Romans 10:9-10

[Pete_Holter]

Your welcome. I should have cited my source (IGNATIUS Catholic Study Bible).

Another helpful point we can make here is that we should seek to answer the question, When do Christians first call on the Name of the LORD so as to be saved? And the Bible answers, “And now why do you wait? Rise and be baptized and wash away your sins, calling on His Name’” (Acts 22:16).

 

[Pete_Holter]

Here is the order of Salvation.

Ordo Salutis: 1) election, 2) predestination, 3) gospel call 4) inward call 5) regeneration, 6) conversion (faith & repentance), 7) justification, 8) sanctification, and 9) glorification. (Rom 8:29-30)

Greetings DD2007!

The order of salvation as understood by the Reformed tradition is one of those facets of theology that helped to bring me into the Catholic Church.

My problem came with the notion that regeneration precedes justification. In the Catholic understanding, we receive both gifts in baptism at the same time. But if, as in the Reformed understanding, regeneration comes first, no matter how close in time, then God no longer justifies the ungodly; rather, He justifies the born-again Son of God. The Catholic understanding preserves the Biblical truth that we believe “in Him Who justifies the ungodly” (Rom 4:5).

May the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you!
Pete

 

[JasonHC]

Peter,

This is a fascinating point, but I do not fully understand this:

My problem came with the notion that regeneration precedes justification. In the Catholic understanding, we receive both gifts in baptism at the same time. But if, as in the Reformed understanding, regeneration comes first, no matter how close in time, then God no longer justifies the ungodly; rather, He justifies the born-again Son of God. The Catholic understanding preserves the Biblical truth that we believe “in Him Who justifies the ungodly” (Rom 4:5).

May the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you!
Pete

What do you mean by ‘no matter how close in time’? Also, what did you mean by “God no longer justifies the ungodly”? Wouldn’t reformed protestants says that they are in fact justified by the mere act of faith in God?

Lastly, you wrote “He justifies the born-again Son of God”. Does this mean Jesus was justified? If so, I have no idea what this means. LOL

During my protestant days, I was influenced by reformed theology, but I must admit that I did not fully understand it. Can you elaborate on what you stated here?

 

[Pete_Holter]

Peter,

This is a fascinating point, but I do not fully understand this:

What do you mean by ‘no matter how close in time’? Also, what did you mean by “God no longer justifies the ungodly”? Wouldn’t reformed protestants says that they are in fact justified by the mere act of faith in God?

Lastly, you wrote “He justifies the born-again Son of God”. Does this mean Jesus was justified? If so, I have no idea what this means. LOL

During my protestant days, I was influenced by reformed theology, but I must admit that I did not fully understand it. Can you elaborate on what you stated here?

Oh, whoops! That should have been a lowercase s, “born-again son of God.”

By “no matter how close in time,” I mean to head off the argument made by some Reformed Christians that the two acts of God, regeneration and justification, happen so closely in time that they may be considered as a single event. In the Reformed understanding, we cannot exercise faith until we are regenerated and we cannot be justified until we exercise faith. So there is a necessary temporal separation between these two acts of God in Reformed theology, with regeneration preceding justification. Catholics, on the other hand, can genuinely argue that they should be viewed as and indeed are a single event, because we are regenerated, justified, and have faith, hope, and love all poured into our hearts when we are baptized, everything happening at the same time.

Yes, Reformed Protestants would say that we are justified by faith alone because Christian faith apprehends for us the imputed righteousness of Christ, and it is His righteousness that justifies us. But in order for us to exercise faith we have to first be born again by the secret work of God and given a new heart in order to serve Him. And so we are no longer dead in our sins and trespasses, but we are a new creation, having been cleansed from all our uncleannesses (cf. Ez 36: 25). But if we are already born again before being justified, then, again, we are no longer “ungodly.” And if you search the Scriptures for “ungodly,” you will see that the born again sons and daughters of God are not grouped under this ignominious appellation.

May God bless you, and thank you for bringing my typo to my attention!

 

[cpayne]

Anyone have any thoughts on how to address this based on St. Paul’s letter to the Romans alone?

-Jason

I didn’t notice at first that you had asked for responses from Romans alone.

So anyway, how about Romans 2:5-10?

5But because of thy hardness and impenitence of heart, thou treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the Day of Wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God,

6who will render to every man according to his deeds:

7to those who by patient continuance in welldoing seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life;

8but unto those who are contentious, and do not obey the truth but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,

9tribulation and anguish upon every soul of man who doeth evil, upon the Jew first and also upon the Gentile;

10but glory, honor and peace to every man who worketh good, to the Jew first and also to the Gentile.

(This is from the New King James Version.)

Says here God renders to all according to their DEEDS (vs. 6); if they continue in WELLDOING they have eternal life (vs. 7); glory, honor, and peace to everyone who WORKETH GOOD (vs. 10).

The CC does not teach that people are saved by their works, which is Pelagianism. However, it does teach (following the Bible) that people cannot be saved apart from their obedience to the Gospel—all the teachings of the Lord. Again, as Jesus Himself said, many will confess Him as Lord but not be saved.