Revelation 20 Rapture problem

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Once again, I know the rapture does not exist, having problems with debates.
How would we refute this in terms of the non-existent rapture?
Thank you
 
This very website has lots of great tracts answering such questions. Their one on the rapture can be reached at:

catholic.com/tracts/the-rapture

You can also go to the EWTN website (ewtn.com) and type “rapture” into their search box and get a long list of stuff to ready.

Enjoy!
 
InternetWoman said:
This very website has lots of great tracts answering such questions. Their one on the rapture can be reached at:

catholic.com/tracts/the-rapture

You can also go to the EWTN website (ewtn.com) and type “rapture” into their search box and get a long list of stuff to ready.

Enjoy!
Click to expand...
I didn’t find it helped my question.
I do not need information on the history of it, I need information on the refutes of scripture from Protestants on this.
Protestants love to ignore history and evidence. (And sometimes scripture itself)
 
Try the search feature on ewtn.com (right side opposite the EWTN logo. Several seemed to be more in the light of helping Protestants understand the error.
 
JD27076 said:
I didn’t find it helped my question.
I do not need information on the history of it, I need information on the refutes of scripture from Protestants on this.
Protestants love to ignore history and evidence. (And sometimes scripture itself)
Click to expand...
Hi, JD…you should add Scripturecatholic.com in your favorites…scripturecatholic.com/second_coming.html

2 Thess. 2:1-4 – concerning the Second Coming of Christ, Scripture teaches (and most Protestants believe) that Christ’s coming will be preceded by a time of rebellion, lawlessness and persecution. Protestants often refer to this period as the “tribulation” (although the word “tribulation” cannot be found in the Scripture passages Protestants use to support the “rapture”). So the question is, when will the 1 Thess. 4:16-17 “rapture” occur, in light of the tribulation and Christ’s Second Coming? Here are the three theories previously mentioned:

(1) Post-tribulational view – this view holds that the rapture will occur right after the tribulation and immediately before the Second Coming of Christ. This view can be consistent with Scripture and Catholic teaching to the extent it holds that the rapture and Christ’s Second Coming occur together, after the tribulation and the Church Militant on earth. See, for example, Matt. 24:29-31; Mark 13:24-27; 2 Thess. 1:1-12.

(2) Pre-tribulational view – this view holds that the rapture will occur before the tribulation. The problem with this view is that it requires three comings of Christ – first, when He was born in Bethlehem; second, when He returns for the rapture before the tribulation; third, when He returns at the end of the tribulation and establishes the millennium. Scripture rejects three comings of Christ. In Heb. 9:28, it is clear that Christ will appear a second and final time, when he comes in glory to save us. This view also is inconsistent with Matt. 24:24-31; Mark 13:24-27; and 2 Thess. 2:1-12 where the rapture and the Second Coming occur together.

(3) Mid-tribulational view – this view holds that the rapture will occur during the middle of the tribulation. The problem with this view is that it also requires three comings of Christ – first, when He was born in Bethlehem; second, when He returns for the rapture during the middle of the tribulation; third, when He returns at the end of the tribulation and establishes the millennium. As seen in Heb. 9:28, Scripture rejects three comings of Christ. The view is also inconsistent with Matt. 24:24-31; Mark. 13:24-27; and 2 Thess. 2:1-12.

2 Peter 3:8-15 – instead of worrying about when the rapture will occur, Christians should follow Peter’s instruction to repent of their sins, live lives of holiness and godliness, be zealous and at peace, and wait for the Lord’s coming with forbearance and joy!
 
Rapture Theology? No! Revelation Chapter 20 Has No Rapture Theology (nor do any other verses)

REVELATION Chapter 20

The binding (chaining) of Satan due to Jesus’ work (this does not mean Satan is powerless but DOES mean he is restricted or “chained”)

REVELATION 20:1-3 1 Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, holding in his hand the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain. 2 And he seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years, 3 and threw him into the pit, and shut it and sealed it over him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years were ended. After that he must be loosed for a little while.

**
The “Thousand-Year” (not a literal “thousand years”. Christ has already been reigning for longer than that) Reign of Christ and His Holy Ones in Heaven (See also Matthew 19:28 and CCC 765 and 2nd Timothy 2:12) who were seated on thrones.**

REVELATION 20:4-5 4 Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom judgment was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their testimony to Jesus and for the word of God, and who had not worshipped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life, and reigned with Christ a thousand years. 5 The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection.

Blessed is he who shares in the Resurrection of Christ. Why? Because the “second death” has no power over such people for those who endure (as we are told elsewhere). See also Romans 6:3-5 which teaches much of the same thing.
**
REVELATION 20:6** 6 Blessed and holy is he who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and they shall reign with him a thousand years.

The first death is physical. The second death (that those in Christ escape) would be a permanent spiritual death.

ROMAN CATECHISM He that shall overcome shall not be hurt by the second death; . . . I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, and I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

The time of the Great Tribulation to the end of the world toward the end of time (after the thousand-year reign but before the end of the world or as CCC 677 says: “God’s victory over the final unleashing of evil, which will cause his Bride to come down from heaven”).

REVELATION 20:7-9a 7 And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be loosed from his prison 8 and will come out to deceive the nations which are at the four corners of the earth, that is, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. 9 And they marched up over the broad earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city;

God intervenes concerning human adversaries (“the nations”) AND preternatural adversaries
REVELATION 20:9b-10 9b but fire came down from heaven and consumed them, 10 and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulphur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

**End of time/end of the world and the Final or General Judgment or (“the Last Judgment after the final cosmic upheaval of this passing world”—CCC 677 on Rev. 20:12) **

REVELATION 20:11-15 11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who sat upon it; from his presence earth and sky fled away, and no place was found for them. 12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Also another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, by what they had done. 13 And the sea gave up the dead in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead in them, and all were judged by what they had done. 14 Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire; 15 and if any one’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

CCC 677 The Church will enter the glory of the kingdom only through this final Passover, when she will follow her Lord in his death and Resurrection.579 The kingdom will be fulfilled, then, not by a historic triumph of the Church through a progressive ascendancy, but only by **God’s victory over the final unleashing of evil, which will cause his Bride to come down from heaven.**580 God’s triumph over the revolt of evil will take the form of the Last Judgment after the final cosmic upheaval of this passing world.581

Footnote 580 refers us to Rev. 13:8, 20:7-10, and 21:2-4
Footnote 581 refers us to Rev. 20:12, and 2 Pet 3:12-13

CCC and Scipture bold and/or ul mine.

Continued on next post:
 
Revelation Chapter 20 and NO Rapture - Continued from last post

2nd PETER 3:10-14 10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a loud noise, and the elements will be dissolved with fire, and the earth and the works that are upon it will be burned up. 11 Since all these things are thus to be dissolved, what sort of persons ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, 12 waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be kindled and dissolved, and the elements will melt with fire! 13 But according to his promise we wait for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells. 14 Therefore, beloved, since you wait for these, be zealous to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace.

A “New Heaven and a New Earth”, the “New Jerusalem” (or as CCC 677 says: “God’s triumph over the revolt of evil”).

REVELATION 21:1-5 1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. 2 And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband; 3 and I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling of God is with men. He will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself will be with them; 4 he will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more, neither shall there be mourning nor crying nor pain any more, for the former things have passed away.” 5 And he who sat upon the throne said, “Behold, I make all things new.”

More insight into The Great Tribulation & earthly conquest (and notice “the Saints” on earth are there and not floated away).

REVELATION 13:5-8, 10b 5 And the beast was given a mouth uttering haughty and blasphemous words, and it was allowed to exercise authority for forty-two months; 6 it opened its mouth to utter blasphemies against God, blaspheming his name and his dwelling, that is, those who dwell in heaven. 7 Also it was allowed to make war on the saints and to conquer them. And authority was given it over every tribe and people and tongue and nation, 8 and all who dwell on earth will worship it, every one whose name has not been written before the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb that was slain. . . . 10b Here is a call for the endurance and faith of the saints.

. . . “all who dwell on earth will worship it” . . .

“All” here, means “all peoples" not “all individuals” (some Jews AND Gentiles will worship the beast, others will come to Jesus. Some Christians may fall away or choose to not remain in the vine.)

“ALL” refers to “ALL peoples”, not “ALL individuals”. That’s WHY there is a call for the “endurance and faith of the saints.” If their were NO saints on earth left to “endure”, this admonition would be pointless.

St. Louis DeMontfort says great Saints will come out of this Great Tribulation—some of the greatest Saints ever. Many martyrs in times past, have already died for not adoring “the Beast”. Many in the future will as well.

CCC 2113 Idolatry not only refers to false pagan worship. It remains a constant temptation to faith. Idolatry consists in divinizing what is not God. Man commits idolatry whenever he honors and reveres a creature in place of God, whether this be gods or demons (for example, satanism), power, pleasure, race, ancestors, the state, money, etc. Jesus says, "You cannot serve God and mammon."44 **Many martyrs died for not adoring “the Beast”**45 refusing even to simulate such worship. Idolatry rejects the unique Lordship of God; it is therefore incompatible with communion with God.46

Footnote 45 refers us to Rev. chapters 13 and 14.
 
For another perspective, The Rapture Exposed by Barbara Rossing, a Lutheran theologian, takes on the rapture as popularized by the “Left Behind” books.
 
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