Lazarus was resurrected (John 11:43-46) and from which event the Pharasees decided to kill Jesus.

HEB 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things to be hoped for, the evidence of things that appear not. (Douay)

All of this can be cleared up quite quickly really. Show me the proof of your resurrection and I will show you the proof of mine.

Yours??? Even a witness that you can bring forward who saw Jesus being raised from the dead??? waits

Proof of what I say is the clear interpretation of the resurrection??? Just look over at Israel and the People back (and even more still being called back) in their Land. Hosea 6:2 … if Peter wanted us to not be ignorant of that one thing… that a thousand years are as one day to the Lord, then it is right on course… Israel was revived on the 2nd day and the People are being resurrected now, on the 3rd day.

THAT’S testament of the God of Israel; the Redeemer of Jacob… how could anyone not be awe-struck by Him!!! No need for demigod replacements; unless of course, anyone here has actual proof that Jesus is indeed risen from the grave and that they are being raised to meet him in the sky…

Anyone???

crickets

 

[simplynoone]

Yes. The Tanakh prepared Israel for a Messiah who would conquer the devil, make atonement for sin, and renew the heart of man through the founding of a New Covenant. The NT records the fulfillment of this message.

Job, being the metaphorical archetype for Israel, doesn’t need a Messiah. Job 40:1,14 is enough to know this.

As far as a Saviour, there is only ONE for this blessed People and that is God… and HE is the Saviour of Israel and there is no other. Isaiah 45:16-25.

Not to be disrespectful, but rather honest… Jesus could have used a saviour his ownself, no? Else, where is he?

Please excuse me. I don’t understand what you are saying. Can you clarify please?

Have you ever read I Kings 18… along with the charge given in Malachi 4? The call to sacrifice. One has to wonder why 2,000 years is not long enough for the understanding to start sinking into the minds of mankind as to Who the Saviour really is. That would be God and not the Son… the Son is Israel according to the Tanakh Exodus 4:22,23 and Hosea 11:1. The Son was waiting on His God, the Saviour of Israel.

Jesus is the mouth of God and Jesus is not dead. He has risen and ascended to heaven. I don’t disagree with you about the Law (the 10 commandments) being a good place to start, and that God is our Saviour.

When man dies, there is no returning. This is the gracious judgment of God given in Genesis 3. Men would go insane if they were left in the void of timeless eternity (and in fact, many brilliant minds, physicists, have done just so committing suicide realizing that infinity is a reality that is not ours to understand). Life would not be near as sweet or meaningful. Jesus was not at all exempt from the Natural Law that was established by our Creator from the foundation of the world.

** (Isa 53:10-12)**

That Servant is named in Isaiah 49:3. Isaiah 45:19… there is nothing hidden that will not be revealed… just takes time and knowledge coupled with understanding to see.

Obviously this doesn’t negate Ezekiel 18:20-28, but it does speak to the Christ making atonement for sin.
We must die to ourselves in order to live. Through baptism we die to sin (with Christ) and come to new life, by the power of the Holy Spirit. This is the renewal of heart God promised.

Atonement for sin was nothing more than atonement for guilt that was mercifully given by an enlightened man named Moses. The Children were of a slavish mentality given over to guilt for even the most basic of human experiences.

And… how has that worked out for you … dying to yourself, that is? I find it impossible personally. It does not at all speak to Life and rather it speaks to death… the guilt that was experienced by the slavish mentality of the children. Evolve in the Light of God’s Truth… don’t trespass another’s right to Life, respecting them… and live as a man rather than an animal and you are good to learn and grow!! THIS IS the heart of God. Remember… God is the creator of Life and life, here, His creation is where it is we are in His presence. What would we benefit to merely exist for death when we are capable of living in Life??

I will sprinkle clean water upon you to cleanse you from all your impurities, and from all your idols I will cleanse you. I will give you a new heart and place a new spirit within you, taking from your bodies your stony hearts and giving you natural hearts. (Ezek 36:25-27)

2,000 years along with the resurrection of Israel, the Servant of God, is not enough to cleanse the world from their idols?

Ah well… still, glad to be here on this side of it to witness the Beauty of His Truth even if others choose to remain closed off to the Truth.

Really, I do see you have the capability of opening your eyes. I can’t and won’t do it for you though. I do enjoy our discussions but you come here with too much of what you are told rather than what is true to Life… what we are witnessing even today… the Truth of God’s Word being displayed before us. Jesus said, we speak that we DO know, and testify that we have seen… and still, you receive not our witness.

Why not?

(Luke 22:19-20) This is the fulfillment of: (Jer 31:31-34

Prove it… what is said in the last verse of Isaiah 52 for the purposes of Isaiah 53:11 is more of a testament to what has and is happening and it is spoken of in Jeremiah 31:27 as well. That is the bloodline, or rather the seed, spread to the nations… and yet, because it is not mystical, it is rejected? I find it to be absolutely brilliant in the Light of the Truth… more so than I did under the waiting for Jesus. Jesus, a man, I prayed asking for his truth… then I threw it out to seek the Truth only to find the Voice of God really is as it is testified Deut 4:12. I would rather serve God, the Creator of Life, while I have life than be under the illusion that I could exist as a god with eternal life. Admittedly… that’s just me though. I am perfect as I AM. God created me and I see what He creates is indeed good… why don’t Christians do the same… that it (including me) has to be perfected according to their imaginations to be called good?

 

[simplynoone]

simplynoone, you said:

Note that Jesus ascended, as were Henoch and Elias.

Acts 1:9 - “After Jesus said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight.”

2 Kings 2:11 - “And as they went on, walking and talking together, behold, a fiery chariot and fiery horses parted them both asunder: and Elias went up by a whirlwind into heaven.”

Hebrews 11:5 - “By faith Henoch was translated that he should not see death: and he was not found because God had translated him. For before his translation he had testimony that he pleased God.”

I maintain that the Son of God (Israel) along with the Son of man (Jacob… the Jewish) is risen from the grave. Just LOOK AT what is before you in the Word and then in Life… this is the kingdom of God… where else would it be but in His creation?? This is where Life is and it is devistating to be saying this to have so many still waiting on the return of man that WILL NOT happen (and certainly it can’t be proved to have happened… you are falling for man’s words Jeremiah 17:5).

Mark my words… Jesus, a man, will not rise again… he had already been raised to awareness as is said in your own NT (though you all overlook that part of it). Else, again prove it… that he, a man, will raise up out of the grave to save you physically only to bring you to a terrifying (what is to us a) void called Eternity (why else do you think all the “Fear God” passages are written?). But listen to the ones who are chosen (not me necessarily), listen carefully to what they (the Jewish) are bringing to you… even here on this forum… and through them you will hear the words of Life and understand Hosea 6:2.

 

[Vico]

simplynoone, in your last reply the original question quoted was omitted, it is below. I am only giving you the answer to your question, not debating with you. The answer is ascended.

After all, there is nothing of proof anyone has shown me saying that Jesus did in fact raise from the dead… where is he?

 

[Vico]

simplynoone, you said:

All of this can be cleared up quite quickly really. Show me the proof of your resurrection and I will show you the proof of mine.

I am answering your question about were the belief comes from. We have the testamony from the New Testament, see the references I sent. John 20:14 for example.

 

[simplynoone]

**Isaiah 44:6-26 So… please read this passage before answering your reply … **

**Besides just words (which if they were able to be PROOF in and of itself, could be used as proof that a rabbit is rushing around with a pocket watch saying “the time is late for a very important date”) where is your proof?; because the King of Israel, the LORD, is proving HIS words … and I can show it by pointing you to Israel and the People being raised to the Land even now. His work is good, don’t you agree? **
I am not **trying to mock, but at the same time, why doesn’t your god speak on his own behalf like the God of Israel is doing right now… in THESE times? **

 

[simplynoone]

simplynoone, in your last reply the original question quoted was omitted, it is below. I am only giving you the answer to your question, not debating with you. The answer is ascended.

Again, not to AT ALL sound rude, but of course you are not debating me. The Word of God trumps the word of hellenistic ideas. One is able to speak on His behalf and the other has to resort to a magician’s trick.

 

[Vico]

simplynoone, you said:

Again, not to AT ALL sound rude, but of course you are not debating me. The Word of God trumps the word of hellenistic ideas. One is able to speak on His behalf and the other has to resort to a magician’s trick.

There is no debate, because there is no argument at all, rather, on my part, an answer to your question about resurrection. Not being a debate has nothing to do with you speaking for Him as you imply in your quote.

 

[Vico]

simplynone you wrote:

Besides just words (which if they were able to be PROOF in and of itself, could be used as proof that a rabbit is rushing around with a pocket watch saying “the time is late for a very important date”) where is your proof?;

because the King of Israel, the LORD, is proving HIS words … and I can show it by pointing you to Israel and the People being raised to the Land even now.

His work is good, don’t you agree?

I am not trying to mock, but at the same time, why doesn’t your god speak on his own behalf like the God of Israel is doing right now… in THESE times?

As you state, there is no proof in words:

1. rabbit in the pocket is imagination
2. “Israel and the People being raised to the Land” is an interpretation and a belief that it comes from the Lord
3. testamony of miraculous events recorded in the Old and New Testaments are historical accounts and a belief that they come from the Lord

All of these states are a matter of belief, and acceptance of those particular words as true.

The proof of what God is doing today, is in the sanctification of the people that hold to his commandments, although they must endure many trials. They report internal peace, mystical union, and upliftment of spirit, an ability to overcome their vices, and to help others physically, mentally, and spiritually, through the grace of God.

 

[M0nkey]

Here is the thing, the OP seems to morph her theological ideas at whim, which is difficult to combat when you come from a systematic understanding, which is the truth as has been revealed by God. The questions I bring up, for example, are simply answered in a nebulous abstraction, but nothing tangible or concrete.

 

[simplynoone]

Here is the thing, the OP seems to morph her theological ideas at whim, which is difficult to combat when you come from a systematic understanding, which is the truth as has been revealed by God. The questions I bring up, for example, are simply answered in a nebulous abstraction, but nothing tangible or concrete.

I don’t think it is difficult for you all to combat what I am saying for the reason you are claiming, that being I am “morphing my theological ideas on a whim” because after all :

Isaiah 45:

**11 Thus saith the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, and his Maker, Ask me of things to come concerning my sons, and concerning the work of my hands command ye me. **
**12 I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded. **

---

**18 For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the LORD; and there is none else. **

---

**19 I have not spoken in secret, in a dark place of the earth: I said not unto the seed of Jacob, Seek ye me in vain: I the LORD speak righteousness, I declare things that are right. **

---

**20 Assemble yourselves and come; draw near together, ye that are escaped of the nations: they have no knowledge that set up the wood of their graven image, and pray unto a god that cannot save. **

21 Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.

I think it is hard to argue what I am saying because not only is what I am saying written there in the Tanakh, but it is evident before our eyes as well.

I found it hard to trust in something that there was no evidence of… for me personally, I was raised in the Independent Baptist Church … which actually is less mystical than most forms of Christianity, and still… there was nothing to speak to what I was being taught and neither was it compatible with what is written in the Tanakh.

To believe Christianity is based on the Tanakh, one must literally rearrange and fill in what is and is not there.

I decided to not blindly accept the interpretations that I was hearing from the mouths of men anymore and I asked of God the things to come concerning His sons and the works of His hands according to Proverbs 2. What I found was amazingly true to life and not at all abstract.

So many accept that Jesus, their perceived demigod, was raised from the dead, that either there must proof of this besides what the NT is saying or else you eventually will have to admit that your faith is blind and based on the words of men. That this mystical scenario would happen is not written in the Tanakh so there is even the question of where the idea came from… the only place I can find such things as being believed is in the mythological stories of the Greek.

 

[simplynoone]

simplynoone, you said:

There is no debate, because there is no argument at all, rather, on my part, an answer to your question about resurrection. Not being a debate has nothing to do with you speaking for Him as you imply in your quote.

the “one” being able to speak on His behalf is the Word of God… I don’t have to speak on behalf of God… only I am trying to point out that the NT is not based on the Tanakh and that Christianity’s beliefs are based on something else altogether.

 

[M0nkey]

I believe the book does not speak for you, but it’s your own interpretation that speaks for God’s true word. Tell me, you have still not rendered what occurred to the promises made to David, unless according your authority of interpretation God lied to David and to Abraham. There has to be a tangible and concrete answer, otherwise you’ll be lost in occult ideas that are misleading and self perpetuated.