Role of men in a relationship

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Merry Christmas everyone!!
First time posting here.

Please I need advice,

I have had so many unsuccessful relationships, my dad is not a good role model with regards to treating women because he treats my Mum badly.
The moment I enter a relationship with a lady, I automatically predict failure, it never lasts, always ends badly.
In order to maintain a HAPPY and SUCCESSFUL relationship with a lady, what should I do, can someone suggest a detailed article online.
For the record, I believe I’m an attractive guy, good self esteem (insecure some days though).
My Dad messed up, I don’t want to go that road, I want to be responsible, I want my lady to be PROUD of me.

Thanks in anticipation.
God bless you all
 
Merry Christmas everyone!!
First time posting here.

Please I need advice,

I have had so many unsuccessful relationships, my dad is not a good role model with regards to treating women because he treats my Mum badly.
That’s a legitimate explanation for your difficulties, so don’t beat yourself over them. Everybody has his own unique challenges, and some things that come easy to some people are hard or impossible to achieve for others. A greater challenge in just one area does not make you a worse person or a less successful one overall. Don’t give in to any such thoughts.

And the positive thing is that those difficulties are most likely just that, difficulties. Not absolute obstacles. It’s most probably within your power to fight and defeat them.
The moment I enter a relationship with a lady, I automatically predict failure, it never lasts, always ends badly.
You’re on the good path, actually. You already realize the difference between reality and those fears. That those fears often end up being fulfilled is a different matter, one that does not change how fears are not reality. Imagination affects how you function in reality, but imagination is not reality.

It’s quite possible you’re choosing the wrong women or at the wrong time, or alternatively the wrong moves. But, like my grannie used to say, or was it my dad, if you really met a woman who really was into you, hard, then you wouldn’t be able to get rid of her even if you tried to. 😉
In order to maintain a HAPPY and SUCCESSFUL relationship with a lady, what should I do, can someone suggest a detailed article online.
You generally can’t be happy in a relationship that’s part of your life in you’re unhappy in your life in general. First deal with the overall underlying unhappiness in your life, work out the issues that have built up over years due to your parent’s strained relationship, then you’ll be in a better shape for your own relationship with a woman.

Articles can be helpful, but don’t put too much stake in them.

As for success, being successful is overrated. 😉 In terms of Christian marriage, a successful relationship with a woman is one that gets you both into heaven. 😛 (Which doesn’t necessarily mean an easy life on earth. In fact, it involves challenged and trials and temptations.)
For the record, I believe I’m an attractive guy, good self esteem (insecure some days though).
You need to come to terms with that insecurity, accept it, forgive yourself for it (in a way), and learn to be secure in being insecure. 😉 This means, for example, learning to feel reasonably comfortable with the fact that you’re showing some such weakness as confusion or loss of words or trembling hands, or some such ‘weakness’ as attachment to or being awestruck by a woman. Obviously you don’t want to unload all that on her like cannon barrage, notably because she’s not supposed to be your crutch or your golden calf, but a woman who’s your type of girl, who respects you and wishes you well, certainly isn’t going to be put off by it kinda showing that you’re into her, that you think highly of her, that you put her on a pedestal a little, and are a little intimidated by her beauty and other graces. Or awkward as in not knowing what to say.

All of what I’ve just mentioned are handicaps in the usual ‘game’, but they are not a problem in a healthy, mature interaction.

A sensible, good woman will also be capable of getting over you not always being ideally cool and 100% reasonable and 0% ‘creepy’ about everything. In fact, she probably won’t mind at all. It’s when people are just not all that into you that they start fussing. Or you about them.

Speaking of which, don’t yield to pressure to find or keep a girlfriend. Screw that. Just like you would fight on despite being wounded physically (or heck, even crippled, if it even got to that level), you need to learn to fight on despite being wounded emotionally. And do the right thing. Not the impulse thing. Not the knee-jerk thing. By this I don’t mean cold ethical calculation, but rather honour, courage and other proper manly motivations to act. 😉 There is sometimes a woman you don’t want to lose, but most of them are not it, and losing them won’t kill you (in fact it may help you live).
My Dad messed up, I don’t want to go that road, I want to be responsible, I want my lady to be PROUD of me.
You aren’t your dad. Forgive him, pray for him, cheer for him, root for him, pray for him (including perhaps for forgiveness and mending of past mistakes), but don’t identify with him to the point where you lose your identity and become only an extension of him.

And you don’t owe it to women or even that one particular woman to make up for your dad and how badly he treated your lady mother. You aren’t fixing their relationship by replaying it with the women you meet.

And yes, I’ve been there, done that.

EDIT: Oh, and you need to have the courage to reach for the women you really want. Don’t choose them because of making up for your dad or because of seeing an opportunity in the circumstances, like a man who looks for wounded sparrows because he thinks a damsel without distress wouldn’t even look at him. Get rid of that sort of thinking. While your particular damsel may in fact be in distress, look for and at the damsel, not the distress. And in any case courage, courage courage. (And courage is about acting despite fears, not about not feeling fear, which would be stupidity, more like.)
 
Merry Christmas everyone!!
First time posting here.

Please I need advice,

I have had so many unsuccessful relationships, my dad is not a good role model with regards to treating women because he treats my Mum badly.
The moment I enter a relationship with a lady, I automatically predict failure, it never lasts, always ends badly.
In order to maintain a HAPPY and SUCCESSFUL relationship with a lady, what should I do, can someone suggest a detailed article online.
For the record, I believe I’m an attractive guy, good self esteem (insecure some days though).
My Dad messed up, I don’t want to go that road, I want to be responsible, I want my lady to be PROUD of me.

Thanks in anticipation.
God bless you all
How about some therapy?

I would also suggest reading the following books:

Don’t Shoot the Dog by Karen Pryor (it’s about positive reinforcement)

Boundaries in Marriage (it’s about how to simultaneously be kind, respectful, and have good boundaries)

The Five Love Languages

The Seven Principles for Making Marriage Work

A number of those are marriage books, but I think you will find all of them very helpful even just in dating and I believe they will all be very helpful with children as well.
 
I would say that everybody (even people from good homes) has gotten some bad examples from their parents, so in a way, knowing that you will need to do things differently means that you are already at an advantage.
 
Thank you so much Xantippe and chevalier, I cherish the advice you’ve given me.
I think I need to learn good communication skills too. How do I learn that? Stuff like how to react when angry? How not to sound arrogant?-I get lots of feedback on that one.

Thanks
Love this family:)
 
Thank you so much Xantippe and chevalier, I cherish the advice you’ve given me.
I think I need to learn good communication skills too. How do I learn that? Stuff like how to react when angry? How not to sound arrogant?-I get lots of feedback on that one.
It may be frustrating and awkward and all sorts of ill at ease, but in the end you’ll end up having l33t communication/relationship skills, which is going to be good for you and Queen Ugo. 😉

And Merry Christmas to you! 🙂 :christmastree1: In a way, I forgot about Christmas in all this. 😉 Hope yours was as good as it can be.

EDIT: How to react when angry is probably something better talked about with a proper counsellor, you know, those guys who get professional training to help folks learn anger management. It makes no point doing it alone if they’re ready to help you big time for a modest fee.

As for ‘how not to sound arrogant’, you can’t really control how others perceive you — and you shouldn’t even want to. That’s something one probably must learn to become comfortable leaving up to the audience to decide, just like no lawyer and no defendant (or plaintiff, or even judge) can control what the jury’s going to decide. Either the jury or the audience is there to stay, in the loop, not out. 🙂 But if you let go, you’ll get rid of a heavy burden.

Don’t play head games (unless you learn professional communication skills like an actor who is supposed to use his or her voice to consciously convey specific emotions), rely on textual content — just tell people you don’t mean to sound arrogant, and then only if you think that’s a realistic possibility. If it’s a fleeting fear, an unreasonable doubt, then let it go. Don’t be overly apologetic (as in don’t apologize profusely by default), but telling people you’re sorry or apologizing for the inconvenience is powerful, and helpful, when you mean it.

Also, don’t allow people to put a foot in the door and wedge themselves in to be your uninvited, self-appointed life coaches. They have a problem, they get to say it, and that’s it. They don’t get to tell you how to live your life, how to communicate, or how you should feel etc. This is especially important when people accuse you of arrogance — being soft and gullible about that sort of thing exposes you to the risk of manipulation and domination by people who would tell you you’re arrogant simply for disagreeing with them or not giving them what they want.
 
These books are a good read:

Be a Man! Be the Man God Created You to Be by Fr. Larry Richards.
Boy Meets Girl, Say Hello to Courtship by protestant Joshua Harris.

And an online test of what’s your love language and your girlfriend’s at 5lovelanguages.com
 
These books are a good read:

Be a Man! Be the Man God Created You to Be by Fr. Larry Richards.
Boy Meets Girl, Say Hello to Courtship by protestant Joshua Harris.
I would avoid anything by Joshua Harris. He’s not a good role model for Catholic relationships.
 
These books are a good read:

Be a Man! Be the Man God Created You to Be by Fr. Larry Richards.
Boy Meets Girl, Say Hello to Courtship by protestant Joshua Harris.

And an online test of what’s your love language and your girlfriend’s at 5lovelanguages.com
With all due respect to our Protestant brethren, taking dating advice from conservative Protestants tends to end in historical reconstruction activities. I’m a traditionalist and a conservative myself, but when I hear the word ‘courtship’, my fists clench along with my teeth and I roll my eyes, and all that jazz. More Victorian (or especially more puritan) does not more Catholic make.
 
The best relationships between men and women are, first and foremost, true friendships. The two people honestly see things in each other that they both respect and admire beyond those things they respect and admire in their other friends. The two have a natural affection that they use to excuse some human foibles, even though they don’t deny those human faults exist. They both find that the other makes them want to be better and do better–well, on most days, anyway. Both have a sense of integrity that binds them to do the right thing even when they could look in their partner’s faults and failings for excuses not to do their part. Both have a sense of self that allows them to maintain certain boundaries of self-respect, too.

The world is full of very good women who are not going to be that kind of partner for you. If you start to date them, the day is going to come, then, when one or both of you realize that you haven’t found one of the persons with whom you can make a good marriage.

That is OK. That kind of break-up isn’t a dating failure. That kind of break-up is a dating success. Dating someone and forcing things forward in spite of the realization that you aren’t good together–that is a dating failure.
 
I would avoid anything by Joshua Harris. He’s not a good role model for Catholic relationships.
With all due respect to our Protestant brethren, taking dating advice from conservative Protestants tends to end in historical reconstruction activities. I’m a traditionalist and a conservative myself, but when I hear the word ‘courtship’, my fists clench along with my teeth and I roll my eyes, and all that jazz. More Victorian (or especially more puritan) does not more Catholic make.
I really don’t see what’s so bad about that book unless you two have read it and found something that’s unbearable.
 
If you want to know how good marriages work, I’d say to make friends who have good marriages, hang around with them, and talk to them. You’ll find good marriages come in many different packages. You don’t learn it out of a book, although books can offer some very valuable insights. You learn it by seeing it.

I do think that John Gottman’s books have some very valuable insights about how successfully-married couples handle their complaints and conflicts. That is worth reading about, because even the couples who do that right usually a) do it in private and b) don’t necessarily know why the things that they do that work actually work. Definitely check some of those out of the library and learn to use those methods of complaining and conducting your interpersonal conflicts generally. If your parents had a lot of drama in their relationship or one side doing all the work, I’d also suggest looking through the addiction literature, such as “The New Codependency” by Melodie Beatty. You don’t have to be an addict or a co-dependent to learn a lot about the most common ways people fail in their interpersonal relationships and what more reliable strategies look like.

That won’t make you the perfect guy. That will make you better able to navigate being a human guy trying to have a mutually-sustaining relationship with a human woman, a relationship that is far more joyful than not. That is the ticket.
 
There are also free videos online about Courtship by Fulton Sheen, worth it!
 
Merry Christmas everyone!!
First time posting here.

Please I need advice,

I have had so many unsuccessful relationships, my dad is not a good role model with regards to treating women because he treats my Mum badly.
The moment I enter a relationship with a lady, I automatically predict failure, it never lasts, always ends badly.
In order to maintain a HAPPY and SUCCESSFUL relationship with a lady, what should I do, can someone suggest a detailed article online.
For the record, I believe I’m an attractive guy, good self esteem (insecure some days though).
My Dad messed up, I don’t want to go that road, I want to be responsible, I want my lady to be PROUD of me.

Thanks in anticipation.
God bless you all
When you ask to be pointed to a “detailed article online” about maintaining a happy and successful relationship, it makes me wonder if you think there is a sure fire one way that will win ‘any of them’ (my quotes), and that isn’t true. All people (my emphasis here, is women) are different in that what satisfies and makes one proud is not the same for the other! This is true in ANY sort of relationship with people. A woman who highly values good looks and lots of money is going to want a man to try hard to look good and make a lot of money- that is what is going to ‘make her proud’. A woman who highly values virtue is going to want a man who is virtuous- that man will ‘make her proud’. No generalization is going to work. What will work is finding the right match. The only generalization that would help is that of knowing what love really is and how it works,… and God is love, so seek God first, the rest will be given. (Paraphrased from Scripture Mathew 6:33)

“Unsuccessful relationships” are common on the road to finding ‘the one’, that is, a person that is a right match for you, so there is no need to beat yourself up over one. I’d even say they are necessary because you can learn from past mistakes or find out that what you thought was perfect for you was not, and wasn’t actually something you want. Perhaps you are putting things in an unfair perspective that it was always “YOU!”, and not the reality that it takes two- AND not that anyone is guilty of anything, sometimes two people are just unequally yoked!
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 This insecurity you have about not having your dad be a good role model may be effecting you to take on too much of the responsibility of these 'failed' relationships!    You may be taking things in the dating realm too seriously at first... which is why you might stamp yourself with the thoughts that 'predict failure' when maybe its just your inner self saying at the beginning, "I'm not sure about this one".... which you may not be listening to because you want so badly to prove to yourself "I'm not going to be like my father!" that you brush right past any inner intuitions and not heed them so that your desire here can be fulfilled, and that itch can be scratched (relieved).  (forgive the run on sentance there, I hope you can catch what I mean)    So, do cut yourself some slack.  Take a closer look at the dynamics!
Its also probably a good thing to understand where your father went wrong… don’t ‘evilize’ another, because someday we might find ourselves doing the same thing… and even wondering how we fell into it! (St. Paul even says in Scripture similar when he says he does the things he does not want to do- paraphrased from Romans 7:19) When I looked deeper into why I saw some couples hurting, its not always as easy as this one or the other is ‘the bad one’.
The difference between knowledge and understanding is immense. But knowledge is the start of understanding, so seek on.. I urge you to not stop at just acquiring knowledge but seek to understand the dynamics of relating- which is what a good counselor will help you do as that is what they're trained to do. I feel that is what you are doing here, but I also sense you aren't fully realizing the amount of seeking of understanding you will have to do before things work for you. What I'm trying to say is I think its not going to be so simple as reading an online article or asking us here, not that its a bad thing that you ask, but that it probably won't satisfy or fill your needs. All we can do here is guess and fathom, but I DO pray that what I say here is helpful to you and that God grants you grace and peace in this matter.
 
Thank you so much Xantippe and chevalier, I cherish the advice you’ve given me.
I think I need to learn good communication skills too. How do I learn that? Stuff like how to react when angry? How not to sound arrogant?-I get lots of feedback on that one.

Thanks
Love this family:)
Every single book I mentioned will be helpful for communication and anger management.
 
I really don’t see what’s so bad about that book unless you two have read it and found something that’s unbearable.
Well, it starts with the unrealistic premise that most couples who are ready for marriage are still living with their parents, and much of it is based on that scenario.

I would also say that while group activities are a great way to get to know each other, at some point a couple do need to be able to get to know each other on a more personal level than is appropriate for people in a bit-serious relationship, and that requires one-on-one dating, not “dates” with other couples or with a younger sibling tagging along. “We were never able to have a private conversation before our wedding night” is a pretty good setup for a potential annulment.

As just one example: if one half of the couple has abusive parents, are they supposed to disclose that rather critical bit of information to the potential spouse while the abusers are present?

Or, perhaps one half of the equation has some sort of private issue that a potential spouse should be aware of, but not the general public. Details about, say, endometriosis or testicular tortion really do need to be shared before marriage, and a group date isn’t usually the best venue for them.

Example: “So, Fred, Bill, Sue and Evelyn, I thought I’d spend this evening telling all of you exactly what my private parts look like and how they function because Angela had a right to know at this point” is, er, not an appropriate lead-in to dinner conversation in most circles. 😉
 
Also, re the courtship theory espoused by Joshua Harris: I’m a pretty big believer in the theory that if a couple can’t go to Starbucks for a cup of coffee without giving into lust and having sex on the coffee bar right there in front of God, the barista, and everybody, then there is absolutely no way they’re mature enough for marriage.
 
I really don’t see what’s so bad about that book unless you two have read it and found something that’s unbearable.
That whole “courtship” thing from the fundamental Protestants smacks of the creepy Duggar/ Bill Goatherd cult behavior.
 
**If you want to know how good marriages work, I’d say to make friends who have good marriages, hang around with them, and talk to them. You’ll find good marriages come in many different packages. You don’t learn it out of a book, although books can offer some very valuable insights. You learn it by seeing it.

I do think that John Gottman’s books have some very valuable insights about how successfully-married couples handle their complaints and conflicts. That is worth reading about, because even the couples who do that right usually a) do it in private and b) don’t necessarily know why** the things that they do that work actually work. Definitely check some of those out of the library and learn to use those methods of complaining and conducting your interpersonal conflicts generally. If your parents had a lot of drama in their relationship or one side doing all the work, I’d also suggest looking through the addiction literature, such as “The New Codependency” by Melodie Beatty. You don’t have to be an addict or a co-dependent to learn a lot about the most common ways people fail in their interpersonal relationships and what more reliable strategies look like.

That won’t make you the perfect guy. That will make you better able to navigate being a human guy trying to have a mutually-sustaining relationship with a human woman, a relationship that is far more joyful than not. That is the ticket.
Right.

One very interesting thing about Gottman is that he talks (I forget in which book) about how some conflicts in marriage are permanent, but do not need to be fatal for the marriage.

That is a very interesting fact to have on hand–that there can be a basic incompatibility without it being The End. To give a very minor example, I love travel and languages and (but rarely get to travel and haven’t left North America since the late 1990s), whereas my husband travels for business and dislikes it. I have literally had conversations with him where he talked about how TERRIBLE it was to have to go to Paris. (I have never been to Paris and of course I got to take care of everything and everybody at home while husband was suffering in Paris.)

There is material in that for quite a good fight, but I think we’ve ironed it out pretty well:

–we try to do a night or two away every year as a whole family
–my husband and I each take some of the kids to see family every year, and on my trip, I scratch the travel itch
–we have plans for me to travel with the kids
–we have plans for me (and/or the kids) to accompany him on business travel in the future

My husband is never going to love travel and I am never going to love being home all the time, but it is possible to figure out a) how to provide me with opportunities for travel and b) how to make it less miserable for him.
 
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