Sacrament of Matrimony, why make it difficult?

[marianamex]

Hello, thought maybe I could get some answears here. I´m getting married and since it´s my religion, belief, my culture, etc, I´m getting married by the church. My problem is that my boyfriend is from the US (I´m from Mexico) and he´s an evangelist… he doesn´t follow his religion and his belief system is like mine, since we´ve met he now attends to mass with me and follows my religion. He is wanting to become a catholic so we take that step of our lifes on the same direction, but they are just making it so hard for him to convert into catholic that it´s unbelievable!
I don´t know what to do with all the bumps they put in the way that it just seems easier to file for an inter faith marriage… and even then, it´s a whole process because we are not from the same country.
Why is it so hard to welcome people into our religion and to help out in the process of getting married, when all we are trying to do is to do things the right way?

 

[mullenpm]

In what way are they making it difficult for your fiance to become a Catholic?

What “bumps” are they putting in his way? And, who is “they”?
shrug:

Have you spoken with a Priest about resolving any of the problems?

 

[Sillara]

I have never heard of the Church making it “difficult” to marry. Parishes do require Pre-Cana classes, but that is hardly difficult. Has your fiance been married before? That could indeed make things . . . difficult. The Church is quite clear that marriage is for life.

 

[marianamex]

They make it difficult with all that they ask for… by they I mean churches, parish, etc… they even want letters confirming his good will, good faith and believes. He´s been going to church with me for almost two years, he´s been baptised, given 1st communion and confirmed but as an evangelist. He doesn´t practice his religion though, and his believe system is the same as mine. Even my mom, who´s a catechism teacher (not sure if that´s the word) has given him classes. All the priests and nuns in my family have met with him to just talk to him and make sure he is doing it for the right reasons.
I grew up in between jesuits, went to the Sacred Heart School, so I´m not used to having so many walls. From what I´ve seen my whole life, we (as catholics) should be more welcoming.
Talking to a priest he mentioned that because so many people are falling out of our religion, that´s why the ask for a year of preparation, classes, etc. I´ve talked to many priests in Mexico and because he´s not from here, he needs permision from the Bishop as well.
The bumps I talk about are regarding everything. We are getting married in Mexico, we have to get permission from the Archidiocesis. My parish can´t do anything, it all has to be done through them. Since he´s not that fluent in spanish, our couples weekend is going to be in the US, more extra paper work to give to the church…
Priests I´ve talked to all keep telling me to just do it as an inter faith marriage and as far as him becoming catholic, to let it just happen whenever a door opens up for us. I haven´t lost hope on it, but I´ve been told I can´t even ask for a papal blessing if we are not both catholics.
Like I said, making things hard for people and not welcoming are not at all the catholic religion I grew up to. I´m grateful that he´s reasons and believe is strong enough that he still wants to do it, also that his love for me is so big that he understands the importance of it for me.

 

[marianamex]

and no, either one of us has ever been married before. Then I´d understand! We both believe marriage is for life.
I guess I also needed to let out my frustation, so thank you for reading.

 

[Trishie]

Marian, I’m delighted for you that you are marrying such a good man… I guess the international issue complicates things as well.

You will both get through this, and in the end all will be well.

Look at it this way…it takes longer to launch an ocean liner than a canoe…what a wonderful ship your marriage will be, and what a wonderful journey for you both together when all the preparations for the journey are over.

God bless you and your fiance. My best wishes to you both for a wonderful future!
I’ll keep you both in my prayers and Masses.

Trishie

 

[1ke]

He is wanting to become a catholic so we take that step of our lifes on the same direction, but they are just making it so hard for him to convert into catholic that it´s unbelievable!

Who is “they” and what, specifically, is it that you think is “difficult” in the process of becoming Catholic? Your complaint is rather vague. Can you outline what’s going on?

I don´t know what to do with all the bumps they put in the way

Again, who is “they” and what are these “bumps”?

that it just seems easier to file for an inter faith marriage… and even then, it´s a whole process because we are not from the same country.

The canonical process is the same everywhere-- permission from the bishop to marry a non-Catholic must be obtained.

Why is it so hard to welcome people into our religion and to help out in the process of getting married, when all we are trying to do is to do things the right way?

Why do you think it’s hard? You haven’t given anything specific to substantiate your claim.

 

[1ke]

Does he live in the US? If so, he should contact a local parish where HE lives about becoming a Catholic. It can take a year or so, it depends on the diocese.

I don’t understand what you mean when you refer to him as an Evangelist. You refer to him as having received Baptism, Holy Communion, and Confirmation. Communion and Confirmation are only valid Sacraments in the Catholic and Orthodox churches. What denomination was he raised in?

Basically, both being a Catholic and being married are worth the wait to do correctly. These are lifetime commitments-- not something to be rushed into.

 

[puzzleannie]

Why is it so hard to welcome people into our religion and to help out in the process of getting married, when all we are trying to do is to do things the right way?

because it is not easy to be Catholic, to really follow the faith. It is essential that anyone who wishes to become Catholic understand what they are promising, as well as what they are receiving. For one thing, he will become bound by canon law, which includes the procedures you are encountering, to insure a valid marriage. It would be irresponsible to allow couples to enter into a life-long covenant marriage without insuring first they are free to do so, but also that they have full knowledge, free will, and consent.

For another, he will have to live by Catholic teaching, including that on marriage and family, but on the full range of doctrine and moral issues. That includes openness to children within marriage. To allow him to enter the Church without a full understanding of her teaching is also irresponsible and unfair.

For a third thing, marriage is the most important commitment of your life, don’t you think it deserves the same amount of time and preparation as choosing a career, or even planning the wedding?

Many of your difficulties have nothing to do with the Church, but are government – immigration etc – or family issues. But you still have to take care and time to resolve them. God bless you, every minute you give now to proper preparation will pay off in years of happy married life.

 

[kage_ar]

What denomination is he an “evangelist” in?

 

[jblake]

marianamex;:

but they are just making it so hard for him to convert into catholic that it´s unbelievable!

Since you aren’t giving specifics, I can’t tell what is being done that makes it difficult. None the less, I’ll make a stab in the dark.

• It takes so long to convert:
  At a minimum, he will have to spend several months learning Catholic soteriology, theology, doctrines, and practices.
  A year is not out of the question. It takes time — sometimes years — for people to wipe the illusions out of their eyes, and really face what they have joined, and both fully accept, and practice that which is expected of them.
• There is so much paper work to do:
  Well yes. Everything has to be done according to both Canon law, and secular law. Without supporting documentation, there is no way to ascertain that all of the legal issues (both secular and canonical) have been dealt with. (FWIW, you could probably reduce the amount of paperwork by half, if you got married in the United States. )

Consider this to be a test of whether or not he is willing to be obedient in all aspects of his life, to the dictates of the church.

jonathon

 

[jblake]

1ke;:

You refer to him as having received Baptism, Holy Communion, and Confirmation. Communion and Confirmation are only valid Sacraments in the Catholic and Orthodox churches.

Protestant denominations that practice paedobaptism also have Confirmation and “First Communion”. Their understanding of those as Sacraments is slightly different from that of both Orthodox and Catholic Christianity.

jonathon

 

[mullenpm]

marianamex, lots of posters trying to help you but you are not forthcoming with answers.

How about some specifics?

Exactly what denomination is your fiance?

 

[mlchance]

Here’s my two cents worth: If you and your fiance can’t handle these difficulties, you’re not prepared to handle the real difficulties of marriage.

Pray, pray, and pray some more.

– Mark L. Chance.

 

[benedictgal]

Hello, thought maybe I could get some answears here. I´m getting married and since it´s my religion, belief, my culture, etc, I´m getting married by the church. My problem is that my boyfriend is from the US (I´m from Mexico) and he´s an evangelist… he doesn´t follow his religion and his belief system is like mine, since we´ve met he now attends to mass with me and follows my religion. He is wanting to become a catholic so we take that step of our lifes on the same direction, but they are just making it so hard for him to convert into catholic that it´s unbelievable!
I don´t know what to do with all the bumps they put in the way that it just seems easier to file for an inter faith marriage… and even then, it´s a whole process because we are not from the same country.
Why is it so hard to welcome people into our religion and to help out in the process of getting married, when all we are trying to do is to do things the right way?

Are you going to marry here or in Mexico? When is your wedding date? It’s not that the process is going to differ, but, perhaps the priest may have phrased it differently and it may have appeared, to your fiance, like a road block.

The priest asks these questions so that he can, first of all, ascertain the validity of the baptism your future spouse received. If he was not baptized according to the formula recognized by the Church (Trinitarian formula with water), then, heh may either have to be baptized (if he wants to become a Catholic–of course, that would also entail his having to go through RCIA) or you may have to secure a dispensation from the bishop in the diocese where your wedding will take place (whether it is here or in Mexico).

I live in a border town (on the Texas side). Folks will cross over to marry here and vice versa. When you have two different national bishops conferences involved, let alone two different dioceses, there will be some issues that need to be ironed out.

Also, are you going to have the extras during your Nuptial Mass? For those unfamiliar, these are rituals (inculturational adaptaitons) that include the double-rosary and the arras (coins). If you are, you might want to go over that with him so that he can understand their cultural significance.

Also, if your intended is indeed interested in becoming Catholic, why has he not begun teh RCIA process? Had he entered the process early on, he probably would have been received into the Church this Easter. Although, if he can talk to the priest, where you currently attend Mass, maybe arrangements can be made. I don’t know.

What I do know, however, is that right now is not the time to throw in the towel and raise your hands.

 

[marianamex]

marianamex, lots of posters trying to help you but you are not forthcoming with answers.

How about some specifics?

Exactly what denomination is your fiance?

I apologize for the late response. People coming back home from a long weekend tought me patience in a 3 hour drive home.
What denomination my fiance is, I´m not sure, to be honest. I´m not to familiar…

 

[marianamex]

Marian, I’m delighted for you that you are marrying such a good man… I guess the international issue complicates things as well.

You will both get through this, and in the end all will be well.

Look at it this way…it takes longer to launch an ocean liner than a canoe…what a wonderful ship your marriage will be, and what a wonderful journey for you both together when all the preparations for the journey are over.

God bless you and your fiance. My best wishes to you both for a wonderful future!
I’ll keep you both in my prayers and Masses.

Trishie

Thank you for such a positive and caring response, as well as for your good wishes.
It is harder with the whole international thing going on, both religious and civil weddings.
Thanks again!
PS. He really is an amazing man!

 

[marianamex]

Does he live in the US? If so, he should contact a local parish where HE lives about becoming a Catholic. It can take a year or so, it depends on the diocese.

I don’t understand what you mean when you refer to him as an Evangelist. You refer to him as having received Baptism, Holy Communion, and Confirmation. Communion and Confirmation are only valid Sacraments in the Catholic and Orthodox churches. What denomination was he raised in?

Basically, both being a Catholic and being married are worth the wait to do correctly. These are lifetime commitments-- not something to be rushed into.

Thank you for your response, I’ve tried explaining a few txt back what I meant with “they” and the “bumps”… I’m not to great with words, sorry about that.
Please trust me when I say that I know that both are worth the wait, we are both aware of it being a lifetime commitments. My parents even talked to him about how we don’t believe in divorce (being from different countries, in Mexico, divorce isn´t something you see every day). And because I´m not some one who likes to rush into things, he´s been understanding. So much that we´ve had to make our relationship a long distance one, I wasn´t going to rush things, specially something so important to me.

 

[marianamex]

because it is not easy to be Catholic, to really follow the faith. It is essential that anyone who wishes to become Catholic understand what they are promising, as well as what they are receiving. For one thing, he will become bound by canon law, which includes the procedures you are encountering, to insure a valid marriage. It would be irresponsible to allow couples to enter into a life-long covenant marriage without insuring first they are free to do so, but also that they have full knowledge, free will, and consent.

For another, he will have to live by Catholic teaching, including that on marriage and family, but on the full range of doctrine and moral issues. That includes openness to children within marriage. To allow him to enter the Church without a full understanding of her teaching is also irresponsible and unfair.

For a third thing, marriage is the most important commitment of your life, don’t you think it deserves the same amount of time and preparation as choosing a career, or even planning the wedding?

Many of your difficulties have nothing to do with the Church, but are government – immigration etc – or family issues. But you still have to take care and time to resolve them. God bless you, every minute you give now to proper preparation will pay off in years of happy married life.

I completely understand what you´re saying. I am well aware that sometimes it isn´t easy to be catholic, specially to some one who wasn´t brought up with that, therefor their will to be one, understanding of it and most of all acceptance.
After a long talk with a jesuit priest (who also happens to be my uncle), I´m calmer about the whole thing.
And trust me when I tell you that we have given it planning, time and preparation. We have been working on it since before he proposed because he knows how important it is to me (him going with me to mass, understanding and learning about my religion) and after he proposed, he was the one who said he wanted to become a catholic.
For now it isn´t about rushing it, but working on it in 2 different coutries, getting so many different answears and not being able to see it together has just made it harder. And trust me, I´m well aware that so many of the difficulties are not from the church… remember that my country is run waaaay different than yours, I´ve lived with that all my life, you just never get used to it.

 

[marianamex]

Here’s my two cents worth: If you and your fiance can’t handle these difficulties, you’re not prepared to handle the real difficulties of marriage.

Pray, pray, and pray some more.

– Mark L. Chance.

Thank you for your two cents worth, but we are both prepared to handle this difficulties and more. Both our faiths, our spiritual believes, and our love for each other is strong enough.

And we do pray every day, not only for a great wedding, preparation for it, but specially we pray for the great future ahead of us, for joy and happiness, for strenght and comfort through rough times… but what we both do mostly, is be gratefull for all the gifts in our life, for our family and friends and for each other.