Return to General Absolution

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Right. But then the Church Hierarchy could decide which “how” is better. If I were part of the Church Hierarchy I think I’d move for general absolution and if my peer members of the CH agreed with me it would then be “what the Church says”. As I said, priest have to devote much time to hearing confessions, when they should be spreading the Gospel or actively promoting church groups - There is a further problem I see which I forgot to mention in my prior intervention: not all priests are qualified to give advice in the many problems brought by their penitents. I know of some cases where penitents leaves the confessional with ideas that affect their lives.
 
tafan2 said:
So it would seem that the “how” was left up to the Apostles, ie the Church hierarchy, not the sinner who seeks forgiveness. Which means the penitential rite at the beginning of mass only suffices for what the Church says.
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Note the RCC position on PNC general absolution . . .

hawk
 
The PNC has a quiet individual confession of sins, and then a general absolution, at Mass.

The RCC recognizes the validity (but not licit) of PNC orders and sacraments.

hawk
 
dochawk said:
The PNC has a quiet individual confession of sins, and then a general absolution, at Mass.

The RCC recognizes the validity (but not licit) of PNC orders and sacraments.

hawk
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Not quite. In the last few years, the situation of the Polish National Church has become a bit ambiguous.

We still permit them to present themselves for Communion at Mass, but no longer accept (as a given) that all their attempts at sacraments are valid.

They’ve been attempting ordination of women as deacons, and that makes some of their ordinations objectively invalid, and others questionable.
 
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If the priest wishes to know a further detail of a sin, he will ask you.

It takes 2 minutes to say, “I used artificial contraception with my spouse for a period of about 3 months. We have since stopped.” Priest generally doesn’t care if you used a condom, a pill or what.

It takes 2 minutes to say, “I had homosexual relations with guys I picked up at a bar, this happened about 3 times over 6 months. I haven’t done it in the last 2 months, no longer go to the bar and got counseling as I don’t want to do this any more.”

Perhaps if someone is committing huge numbers of sexual sins or hasn’t been to confession for years it takes a little longer.
 
tafan2 said:
Sorry, perhaps I am a little slow, what is PNC?
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Polish National Church. Broke away from the RCC in the US over the abuse of Poles.
FrDavid96 said:
They’ve been attempting ordination of women as deacons, and that makes some of their ordinations objectively invalid, and others questionable.
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😱😱😱

Whoops, I missed that one.

My last update on such things was when they broke communion with the “Old Catholics” when that group started attempting to ordain women . . .

hawk
 
Could reverting back to mass (is as popular absolutions) general absolutions help promote a “culture of confession” since the rule-of-thumb is confess as soon as you can? Or is it extremely inappropriate to just dispense general absolutions willy-nilly even if you’re trying to nudge/compel people to the confessionals (especially if some aren’t exactly ready for confession at the moment)?
 
RCIAGraduate said:
Could reverting back to mass (is as popular absolutions) general absolutions help promote a “culture of confession” since the rule-of-thumb is confess as soon as you can?
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No.
We already know this to be the case. For one thing, mis-use of general absolution had the opposite effect of lessening the frequency of individual confessions.
Or is it extremely inappropriate to just dispense general absolutions willy-nilly even if you’re trying to nudge/compel people to the confessionals (especially if some aren’t exactly ready for confession at the moment)?
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Yes, extremely inappropriate.
 
FrDavid96 said:
No.
We already know this to be the case. For one thing, mis-use of general absolution had the opposite effect of lessening the frequency of individual confessions.
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I would had that I doubt seriously if “promoting a culture of confession” was anyone’s goal when it was done before. Indeed, I suspect it had exactly effect intended by those who abused the practice. Sorry for my cynicism.
 
tafan2 said:
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FrDavid96:
No.
We already know this to be the case. For one thing, mis-use of general absolution had the opposite effect of lessening the frequency of individual confessions.
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I would had that I doubt seriously if “promoting a culture of confession” was anyone’s goal when it was done before. Indeed, I suspect it had exactly effect intended by those who abused the practice. Sorry for my cynicism.
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It’s true.
 
Rob2 said:
The Sacrament of Confession has taken different forms over the centuries .

But for many , probably for most Catholics the sacrament is no longer part of their lives .

A review of the sacrament by the bishops is long overdue .

It is in danger of going the way of the dodo .
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I respectfully but strongly disagree with this. The sacrament of Reconciliation is absolutely vital to the spiritual life. It does not need a review but rather a revival in regions where Catholics are not using it. If people in a particular parish or area of the country are not using it, you can bet that the Catholic faith there is overall anemic. Renewed catechesis and discipleship are needed in these parishes and/or dioceses, and when this happens, people will start going to confession again.

While it probably depends on where you live, the sacrament is not even close to “going the way of the dodo” where I am. There are always lines for confession, at least short ones and often long ones. Several times, I have seen the last few people in line (including myself) not be able to have their confession heard because the priest was not able to get to the end of the line before he had to leave to get ready for Mass.
 
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@FrDavid96, how does the Church view general confession and absolution as practiced for centuries by the Armenian Apostolic Church?
 
Vico said:
I see, so some claim that it is not only for grave necessity. Do those people know that there is no absolution granted without the intention to confess later individually (if physically and morally possible)?
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As a penitent who relied on General Absolution alone for at least 10-15 years, I learned of the need to confess mortal sins ASAP about a year before Form 3 was discontinued in our parish. IOW, it was never mentioned once in all the years before.

It makes no sense to use Form 3, as it was used in parishes with priests available, with the caveat that mortal sins need to be confessed privately ASAP. Use Form 2.
 
babochka said:
FrDavid96, how does the Church view general confession and absolution as practiced for centuries by the Armenian Apostolic Church?
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As you know, every ritual family (ie rite) and Church sui iuris, has its own canons and traditions.
 
Phemie said:
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Vico:
I see, so some claim that it is not only for grave necessity. Do those people know that there is no absolution granted without the intention to confess later individually (if physically and morally possible)?
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As a penitent who relied on General Absolution alone for at least 10-15 years, I learned of the need to confess mortal sins ASAP about a year before Form 3 was discontinued in our parish. IOW, it was never mentioned once in all the years before.

It makes no sense to use Form 3, as it was used in parishes with priests available, with the caveat that mortal sins need to be confessed privately ASAP. Use Form 2.
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So in the R.P. the priest is instructed to inform the faithful of the disposition and conditions for absolution, yet continually failed to do so. How unfortunate, and it seems to be inexcusable, for it would take only about one minute to state this.
 
Vico said:
So in the R.P. the priest is instructed to inform the faithful of the disposition and conditions for absolution, yet continually failed to do so. How unfortunate, and it seems to be inexcusable, for it would take only about one minute to state this.
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As I keep trying to tell you, it was not about “informing” the faithful of the conditions.

It was about completely ignoring the conditions in the first place.

The standard they applied was not “grave necessity” not by any stretch. They did it simply as a matter of preference, their own choice.

Absent a situation of grave necessity, there is no excuse for even doing the general absolution.

What genuinely puzzles me here is this: why do you not see this after so many attempts to explain it?
 
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