Revolvers for Everyone!

[sidbrown]

So now you are against the military and police because they are armed? if that is so I would at least commend your consistency. So let’s test that consistency:

If someone took your family hostage and was torchering them would you not want the police involved because the police are armed?

The commandment we have been given by Our Divine Lord and Savior is to turn the other cheek.

 

[sidbrown]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

America gun death rate = 11.66 per 100,000 pop.
America murder rate = 5.4 per 100,000 pop.

Canada gun death rate = 4.78 per 100,000 pop
Canada murder rate - 1.83 per 100,000 pop.

Strange, armed citizenry advocates would have have us believe that unarmed societies are dangerous and uncivilized.

Canada has lots of guns, strict gun control and less gun deaths than America. As well, we have a much lower murder rate.

Yet, Canadians murder each other less and we have nearly 60% per capita less gun deaths.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_gun_ownership

In 2007, 31.7 guns per 100,000 population in Canada.

In 2007, 90 guns per 100,000 in America.

What’s the correlation? An armed society is a dangerous society…at least America is.

All those armed Americans haven’t lowered the murder rate with their deterrence of grocery shopping with a Gloc.

That’s just sad.

Obviously, the answer is for the USA to follow the lead of Canada with its stricter gun control legislation.

 

[Lycorth]

An unfounded claim. No such thing has happened in Canada. We enjoy a lower murder rate, lower gun death rate and lower crime rate.

His claim is accurate. Canada’s peace comes from the quality of her citizens and the lack of criminal cultures like those that plague America. Guns do not cause crime anymore than cars cause drunk driving.

To properly work, it has to be done on a national level; not just a city level. Prohibit the manufacture of handguns with the exception of law enforcement purposes and eventually you’ll see handguns slowlly but surely disapear.

Guns will disappear, but crime will not. Guns are not the problem; crime is. Crack down on criminals and criminal culture, not inanimate objects.

Yes. That is becasue Canada has much stricter gun control laws than the USA. If the USA would enact these stricter gun control laws, we would see the crime rate go down right away.

That would not happen. Criminals would have to be done away with first for any gun control to have any positive effect. Any link between gun control being the sole factor behind lowered crime rates are entirely false and without merit.

Not ever? Not even if they are behind bars?

When they are turned loose back into society, it will not stop them. Gun control never has.

 

[sidbrown]

When they are turned loose back into society, it will not stop them. Gun control never has.

That’s becasue gun control in the USA is local and strict gun control is not a federal law.

 

[Lycorth]

That’s becasue gun control in the USA is local and strict gun control is not a federal law.

No, if gun control doesn’t work locally, what on earth makes you think it would work nationally? A bad idea that doesn’t work for a few thousand people isn’t magically going to work when declared over a million.

 

[sidbrown]

No, if gun control doesn’t work locally, what on earth makes you think it would work nationally? A bad idea that doesn’t work for a few thousand people isn’t magically going to work when declared over a million.

It doesn;t work locally because you can simply drive out of the local area and buy a gun at a gun show. With strict federal laws, this would not be permitted. So obviously, the best solution for the USA is to enact strict gun control laws just like other countries which have done so, and which have extremely low crime rates as a result.

 

[gamewell45]

Yes. That is becasue Canada has much stricter gun control laws than the USA. If the USA would enact these stricter gun control laws, we would see the crime rate go down right away.

I concur with you; furthermore, for many American’s they fear the loss of their handguns. For them its like a sercurity blanket if you will and I honestly believe in the long run if laws were enacted, the crime rate would go down and they’d finally understand the merits of why the laws were enacted in the first place.

 

[Lycorth]

It doesn;t work locally because you can simply drive out of the local area and buy a gun at a gun show.

There is no “gun show loophole”; gun shows are strictly monitored by uniformed police and undercover agents, some of whom even pose as sellers or work with them to see that gun laws are being enforced. Have you ever been to a gun show? I have. You can’t just buy a gun and walk out of the door without being checked as per the law. Heck, you can’t even walk in the door without being checked, having any guns you are bringing in checked and tagged, and being marked so as to ascertain you paid the admission and are legally allowed to be there.

With strict federal laws, this would not be permitted. So obviously, the best solution for the USA is to enact strict gun control laws just like other countries which have done so, and which have extremely low crime rates as a result.

There is not a single country in the world whose low crime rates are directly or solely attributable to gun control. Every nation in the world with a low crime rate has either one or more of three things responsible, as a general rule: 1) access to firearms and other means of self-defense by the general public, 2) quality citizenry who are not predisposed towards violent or otherwise criminal behavior and 3) a strong police presence in a given community. Gun control is irrelevant.

Like I told the other poster earlier, just go to Wikipedia and look up the gun politics of countries like Switzerland or the Czech Republic or Finland. These countries are awash in firearms, especially Switzerland, where after completing one’s required military service, one can elect to keep one’s rifle at home in semi-automatic form. Gun crime in Switzerland is extremely low; it happens, as it would anywhere, but the real numbers are very low and the citizenry does not live in fear of gun crime.

We do in America because criminal culture is not cracked down on, nor are criminal elements in society. The mafia is let alone unless they commit a crime first. Gangbangers are let alone unless they commit a crime first. Crime is permitted to be glorified in popular culture, malicious violence is depicted as acceptable or at least tolerable. The problem is not fought at its source but instead a non-issue is focused on - guns.

The longer we refuse to focus on the human problem behind crime and the longer we focus on guns as being responsible for crime is the longer we will have a crime problem.

 

[sidbrown]

There is no “gun show loophole”;.

You lack credibility.There is a gun show loophole. Under the terms of the Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986, individuals “not engaged in the business” of dealing firearms, or who only make “occasional” sales within their state of residence, are under no requirement to conduct background checks on purchasers of guns or maintain records of sales of guns.
Why not tell the truth about gun shows and the loophole in the Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986 ?

 

[Lycorth]

You lack credibility.There is a gun show loophole. Under the terms of the Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986, individuals “not engaged in the business” of dealing firearms, or who only make “occasional” sales within their state of residence, are under no requirement to conduct background checks on purchasers of guns or maintain records of sales of guns.
Why not tell the truth about gun shows and the loophole in the Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986 ?

I am telling the truth.
*
“…Proposed legislation to close a fabricated “loophole” in the law is merely a fear-based guise to end gun shows as a step toward banning all private gun transfers.*”

Full article here (too long to cut and paste the entire thing here).

Since you enjoy accusing people whom you do not know of lying, I ask you to tell the truth about your own agenda and stop lying about the fact you support the disarming of law-abiding citizens because of a paranoid fear of inanimate objects. Why do you not agree with cracking down on criminals and criminal culture? Why must law-abiding citizens pay for the crimes of traitors?

I will not give up my rational right to defend myself with a firearm nor to own firearms for that purpose. Μολὼν λαβέ.

 

[wabrams]

You lack credibility.There is a gun show loophole. Under the terms of the Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986, individuals “not engaged in the business” of dealing firearms, or who only make “occasional” sales within their state of residence, are under no requirement to conduct background checks on purchasers of guns or maintain records of sales of guns.
Why not tell the truth about gun shows and the loophole in the Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986 ?

That is not a loophole. It means anyone can sell a privately owned firearm to another private citizen w/o having to do background checks. Whether I do it with my neighbor, or in the parking lot of a church, or the parking lot at a gun show, it isn’t a “gunshow loophole.”

 

[wabrams]

. Why do you not agree with cracking down on criminals and criminal culture? Why must law-abiding citizens pay for the crimes of traitors?

B/c those of his ilk know law-abiding gun owners don’t shoot back whereas criminals do.

 

[sidbrown]

I am telling the truth.
*
“…Proposed legislation to close a fabricated “loophole” in the law is merely a fear-based guise to end gun shows as a step toward banning all private gun transfers.*”

Full article here (too long to cut and paste the entire thing here).

Since you enjoy accusing people whom you do not know of lying, I ask you to tell the truth about your own agenda and stop lying about the fact you support the disarming of law-abiding citizens because of a paranoid fear of inanimate objects. Why do you not agree with cracking down on criminals and criminal culture? Why must law-abiding citizens pay for the crimes of traitors?

I will not give up my rational right to defend myself with a firearm nor to own firearms for that purpose. Μολὼν λαβέ.

I say not. You said there is no gun show loophole.

There is no “gun show loophole”; …

This is totally and completely false. This is an outright falsehood which can easily be checked by anyone.
Under the terms of the Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986 individuals “not engaged in the business” of dealing firearms, or who only make “occasional” sales within their state of residence, are under no requirement to conduct background checks on purchasers of guns or maintain records of sale. Do you deny that this is true or not?
What is the “gun show loophole”?
The Gun Control Act of 1968 requires anyone engaged in the business of selling guns to have a Federal Firearms License (FFL) and keep a record of their sales. However, this law does not cover all gun sellers. If a supplier is selling from his or her private collection and the principal objective is not to make a profit, the seller is not “engaged in the business” and is not required to have a license. Because they are unlicensed, these sellers are not required to keep records of sales and are not required to perform background checks on potential buyers, even those prohibited from purchasing guns by the Gun Control Act. The gun show loophole refers to the fact that prohibited purchasers can avoid required background checks by seeking out these unlicensed sellers at gun shows.
You have falsely stated that there is no gun show loophole, when there is one and this can be easily verified. There are 33 states which do not restrict private, intrastate sales of firearms at gun shows.
csgv.org/issues-and-campaigns/gun-show-loophole/gun-show-loophole-faq

 

[sidbrown]

That is not a loophole. It means anyone can sell a privately owned firearm to another private citizen w/o having to do background checks. Whether I do it with my neighbor, or in the parking lot of a church, or the parking lot at a gun show, it isn’t a “gunshow loophole.”

Do you deny that the Gun Control Act of 1968 requires anyone engaged in the business of selling guns to have a Federal Firearms License (FFL) and keep a record of their sales?

 

[wabrams]

Do you deny that the Gun Control Act of 1968 requires anyone engaged in the business of selling guns to have a Federal Firearms License (FFL) and keep a record of their sales?

There in lies the distinction; if I sale a car or boat or gun to someone on an occasional basis, then it is not a business. If I do it regularly, then it becomes a business.

 

[royal_archer]

Except for Canada right? Low murder rate, low gun death rate, low crime rate…

Yet, Canada has over 10 million firearms for a population of 35 million.

Maybe everyone isn’t being killed by being shot, because we’re not ordinarily allowed to carry them around? Nah, that can’t be it…just lucky.

The demographics are different in Canada as well. Want some gang banger to move up there?

 

[royal_archer]

Think about this scenario for a moment; suppose the perpetrator didn’t have a gun? Then the good Doctor wouldn’t have needed to run out to the car and look for hers and her parents would still be alive. Stricter gun control laws on hand guns could prevent an occurance like this down the road.

OK, disarm all of the criminals then get back to us and we will then discuss the rational of disarming law abiding citizens.

 

[royal_archer]

Obviously, the answer is for the USA to follow the lead of Canada with its stricter gun control legislation.

Or we could deport all of the convicted criminals, other gang bangers and illegals to Canada.

 

[royal_archer]

That’s becasue gun control in the USA is local and strict gun control is not a federal law.

Keep in mind that it was us Americans with our privately owned weapons that broke the British empire and allowed Canadians to obtain the standard of living they are enjoying in Canada.

 

[royal_archer]

I concur with you; furthermore, for many American’s they fear the loss of their handguns. For them its like a sercurity blanket if you will and I honestly believe in the long run if laws were enacted, the crime rate would go down and they’d finally understand the merits of why the laws were enacted in the first place.

Like it did for pre WWII Germany, Stallinist USSR, and Cuba?