Rodney Meldrum's Book of Mormon tours

[VinnyDee78]

Just go along believing what you believe, and let us alone to our beliefs. I pray that one day you will be enlightened.

The forum is not one of ‘let us alone.’ It is one of ‘let us reason together.’

You have strung together quite a lot of gobbledygook and pass it off as truth. It is not truth.

Read the Book of Mormon: Another Testament of Jesus Christ. Learn what truth is. Consider it aside from all of the noise the world can throw in its way… just as they once did with Christ himself.

Its principles are true… just as some of the principles are in your additional deuterocanonical books the rest of the Christian world does not accept.

Stop being so condescending and open up your mind to the idea that the Book of Revelations (Apocalypse) was NOT God’s last dissertation to man.

Then you will really begin to live my friend. When Peter was asked by Jesus whom the people said he was he gave him all kinds of speculative answers. When He asked whom do you say that I am, Peter responded, Thou art the Christ. It was revealed to him from the Father and in no other way.

Similarly, you can know for yourself if the Book of Mormon is true.

 

[majick275]

The forum is not one of ‘let us alone.’ It is one of ‘let us reason together.’

that requires both parties to reason as opposed to one engaging in fantasy.

You have strung together quite a lot of gobbledygook and pass it off as truth. It is not truth.

the BoM and the other fraudulent writings of the womanizing conman joseph smith are NOT truth. they are no different than david koresh or jim jones works.

Read the Book of Mormon: Another Testament of Jesus Christ.

i did

Learn what truth is.

i have

Consider it aside from all of the noise the world can throw in its way… just as they once did with Christ himself.

christ is real. he is god. joseph smith was a fraud. your position is no different than that of muslims, jw’s, sda’s or scientologists.

Its principles are true… just as some of the principles are in your additional deuterocanonical books the rest of the Christian world does not accept.

the principles it plagiarizes from the bible are true. it’s others are not. for example it’s explicit condemnation of those who practice infant baptism.

Stop being so condescending and open up your mind to the idea that the Book of Revelations (Apocalypse) was NOT God’s last dissertation to man.

who said it was? it was the final word in SCRIPTURE. God speaks to man directly now. no more need for prophets. open YOUR mind to the possibility that you have been duped.

Then you will really begin to live my friend.

when you truly receive the body and blood of christ, which is true food, then YOU can truly live.

When Peter was asked by Jesus whom the people said he was he gave him all kinds of speculative answers. When He asked whom do you say that I am, Peter responded, Thou art the Christ. It was revealed to him from the Father and in no other way.

and i can assure you that God has revealed to me that Joseph Smith was afraud, the BoM a manmade work that imitates true scripture and that Christ established the catholic church and never abandoned it.

Similarly, you can know for yourself if the Book of Mormon is true.

not possible since it is not.

Then you will really begin to live my friend.

 

[dianaiad]

that requires both parties to reason as opposed to one engaging in fantasy.
the BoM and the other fraudulent writings of the womanizing conman joseph smith are NOT truth. they are no different than david koresh or jim jones works.

If you honestly cannot tell the difference between Jim Jones, David Koresh…and the CoJCoLDS, then you truly do need a reality check.

 

[Jerusha]

Read the Book of Mormon: Another Testament of Jesus Christ. Learn what truth is.

Similarly, you can know for yourself if the Book of Mormon is true.

I have read the BOM, probably more thoroughly than you have. And I received a confirmation that what truth there is in the plot of it comes from 980 AD to 1812 AD.

Reason is not part of LDS beliefs. LDS “faith” is conjured. There is nothing behind the curtain except people abusing religion to control others.

This is what I believe, and you cannot change what I believe in. No matter what you or I say, I cannot, of myself, change what you believe in. I really don’t know why you hang around this forum, because we are prefectly able to defend ourselves and protect naive Catholics from being sucked into your strange system of belief.

 

[ibkc]

I guess you also feel that way about the tablets which held the ten commandments. No need to believe the content because the physical evidence wasn’t there.

Is your name Thomas?

No, it fact, my name is Dorothy. The Ten Commandments are are a set of rules to live by, most of which are self-evident as necessary for the survival of a civilized society. Therefore there is nothing to “believe” in. It doesn’t matter if the original stones they were carved upon exist or not, unless you’re trying to claim it’s perfectly reasonable to not “believe” in a law against killing. In contrast, The Book of Mormon is one long fantastical claim after another, none of which can be demonstrated to be true, and the proof of it lies largely on the origin and existence of these alleged plates.

 

[Jerusha]

proof of it lies largely on the origin and existence of these alleged plates.

And take a look at who wrote this:

Near the west Bank of the Coneaught River there are the remains of an ancient fort. As I was walking and forming various conjectures respecting the character situation and numbers of those people who far exceeded the present race of Indians in works of art & inginuety I hapned to tread on a flat Stone. This was at a small distance from the fort: & it lay on the top of a small mound of Earth exactly horizontal – The face of it had a singular appearance I discovered a number of characters which appeared to me to be letters – but so much effaced by the ravages of time, that I could not read the inscription. With the assistance of a leaver I raised the Stone – But you may easily conjecture my astonishment when I discovered that its ends and sides rested on Stones & that it was designed as a cover to an artificial cave. – I found on examining that its Sides were lined with * * * built in a connical form with * * * down – & that it was about eight feet deep . . . . Here I noticed a big flat Stone fixed in the form of a doar. I immediately tore it down & Lo a cavity within the wall presented itself . . . . Within this cavity I found an earthan Box with a cover which shut it perfectly tite – The Box was two feet in length one & half in breadth & one and three inches in diameter. . . . When I had removed the cover I found that it contained twenty eight sheets of parchment . . . appeared to be manuscripts written in an eligant hand with Roman Letters & in the Latin Language. They were written on a variety of Subjects. But the Roll which principally attracted my attention contained a history of the authors life & that part of America which extends along the great Lakes & the waters of the Missisippy. (Spalding 1910, 1-2)

And this is how he set up his literary device by which he wrote his satire.

 

[BartBurk]

And take a look at who wrote this:

And this is how he set up his literary device by which he wrote his satire.

I almost thought I was reading the History of Joseph Smith …

 

[VinnyDee78]

No, it fact, my name is Dorothy. The Ten Commandments are are a set of rules to live by, most of which are self-evident as necessary for the survival of a civilized society. Therefore there is nothing to “believe” in. It doesn’t matter if the original stones they were carved upon exist or not, unless you’re trying to claim it’s perfectly reasonable to not “believe” in a law against killing. In contrast, The Book of Mormon is one long fantastical claim after another, none of which can be demonstrated to be true, and the proof of it lies largely on the origin and existence of these alleged plates.

Hi Dorothy - Glad to meet you.

I identified more than a thousand principles in the Book of Mormon which if examined separately I believe you would agree with a majority of them as you do the ten. I know this because I have experimented with many people of different faiths and denominations - this is the theme of my book On Common Ground: Bridging the Mormon Evangelical Divide where I tried an experiment with those investigating our church.

In short, out of 46 principles on the topic of Teach, Teacher, Teachable, they agreed with all 46 that they were true. Only 11 came from the Bible. The rest are taught from our other scriptures you so quickly defame. True is true… at least it is in my book. These are the principles we teach and live by. They clarify many of the principles in the Bible that have been so differently interpreted by all parties. Don’t be offended by it - be thankful for that clarity.

Principles are not always separate though. Some are more complex and interrelated with others - like combining fasting and prayer for a greater desired result. Similarly I catalogued a thousand principles from the OT and five hundred or so from the NT.

Yes they overlap (same God, same gospel) but the people on this continent were more open to the truth and therefore received and witnessed greater things than the Jews (who crucified Him).

The 400 or so principles cataloged from the 7 deuterocanonical books believed by Catholics, I found to be true for the most part. Talk about objectivity… a Mormon who writes a book for Catholics to get them into their own scriptures (a real shortfall in my upbrining as a Catholic) - a gift to my family and extended Catholic family of friends.

There is a lot more to this than meets the eye and worth investigating. If non-Catholic means Fraud and Heretics… then I am guilty as charged and consider the company I keep my friends, especially Joseph Smith.

Jesus is the Christ. Try to tell me otherwise, it would be wasted breath - for this is something I know, just as Simon Peter knew it.

My Best - Vinny

 

[Jerusha]

Hi Dorothy - Glad to meet you.

I identified more than a thousand principles in the Book of Mormon which if examined separately I believe you would agree with a majority of them as you do the ten.

Too bad Solomon Spalding is not being given credit for the good stuff in the BOM.

 

[ibkc]

Hi Dorothy - Glad to meet you.

I identified more than a thousand principles in the Book of Mormon which if examined separately I believe you would agree with a majority of them as you do the ten. I know this because I have experimented with many people of different faiths and denominations - this is the theme of my book On Common Ground: Bridging the Mormon Evangelical Divide where I tried an experiment with those investigating our church.

In short, out of 46 principles on the topic of Teach, Teacher, Teachable, they agreed with all 46 that they were true. Only 11 came from the Bible. The rest are taught from our other scriptures you so quickly defame.

It doesn’t matter that the LDS church teaches some good and nice things; it also teaches (or has taught) some very nasty things which are counter to Christian belief. The fact that the elaborate history claimed in the text is most certainly a fabrication puts the motives of the founders of the LDS into serious question. I can get good and nice teachings from any religion, but that doesn’t mean I need to accept any of those religions themselves as true.

 

[VinnyDee78]

It doesn’t matter that the LDS church teaches some good and nice things; it also teaches (or has taught) some very nasty things which are counter to Christian belief. The fact that the elaborate history claimed in the text is most certainly a fabrication puts the motives of the founders of the LDS into serious question. I can get good and nice teachings from any religion, but that doesn’t mean I need to accept any of those religions themselves as true.

So here we are. I believe in the fabrications of the LDS church and you believe in the fabrications of the unbroken chain of apostolic authority claimed by those who are its caretakers and benefactors - corrupt in their generations, through thousands of years of strife and Dark Ages, inquisitions, crusades, etc…

Its a wonder we have anything of worth, but God does have a plan and I thank Him for the agency that He gave us and died for so that we might ‘ask of Him’ to know for ourselves. And that my dear friend is a true principle - more than ‘good and nice’ I think.

My best - Vinny

 

[Stephen168]

So here we are. I believe in the fabrications of the LDS

Yes, there you are believing in an LDS movement; sub division of the Restoration Movement fabricated in 19th century America.

I believe in the Catholic Church started by Christ and its Apostolic Authority passed down from Peter and John to Ignatius and all the Bishops down through history; Saints and sinner all. We can take tours of its history; to Antioch, Jerusalem, and Rome. Such a wonderful thing.

 

[RebeccaJ]

Jesus is the Christ. Try to tell me otherwise, it would be wasted breath - for this is something I know, just as Simon Peter knew it.

Why would anyone try to convince you that Jesus is not the Anointed One?

However, you know very well that Mormon belief regarding Jesus involves more than that. St Peter in no way believed all of the fabricated nonsense of Joseph Smith. As a BIC Mormon, I figured this out before I was 20 years old.

All the comparisons to shared belief in the world will not validate the errors of Mormonism.

 

[ibkc]

So here we are. I believe in the fabrications of the LDS church and you believe in the fabrications of the unbroken chain of apostolic authority claimed by those who are its caretakers and benefactors - corrupt in their generations, through thousands of years of strife and Dark Ages, inquisitions, crusades, etc…

A Mormon does not need to be lecturing a Catholic about corruption in the leadership.

The list maintained by the Catholic Church of the bishops of Rome since Apostolic times is also the one accepted by mainstream scholarship. There isn’t a single non-Mormon scholar who accepts the alternate history claimed in the BoM as anything but fantasy. We have history on our side. The LDS church does not.

 

[BartBurk]

Here’s something interesting about Sidney Rigdon’s neighbors in Ohio in the 1820s. It seems they previously had lived right next door to the Manchester Smiths:

mormondiscussions.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=868&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=483

Scroll down to Dale Broadhurst’s comments a.k.a. “Uncle Dale” for the information. More likely connections between the Smiths and Rigdon.