Roll of Nuns and Monks

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What is the roll of the nuns and the monks in the Church? And how important are they in the Church?

Thank you!
 
This post might get more results in the Vocation subforum.
To answer your question the main apostolate of monks and nuns is to pray for the Church and the world, but over time other works have developed such as the running of schools and seminaries.
Their vocation is very important to the Church as they support other apostolates through their prayer.
 
Nowhere_Man said:
This post might get more results in the Vocation subforum.
To answer your question the main apostolate of monks and nuns is to pray for the Church and the world, but over time other works have developed such as the running of schools and seminaries.
Their vocation is very important to the Church as they support other apostolates through their prayer.
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A big part of their role, in the Benedictine tradition, is the reception of guests; the Rule of St. Benedict makes clear that all monastics are to greet guests to the monastery as if Christ Himself was walking through the door. As a result hospitality is a very big component of a Benedictine monastery, and that translates into a guest house for the reception of guests, of varying size.

And from that as you can imagine people visiting monasteries are often seeking spiritual direction, healing, escape from a crisis, etc. So monastics have also developed a tradition of helping those in need who come to the monastery. They also do this regardless of the religious affiliation (or lack thereof) of those seeking help.

Many, many lives have been saved by monastics helping guests in crisis.
 
Thank you for the answer and sorry for posting this in the wrong place.😦 I get confused here sometimes.
 
Actually, I’d say this section is fitting for your question, unless you are looking for vocation information.

Monks and Nuns were once the backbone of Christianity, and still are in the East. Monks separate themselves from the world and give their lives entirely to prayer and sacrifice for themselves and for the Church. This is their role and what sets them apart from Mendicant orders (most Franciscans, Dominicans, etc, though many orders of friars live monastic-esque lives, for example the Capuchins St. Pio belonged to). Spiritual direction for guests and community service is a secondary. Monks aim at attaining oneness with God (Theosis) and to pray constantly, even during menial tasks.

In the Roman Church, the role, or value if you will, of monks has gradually decreased, often replaced by friars and recently non-religious lay. In the West, Monasteries are more community centered than the East (as opposed to solitude). Monastic orders within the Roman Church include Benedictans, Cistercians, Trappists (all three of which follow the rule of St. Benedict), and Carthusians.

The term Nun is used for both monastic and mendicant female “monks”. Most of the I don’t know how many thousand orders of nuns serve the poor and teach. Very few live a monastic life. Many live contemplative lives, which usually means a prayer life of a monk within a populated area and with community services.
 
I think there is some major confusion here. Monks and Nuns are counterparts to each other, male and female monastics. Before going into their role in the Church, let’s clarify one thing.

Nuns and monks are very different from


  1. *]mendicants,
    *]friars,
    *]sisters,
    *]lay brothers,
    *]religious brothers,
    *]and clerks regular

    The men and women on this list are consecrated religious, but they are not monks or nuns. The women religious that you have met on the street, in the parish, the school, the hospital and in other apostolic works are not nuns.

    They are women religious. Women religious come in two categories, congregations or societies of apotolic life. They do not belong to any religious order, nor do they ever make solemn vows. They make simple vows. Canonically, doctrinally, and theologically, they are very different from a nun. It’s a different vocation than that of a nun. A woman religious lives the Gospel in service of the people of God through the active apostolate.

    The male religious that you meet from this list that I posted are not monks. Some of us wear similar dress, because we were founded in the Middle Ages when this was the customary dress for the working man. But we are not monks. Here, it gets a little tricky.

    Friars borrow a lot from monasticism. We pray the Divine Office in common. We have daily mass. Our life includes daily silence, Lectio Divina and contemplation. We belong to religious orders, not to congregations. We make solemn vows, not simple vows. These are things that we get from monasticism. Unlike monks, we do not live in monasteries. Nor do we have enclosures or cloisters. Our vocation is to live the Gospel life of the monk in the secular world. The friar will teach, preach, serve the poor, many are priests, not all are priests, many friars are other: theologians, spiritual directors, retreat masters, doctors, cooks, carpenters or whatever is needed by their community and the people of God. The most numerous friars are Franciscan, Carmelite, Dominican and Trinitarian.

    There are also Clerks Regular. These are religious communities of priests. This is why they are called, Clerks, from the work cleric. Regular from the word Regula (Rule). These are priests who live the religious life with fraternal bonds. However, they never make solemn vows. They make simple vows, with one exception, the Jesuits. A clerk does not have to pray the Divine Office in Community,have daily community mass and they don’t always live together. These things are going to vary depending on the congregation. They are members of congregtions. They live the Gospel according to the mission of their community and the spirit of their founder. They are very active. They do the same work as friars, but their life is not as austere and their community life is not as intense. They are priests.

    Now we get to monks and nuns. Monks and nuns are exactly the same, except for gender. Their life is one of prayer, penance, silence, solitude, hospitality to the immigrant, manual labor and study. They make solemn vows and are always members of a religious order. Their role in the Church is essential to the life of the Church. Pope John Paul II wrote an encylical in which he stated that the Church could not stand without the monk and the nun. The monk and nun is the voice of prayer of the Church. While the rest of us are busy about our daily lives, be that lay, priestly or religius, the monk and nun is at prayer for us. At every hour of the day, somewhere in the world, there is a monk and a nuns awake, praying for the whole Church, as they pray around the clock.

    They have never ceased to be the spiritual backbone of the Church and they will be here until the end of time. The first traditions of monasticism were the Benedictines in the Latin Church and the Basilians in the East. But the grace of God did not stop there. The Holy Spirit raised up many other monastic families such as the Carmelite nuns, Poor Clare nun, Trinitarian Nuns, Dominican Nuns (not to be confused with the Dominican sisters), Visitandine Nuns, and several other families of nuns.

    The monks also errupted in their own way. Out of the Benedictines came the Cistercians. From the Cistercians came the Trappists. Another monastic family that came from the Benedictine Family are the Camaldolese. Then St. Bruno raised up the Charterhouse, where hermits live and pray. A hermit is not a monk. The monk and nun live in community. Hermits do not live in community. Each one has his own little cottage with everything he needs. These cottages are connected. Usually, on Sundays and major holy days, the hermits will come together to spend the day. Normally, they eat, pray, play, and work alone. They are considered part of the monastic family, even though they are not true monks.

    To wrap up, monks and nuns are very different from the active religious. They are the spiritual backbone of the Church in the East and West. They are essential to the life of grace of the Church. Their life or payer, silence, solitude, penance, work and study earns graces for the Body and the forgiveness of sins. They offer their lives on the cross with Christ at the altar at every mass. We all do that, but their life and our lives are very different. Their gift is considered by the Church to be the more noble, because it’s a higher calling. They love so much, that they cannot give themselves to any man or woman, to any ministry or apostolate. They can only live for intimacy with Christ day in and day out. One more thing, most monks are not priests. You enter a monastery to be a brother monk, not to be a priest. The monastery decides who will be ordained. They ordain as many men as they need. Some monks have become bishops and popes.

    Fraternally,

    Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
Brother, thanks for the great post once again. I know this stuff but could never put it into words. When people ask me the difference I struggle to communicate the difference so I end up making a hash of it 😛 I need to save one of your posts for future reference. I have just one question. Maybe two, actually.

Ok, two questions if that’s fine. As you might remember, I’m going to the FSSR next year. Now, are they considered monks? Despite not being an “Order”? I’m not sure you know all that much about them, but it’s something that confused me.

Secondly,
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JReducation:
Some monks have become bishops and popes.
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I watched an FSSR final profession and one of the promises was to give up all titles and positions within the Church. Is this something that a few Orders/Congregations/etc do? For a while I thought they all did it, then I saw that a Benedictine has become the new Bishop of Pluscard and I know a few popes have been Religious too. I am a bit confused 🙂

Thanks Brother!
 
NewsTheMan said:
Brother, thanks for the great post once again. I know this stuff but could never put it into words. When people ask me the difference I struggle to communicate the difference so I end up making a hash of it 😛 I need to save one of your posts for future reference. I have just one question. Maybe two, actually.

Ok, two questions if that’s fine. As you might remember, I’m going to the FSSR next year. Now, are they considered monks? Despite not being an “Order”? I’m not sure you know all that much about them, but it’s something that confused me.
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Canonically the Sons of the Most Holy Redeemer (FSSR) are not monks. Monks make solem vows and belong to a religious order. The FSSR do not make solemn vows and are not a religious order. However, they do have many monastic elements in their daily life. This is not uncommon. The Passionists and the Redemptorists are Clerks Regular too. However, they too have many monastic practices in their daily life.

One of the beauties of congregations is that they do not follow a rule of life that is absolute. In other words, their rule can be changed by a vote of the membership. Generally, these communities do not refer to their statutes as The Rule, so as not to confuse outsiders with the actual rules: Benedict, Augustine, Albert, Francis, and Basil. These four cannot be changed except by a pope. This allows the FSSP to be more or less monastic according to their needs and the needs of the Church.

Currently, the status of the FSSP is unclear. Their priests are not suspended and their brothers were never penalized. However, there is confusion in everyone’s mind whether or not they are canonically erected or are still on hold.

Not to be canonically erected is not a mark against them. It simply means that you cannot exercise ministry without the permission of the local bishop. This would include such things as saying mass for the general public outside of their house. If the local bishop gives permission, the can do whatever . . . .
Secondly,
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I watched an FSSR final profession and one of the promises was to give up all titles and positions within the Church. Is this something that a few Orders/Congregations/etc do? For a while I thought they all did it, then I saw that a Benedictine has become the new Bishop of Pluscard and I know a few popes have been Religious too. I am a bit confused 🙂
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Thanks Brother!
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No, actually only the Jesuits and the Redemptorists make this vow.

Some rules prohibit the solicitation of ecclesial offices. For example, the Franciscan Rules (Francis founded three orders with their own rules) clearly state that the brothers shall not ask for ecclesial titles. This means that they cannot ask to have one of their members elevated to the episcopal state or some other post in the Church.

In the case of the FSSR, just like the Jesuits, because the Church has the power to bind and unbind, she also has the power to cancel out a vow. This has happened to many Jesuits. The pope has decided that they will be bishops and has simply decreed that the vow is no longer in force. What the pope cannot do is force someone to become a bishop. This would make the ordination invalid. Ordination assumes that you consent. Just like marriage, there is no such thing as a shot-gun ordination or profession of vows. It must be free.

If the pope were to select an FSSR to be bishop, along with the offer would also go a dispensation from the vow. The man can’t accept the offer, if he’s bound by the vow. The two are in the same communique.

Does this help?

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
At_Trent said:
Such as Bishop Hugh Gilbert, OSB

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-em4wGG7yNeo/TkpTtUEOwgI/AAAAAAAAFF8/TDhbe8BKVo0/s400/new+bishop.JPG

papastronsay.blogspot.com/

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugh_Gilbert_%28bishop%29
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I think that among religious, the Benedictines and Franciscans have the record number of bishops. The funny thing about both orders is that they are not orders of priests. Traditionally, they are orders of brothers. You enter the Benedictine family or the Franciscan family to be a religious, not to be a priest. If you were to tell a vocation director that you’re there to be a priest, they would send you down the street to the local diocesan seminary. You don’t have to be a consecrated religious to be a priest. You enter the Benedictine family to be a monk or the Franciscan family to be either a friar or a secular brother.

Both families have always had priests. Since their early days many priests literally abandoned their parishes to follow the great spiritual patriarchs: Benedict, Bernard, Robert, Francis and Bonaventure. Unlike the FSSR and the CSSR, which were founded as communities of priests, with lay brothers to take care of the house and other manual work.

Heck, one of the Benedictine brothers, who was not a priest, was elected pope. He accepted the election kicking and screaming. Was ordained deacon, then a priest, then a bishop and then crowned a pope. Then he resigned a few months later. This was Brother Pietro de Marrone aka St. Celestine V. I call him the reluctant pope. He passed a law that a pope could abdicate and then applied to himself and walked off.

Another reluctant prelate was St. Bonaventure. He was the dishwasher at the house in Paris when he was elected Bishop of Ostia. He accepted out of obedience. Then he was sent a red hat, making him a cardinal. There was a problem. The good bishop was no where to be found.

When they looked, they found him, guess where? You got it. In the kitchen doing the dishes for the friars, in his habit, barefoot and having the time of his life. He took the red hat and hung it on a tree branch.

Later, the General Chapter elected him Minister General and commanded him to go into seclusion and write the official biography of St. Francis. The good cardinal was so in love with his spiritual father that he did as he was told. He went off to Mt. Alvernia, where Francis had received his stigmata and there he contemplated and prayed over the life of Francis. He would come down only to teach about Francis and to attend to the affairs of the order. No one really knows who ran his diocese.

I’ve always wondered if one of faithful of his diocese murdered him. I can imagine the frustration of his clergy and laity with this bishop who was more invested in being a brother than a bishop. He was murdered on his way back from a council.

Religious bishops have a colorful history. I know one thing, the Franciscan popes have been the worse administrators. They were all very holy men. But none of them wanted the job and it showed. They did the minimum. They took advantage of every opportunity to get back to the friars. They were also the most forgiving of the popes, which has earned them a great deal of criticism from some sectors.

Even some of the Secular Franciscan popes were considered very soft or at times too ecumenical. They were just following the rule that they promised to obey. 🤷 Pope John XXIII was the last Franciscan pope. He was an SFO cleric.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
NewsTheMan said:
Hey thats exactly who I was talking about in my post 😃 Hopefully he will help the FSSR in the years to come, His Excellency looks to be a good man.

It helps a lot! Thank you Brother JR. I’ll be starting a Brother JR fanclub soon I think!
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I don’t want to be admired. I want to be prayed for. It’s not my reputation that I care about. It’s my soul.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
JReducation said:
I think that among religious, the Benedictines and Franciscans have the record number of bishops. The funny thing about both orders is that they are not orders of priests. Traditionally, they are orders of brothers. You enter the Benedictine family or the Franciscan family to be a religious, not to be a priest. If you were to tell a vocation director that you’re there to be a priest, they would send you down the street to the local diocesan seminary. You don’t have to be a consecrated religious to be a priest. You enter the Benedictine family to be a monk or the Franciscan family to be either a friar or a secular brother.

Both families have always had priests. Since their early days many priests literally abandoned their parishes to follow the great spiritual patriarchs: Benedict, Bernard, Robert, Francis and Bonaventure. Unlike the FSSR and the CSSR, which were founded as communities of priests, with lay brothers to take care of the house and other manual work.

Heck, one of the Benedictine brothers, who was not a priest, was elected pope. He accepted the election kicking and screaming. Was ordained deacon, then a priest, then a bishop and then crowned a pope. Then he resigned a few months later. This was Brother Pietro de Marrone aka St. Celestine V. I call him the reluctant pope. He passed a law that a pope could abdicate and then applied to himself and walked off.

**Another reluctant prelate was St. Bonaventure. He was the dishwasher at the house in Paris when he was elected Bishop of Ostia. He accepted out of obedience. Then he was sent a red hat, making him a cardinal. There was a problem. The good bishop was no where to be found.

When they looked, they found him, guess where? You got it. In the kitchen doing the dishes for the friars, in his habit, barefoot and having the time of his life. He took the red hat and hung it on a tree branch.**

Later, the General Chapter elected him Minister General and commanded him to go into seclusion and write the official biography of St. Francis. The good cardinal was so in love with his spiritual father that he did as he was told. He went off to Mt. Alvernia, where Francis had received his stigmata and there he contemplated and prayed over the life of Francis. He would come down only to teach about Francis and to attend to the affairs of the order. No one really knows who ran his diocese.

I’ve always wondered if one of faithful of his diocese murdered him. I can imagine the frustration of his clergy and laity with this bishop who was more invested in being a brother than a bishop. He was murdered on his way back from a council.

Religious bishops have a colorful history. I know one thing, the Franciscan popes have been the worse administrators. They were all very holy men. But none of them wanted the job and it showed. They did the minimum. They took advantage of every opportunity to get back to the friars. They were also the most forgiving of the popes, which has earned them a great deal of criticism from some sectors.

Even some of the Secular Franciscan popes were considered very soft or at times too ecumenical. They were just following the rule that they promised to obey. 🤷 Pope John XXIII was the last Franciscan pope. He was an SFO cleric.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
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That’s a funny story about St Bonaventure 🙂
 
JReducation said:
This was Brother Pietro de Marrone aka St. Celestine V. I call him the reluctant pope. He passed a law that a pope could abdicate and then applied to himself and walked off.
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Quite frankly, that is hilarious 🙂
I can imagine the frustration of his clergy and laity with this bishop who was more invested in being a brother than a bishop.
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It’s interesting you say that. My parish is run by Franciscans, 3 of them living in a a house. My confessor is quite young (40ish) and we chat once a month at my house. He confided in me that he didn’t want to be a Priest and he feels bad about it. He said that all he wants to do is be a Franciscan, but because of the priest shortage in Africa they ordained him and sent him to be a priest. He seemed sad about it, and I feel for him. I know he enjoys what he does as a Priest, but it’s a shame he can’t do what he wants to do which is be a Franciscan without being a Priest. This is what he told me anyway.
JReducation said:
I don’t want to be admired. I want to be prayed for. It’s not my reputation that I care about. It’s my soul.
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I know, I know. I was kidding. Many members do pray for you I am sure, but I am also positive many admire you even if it’s not something you asked for, that’s all!
 
At_Trent said:
That’s a funny story about St Bonaventure 🙂
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When I was a theology student I had to read his writings. Of course I knew that he helped to write parts of the Summa, until he was called back to Assisi. Then he left poor Thomas on his own.

Anyway, from his writings, because they are so elevated, i always imagined him to be very serious guy. You see, we studied his work, but we did not have to read his life.

I was on vacation, back in the States. I had nothing to do. I decided I was going to get to know these great theologians: Bonaventure, Aquinas, Bellarmine, Scotus, etc. Well, Aquinas and Bonaventure are two clowns. They are a riot.

Bonaventure was just the most simple human being around. Aquinas was the most loving and cheerful person. He didn’t take too many things seriously, including his own writings. However, he did take one thing very seriously, gues what that was? Foooooood. The man loved to eat. He was huge. The friars called him The Ox. He has over weight, clumsy as heck and he could chow down faster and more than any friar in the priory. It was a riot, because the Dominicans had strict poverty. They had very simple meals. Thomas was known to take everyone’s left overs, because he loved eating. He neve let food go to waste. They had to carve a semi-circle in the table at his place in the refectory, because in those days they sat on benches along the wall with long stationary tables. The problem was that the other friars were slender. Thomas didn’t fit. They had to cut into the table.

Some of these guys were a hoot. I once heard an SSPX priest talking about Bonaventure and Thomas. He was going on and on about these two giants. Of course I know they are. That’s not the point. What struck me as funny and I pointed it out to Father was this. I said, “Father, if either of those guys applied to your seminary, you guys would dismiss them in a week.” He didn’t undestand why I would say that. He thought I was being anti SSPX. So I explained, “You guys are too formal, too serious and too neat for these guys,” and I told him some of their stories. The poor man’s eyes almost popped. I cracked up laughing. He, like many people, is familiar with their writing and had a vision of these scholars with an aristocratic demeanor. You know, the scholarly image, beard, pipe and all. They were just the opposite.

Aquinas visited Bonnie while they were colleagues at Paris. They were buddies. A friar led him to Bonnie’s cell. As they arrived, Bonnie was in deep contemplation looking at a drawing of Francis. He used to complate on St. Francis a great deal. They couldn’t shake him out of it. Finally, Aquinas said to the friar, “Nevermind, leave the saint to his saint. I’ll come back when he returns to earth.” It’s so funny to imagine the Angelic Doctor making lite of a mystical moment. One has to take it for what it is. It’s not mockery. It’s a sense of humor.

I love these guys.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
NewsTheMan said:
Quite frankly, that is hilarious 🙂
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Celestine is a riot. Boniface had him chased down and dragged back to Rome, kicking and screaming the whole time and he lived the rest of his days in a cell, like a prison, but he would not take up the Chair of Peter again. Since there is no moral obligation to be pope, there was no sin. Of course, guess which pope said there was no moral obligation . . . Pope Celestine. :rotfl:
It’s interesting you say that. My parish is run by Franciscans, 3 of them living in a a house. My confessor is quite young (40ish) and we chat once a month at my house. He confided in me that he didn’t want to be a Priest and he feels bad about it. He said that all he wants to do is be a Franciscan, but because of the priest shortage in Africa they ordained him and sent him to be a priest. He seemed sad about it, and I feel for him. I know he enjoys what he does as a Priest, but it’s a shame he can’t do what he wants to do which is be a Franciscan without being a Priest. This is what he told me anyway.
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That’s what makes Franciscans and Benedictines so unique. It’s also what makes Franciscan not well liked by many Traditionalists. Again, it goes to that lack of understanding of the richness of Catholic Tradition.

The Franciscan family is not a clerical family. As I said, priests ran to follow Francis. In practice, this means that you do not enter to be priest; however, the superior is always the voice of Christ. It is he who decides whether you have a vocation to be a priest or not. He can select you for Holy Orders or he can also deny you Holy Orders. It will usually depend on the needs of the fraternity. As was the case with this friar, he was sent to a mission where the brothers needed a priest in order to fulfill their mission. If there were not enough priests or no priests around, the Franciscan solution is simple, you pick a friar and you ordain him.

In my situation it was the other way around. After I made solemn vows and was locked in for life, 😃 the superior sent me to get a four-year M.Div. I was very happy, because normally, you are ordained a deacon and then a priest at the end of your studies. When I finished, the superior told me that I was going to Rome for an STL in theology. I went. Near the end of the program, I received a letter that said, “Stay and get an STD.” I said a little more, but that was the central message. I stayed and did what I was told.

When I finished, I was sent to the missions in South America to teach theology to our guys in formation. After several months there, the superior arrived for a visit. He asked me if I was ready to return to the US to be ordained. I looked at him and asked, “Do I have to?” He laughed and said, “No. I knew you were meant to form priests and youth.” That’s what I’ve done for many years. I’ve trained many men who became priests, but I never did.

The joy comes not from liking what you do. The joy comes from doing what you’re told to do. This is why I said that Franciscans are not really appreciated by Traditioinalists, because a Franciscan finds joy in total and unquestioning obedience. In this case, if Friar was told to become a priest, even though he felt that he did not have a vocation, he obeyed without questioning. We don’t have opinions, desires, wishes or voices unless they are permitted by the superior. That is poverty, the poverty of Christ, which is the poverty that Francis taught his sons and daughters.

We’re not brain dead, good grief. We’re poor. That’s what people don’t understand. Our obedience is grounded in God’s call to poverty. For the Franciscan, povety is not a means, it is an end or a goal. We earn our wings, if you will, by detaching from everything, including your own opinions. True joy, as Friar or Father, whatever you call him, will tell you, true joy is not in liking what you do or what you don’t do. Sometimes, true joy is in being totally miserable, but kowing that you have loved God and man my lovingly obeying your superior. Everyday, you offer your cross. For this young man, his cross is doing priestly ministry. He has not ceased to be a brother. A Franciscan is always a brother. He is a brother who serves his brother as a priest. His joy comes in meeting the needs of his brother, even if he prefers to be doing some other ministry. In his soul, he’s probably very happy, though his mind and soul may not agree. That happens a great deal in Franciscan life. That’s what makes us AWESOME! :extrahappy:

Fraternally,

Br. Jr, OSF 🙂
 
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