Roman Chant vs Eastern Chant

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Hesychios said:
Traditionally (or should I say ‘originally’) musical instruuments were generally not used in the liturgy in the east or the west, I am not sure when they started to be introduced. As for an official ‘banning’ of instruments, I cannot say for certain.

Actually, it’s not even clear when singing started (very early, of course, but when?).

There was a point in western church history when polyphony was about to be condemned during a reform period. I can’t say for certain when that was (I am thinking 13th or 14th century …) , but as I recall the reason was largely the style or rendition of the music had taken a life of it’s own, the sound of it taking precedence, that the text had become largely incomprehensible. I am sure there are others here who know a lot more about this part of music history.
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If I recall, part of the problem was that composers were sneaking popular melodies like l’homme armé into their chant settings. The other part was that, as you mentioned, the music started taking precedence over the text. This gets pretty apparent when you listen to anything that was composed in the Notre Dame school, like this rendition of Viderunt Omnes by Pérotin. It takes the ensemble 2 minutes and 30 seconds to sing the word ‘viderunt’ alone (for what it’s worth, however, I think the music from the Notre Dame school is absolutely beautiful).
 
If I may make a general comment, Eastern Chant sounds (to my ears) more emotive whilst Gregorian Chant sounds more like sung prayer though Mozarabic chant sounds like a mixture of the two. For what its worth I love both of them, and I do mean LOVE them 😃
 
A question about vibrato. In Gregorian chant, it is generally frowned upon. How about in the East?
 
I_Thirst said:
A question about vibrato. In Gregorian chant, it is generally frowned upon. How about in the East?
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In Byzantine chant, and the forms of chant used by the Slavic-Byzantine Church, vibrato is very much frowned upon. I can’t speak for the Oriental traditions.
 
jmj1984 said:
If I may make a general comment, Eastern Chant sounds (to my ears) more emotive whilst Gregorian Chant sounds more like sung prayer though Mozarabic chant sounds like a mixture of the two. For what its worth I love both of them, and I do mean LOVE them 😃
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The intention behind the formation of the initial 8 tones of Byzantine chant (still used by the Greeks, Melkites/Antiochians, Romanians, etc.) was to remove all emotion from the music in order that people’s attention might be more fixed on the words sung. For a time there was heated debate over whether or not music should be used at all.

To my ear, the current usage of Gregorian chant sounds more emotive than the current usage of Byzantine chant. I wonder how I’d feel about the original modes/tones of Gregorian chant? I too love them both (as well as Coptic and Ethiopian chant). 👍
 
Phillip_Rolfes said:
The intention behind the formation of the initial 8 tones of Byzantine chant (still used by the Greeks, Melkites/Antiochians, Romanians, etc.) was to remove all emotion from the music in order that people’s attention might be more fixed on the words sung. For a time there was heated debate over whether or not music should be used at all.

To my ear, the current usage of Gregorian chant sounds more emotive than the current usage of Byzantine chant. I wonder how I’d feel about the original modes/tones of Gregorian chant? I too love them both (as well as Coptic and Ethiopian chant). 👍
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Fair enough, maybe I’m just mistaken 😛

I do just listen to stuff on youtube mind you.
 
dochawk said:
Ok, but what is this “vibrato” thing?
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Vibrato is something that is probably better heard than described, but I’ll take a stab at it. It is a slight (or sometimes not so slight) wavering of the note in both pitch and volume. How’s that for a description! 😛 Imagine an opera singer holding a very long not. You’ll notice that the pitch of the not itself is not steady, but seems to waver slightly. That is vibrato.
 
Oh, is it that warbling that women who fancy themselves to have farm more talent than they do do while sing at church or the national anthem?

I’m not trying to be snarky’but I can’t finda more delicate way to express the vocal behavior.
 
dochawk said:
Oh, is it that warbling that women who fancy themselves to have farm more talent than they do do while sing at church or the national anthem?

I’m not trying to be snarky’but I can’t finda more delicate way to express the vocal behavior.
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I tend to think more of the warbling sound that some old women who play electric organs at country parishes tend to prefer for their organs, but the analogy is an apt one. In the hands of a master singer or musician vibrato can be a very beautiful thing. As said before, however, it has no place in chant, primarily because the purpose of chant is to draw one’s attention to the text being chanted, not to the talent of the person chanting.
 
opus101 said:
🙂 and electric guitars too. And drum sets. And synthesizers. 😦
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Is there all these instruments because of Novus Ordo? The last time I went to a Roman Rite Church the chanting was from the good old organ which I personally thought was beautiful 🙂
 
To me the Romanian Chant seems more like a melodic talking. This is easier then singing on the voice and more easily understood. The words are clear and easily understood.
In the Roman Church near us the priest tends to try to sing instead of chant and unfortunately he can’t hold a tune. With the new translation and more chant in the Mass now the priests should be taught how to chant as I believe they were not given classes in this subject.
 
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