Sacraments for infant

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knowseauto

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Good day! I am very excited to have joined this forum. Long have I lurked but never felt qualified to respond to posts nor had any pressing questions that were not previously answered. Well, I have a pressing question now!

Recently, my husband and I found out that I am pregnant with our first child. Obviously, we are beyond thrilled. Even though I am not due until December 2014, we have already started discussing the baptism/chrismation/eucharist of our child. My husband and I are both Ruthenian Byzantine but currently attend a Latin Rite church. This is not by choice but necessity as we moved about 18 months ago from an area with a Byzantine church to an area that does not have one. We will only be here for about another year and will hopefully be back near a Byzantine church when we move. In the meantime, we want our child to receive the full sacraments in a Byzantine church. What should we do? Right now the options we have come up with are as follows.
  1. Travel to our old parish for the sacraments. The down side to this is that there has been a change in the priest and the new priest does not know us nor our history in the parish. We are afraid that he might not be willing to perform the sacraments as we are no longer parishoners there.
  2. Travel to my childhood parish where we know the priest (he concelebrated at our wedding) and he would likely be willing to help us as he knows us. However, it means traveling across the country with an infant during the winter.
  3. Try to convince the Byzantine parish closest to us, about 150 miles away, to perform the sacraments for us. We attended the church only a few times when we first moved but were unable to continue due to logistical issues with it being so far away. No one at the parish knows us and we have no real history with them.
What should we do?
 
I would suggest waiting until a Ruthenian parish is available to you to baptize and Chrismate and commune your child.

Unless of course he or she is in danger of death.
 
andrewstx said:
I would suggest waiting until a Ruthenian parish is available to you to baptize and Chrismate and commune your child.

Unless of course he or she is in danger of death.
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The only problem/concern is that this could very well mean that our child wouldn’t receive the sacraments for several YEARS. There is no guarantee that our next move will allow us to be near a Ruthenian parish.
 
I think you should decide based on the winter weather for where you live. Where I’m from the weather is, for the most part, mild year round. However, I know that there are a lot of places in the world where it is next to impossible to travel during the winter months, and would be dangerous with an infant.

If you live in one of these areas, I’d wait until summer or when it is safer to travel, then go to your childhood parish.
 
How about choice 1 or 3, but email or call the priest ahead of time and discuss it with him. They may or may not be options; you don’t know yet. Do more research, and check back with us.
 
Baptize your baby. The baby’s soul is more important than your emotions about the physical location. We profess one baptism. We are Catholic. Anyway, my prayers are with you.
 
Why don’t you ask your current priest in the Latin Rite Church what you should do? I’m sure he has access to the proper information. The priest in your former or Byzantine parish may not know you but he can ask your current priest if you are active parishioners in his church. Your priest will have to get involved because your child will have the right to receive communion in the Latin Rite Church when he is literally an infant. Other children his age can’t receive but your child can. Of course he won’t have to go to confession till he is older. Have a happy pregnancy and delivery.
 
trevorhall said:
Baptize your baby. The baby’s soul is more important than your emotions about the physical location. We profess one baptism. We are Catholic. Anyway, my prayers are with you.
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But if the child is baptized in a Latin church she/he will not get chrismated or communed. But I suppose the missing mysteries could be given at a later date.
 
knowseauto said:
Good day! I am very excited to have joined this forum. Long have I lurked but never felt qualified to respond to posts nor had any pressing questions that were not previously answered. Well, I have a pressing question now!

Recently, my husband and I found out that I am pregnant with our first child. Obviously, we are beyond thrilled. Even though I am not due until December 2014, we have already started discussing the baptism/chrismation/eucharist of our child. My husband and I are both Ruthenian Byzantine but currently attend a Latin Rite church. This is not by choice but necessity as we moved about 18 months ago from an area with a Byzantine church to an area that does not have one. We will only be here for about another year and will hopefully be back near a Byzantine church when we move. In the meantime, we want our child to receive the full sacraments in a Byzantine church. What should we do? Right now the options we have come up with are as follows.
  1. Travel to our old parish for the sacraments. The down side to this is that there has been a change in the priest and the new priest does not know us nor our history in the parish. We are afraid that he might not be willing to perform the sacraments as we are no longer parishoners there.
  2. Travel to my childhood parish where we know the priest (he concelebrated at our wedding) and he would likely be willing to help us as he knows us. However, it means traveling across the country with an infant during the winter.
  3. Try to convince the Byzantine parish closest to us, about 150 miles away, to perform the sacraments for us. We attended the church only a few times when we first moved but were unable to continue due to logistical issues with it being so far away. No one at the parish knows us and we have no real history with them.
What should we do?
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Show the Latin priest the eastern canon law so your sacramental discipline can be followed, a Latin priest can be granted faculties from the Byzantine bishop:

**CCEO

*****Proper Pastor

Canon 916*
  1. Through both domicile and quasi-domicile each person acquires his or her local hierarch and pastor of the Church sui iuris in which he or she is enrolled, unless other provision is made by common law.
    …
  2. If there is no pastor for the Christian faithful of a certain Church sui iuris, the eparchial bishop of these people can appoint the pastor of another Church sui iuris to look after them as their proper pastor, but with the consent of the eparchial bishop of the pastor who is to be appointed.
    **Chrismation
Canon 695**
  1. Chrismation with holy myron must be administered in conjunction with baptism, except in a case of true necessity, in which case, however, it is to be seen that it is administered as soon as possible.
  2. If the celebration of chrismation with holy myron is not done together with baptism, the minister is obliged to notify the pastor of the place where the baptism was administered.
Canon 696
  1. All presbyters of the Eastern Churches can validly administer this sacrament either along with baptism or separately to all the Christian faithful of any Church sui iuris including the Latin Church.
  2. The Christian faithful of Eastern Churches validly receive this sacrament also from presbyters of the Latin Church, according to the faculties with which these are endowed.
  3. Any presbyter licitly administers this sacrament only to the Christian faithful of his own Church sui iuris; when it is a case of Christian faithful of other Churches sui iuris, he lawfully acts if they are his subjects, or those whom he lawfully baptizes in virtue of another title, or those who are in danger of death, and always with due regard for the agreements entered between the Churches sui iuris in this matter.
Eucharist

Canon 697
Sacramental initiation in the mystery of salvation is perfected in the reception of the Divine Eucharist, and thus the Divine Eucharist is administered after baptism and chrismation with holy myron as soon as possible according to the norms of the particular law of the each Church sui iuris.

Canon 710
With respect to the participation of infants in the Divine Eucharist after baptism and chrismation with holy myron, the prescriptions of the liturgical books of each Church sui iuris are to be observed with the suitable due precautions.
 
I would contact the Byzantine parish closest to you. Since you are both Ruthenian, you are technically parishioners there, even if you are not able to attend on a regular basis. The pastor has the responsibility to care for your souls and the soul of your child, as his parishioners. If you contact the pastor and explain the situation, I can’t imagine that you would be denied.

What part of the country are you in?
 
knowseauto said:
Good day! I am very excited to have joined this forum. Long have I lurked but never felt qualified to respond to posts nor had any pressing questions that were not previously answered. Well, I have a pressing question now!

Recently, my husband and I found out that I am pregnant with our first child. Obviously, we are beyond thrilled. Even though I am not due until December 2014, we have already started discussing the baptism/chrismation/eucharist of our child. My husband and I are both Ruthenian Byzantine but currently attend a Latin Rite church…
What should we do?
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Welcome to the EC Section, and congratulations!

Both Vico and babochka have pointed out that your baby should be fully initiated with baptism, chrismation, and communion, as set forth in the CCEO canons Vico has provided. That need not take place in an Eastern Catholic parish as was also pointed out.

In addition to what they have said, I’d add that you can check with the Chancery of the Diocese where you are attending Mass to see if there are already bi-ritual priests in the area with those bi-ritual faculties. In any case the Chancery ought to be able to assist you if you do wish to have the Rites done in the Latin Church, to be sure it is all done correctly for your child as a Ruthenian Catholic, and your child recorded correctly as Ruthenian Catholic in the baptismal record of the parish where it happens.

Somewhat off topic, but maybe of use in the future is the excellent pamphlet "When Eastern Catholics Commune at a Roman Catholic Mass put together by St. Sophia Ukrainian Greek-Catholic Church in The Colony, TX
 
knowseauto said:
The only problem/concern is that this could very well mean that our child wouldn’t receive the sacraments for several YEARS. There is no guarantee that our next move will allow us to be near a Ruthenian parish.
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Have you discussed this with the Latin priest? Even if he performs the Sacraments of Initiation, your child is still a Ruthenian Catholic.

While many Latin priests are somewhat unfamiliar with the rights and obligations of Eastern Catholics, those questions can easily be cleared up, especially if you arrange communication between the Latin priest and your Ruthenian pastor.

That communication would have to be done anyway, to insure that the Sacraments are properly recorded at a Ruthenian parish.

I understand that you would prefer that the Sacraments be offered at a Ruthenian parish, but the Sacraments would be the same, it is One Body of Christ, after all. They would simply be performed by a Latin priest, who likewise share in the same Order of Priesthood that all priests do.
 
To the OP: It’s good that you’ve started thinking about this in advance, since it gives you a good amount of time to sort things out. It’s not clear whether you’re in the same Eparchy as you were prior to moving, but if so, you might contact your former pastor (the one who knows you) and see what he suggests. He may even offer to do it himself. 🙂 Now, if it’s a different Eparchy, one suggestion that doesn’t seem to have come up yet (unless I just plain missed it) is to contact the local Eparchial Chancery and see what help they might be able to offer.
Brendan said:
I understand that you would prefer that the Sacraments be offered at a Ruthenian parish, but the Sacraments would be the same, it is One Body of Christ, after all. They would simply be performed by a Latin priest, who likewise share in the same Order of Priesthood that all priests do.
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Yes, of course that’s all true, but if it were me, I’d want nothing other than to have this done according to the rites of my own Church. If I had to, I’d pay to fly a priest in for the event. 😉
 
knowseauto said:
Good day! I am very excited to have joined this forum. Long have I lurked but never felt qualified to respond to posts nor had any pressing questions that were not previously answered. Well, I have a pressing question now!

Recently, my husband and I found out that I am pregnant with our first child. Obviously, we are beyond thrilled. Even though I am not due until December 2014, we have already started discussing the baptism/chrismation/eucharist of our child. My husband and I are both Ruthenian Byzantine but currently attend a Latin Rite church. This is not by choice but necessity as we moved about 18 months ago from an area with a Byzantine church to an area that does not have one. We will only be here for about another year and will hopefully be back near a Byzantine church when we move. In the meantime, we want our child to receive the full sacraments in a Byzantine church. What should we do? Right now the options we have come up with are as follows.
  1. Travel to our old parish for the sacraments. The down side to this is that there has been a change in the priest and the new priest does not know us nor our history in the parish. We are afraid that he might not be willing to perform the sacraments as we are no longer parishoners there.
  2. Travel to my childhood parish where we know the priest (he concelebrated at our wedding) and he would likely be willing to help us as he knows us. However, it means traveling across the country with an infant during the winter.
  3. Try to convince the Byzantine parish closest to us, about 150 miles away, to perform the sacraments for us. We attended the church only a few times when we first moved but were unable to continue due to logistical issues with it being so far away. No one at the parish knows us and we have no real history with them.
What should we do?
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When permissions are required they are from the proper pastor. Is many states there is only one parish, which often makes it distant for many, shown below in the USA for the Byzantine Catholic Church. Do you know what your proper parish is?

Holy Protection of Mary​

Colorado
New Mexico
Oregon

Parma​

Illinois
Minnesota
Missouri

Pittsburgh​

Oklahoma
Tennessee
Louisiana

Passaic​

North Caronlia
South Caronina
Georgia
 
Are you and your husband canonically Ruthenian? A problem has arisen at my Ruthenian parish because the former pastor baptized a number of children of Latin Rite non-parishioners.

A number of “traditional Catholics” would contact the former pastor and then show up from out of town for a Sunday baptism and then they would never be seen again, all because they wanted their infants to receive baptism/chrismation/communion in one ceremony.
 
Vico said:
When permissions are required they are from the proper pastor. Is many states there is only one parish, which often makes it distant for many, shown below in the USA for the Byzantine Catholic Church. Do you know what your proper parish is?

Holy Protection of Mary​

Arizona (location of cathedral)
California
Colorado
New Mexico
Oregon

Parma​

Ohio (location of cathedral)
Illinois
Minnesota
Missouri

Pittsburgh​

Pennsylvania
Oklahoma
Tennessee
Louisiana

Passaic​

New Jersey
New York
North Caronlia
South Caronina
Georgia
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This is not exhaustive but I noticed you left some states out.
 
Yes, we are canonically Ruthenian. I was baptized/chrismated in a Ruthenian church with my communion at the same church when I was older. To this day I am not sure why they split the sacraments like that, but they did. My husband was baptized in a non-denominational Christian service and several years later joined the Catholic church when he had his chrismation/communion at the Ruthenian church to which we belonged.

We are in California and so intra-state travel during the winter is not a major concern of ours. However, the church at which I had my sacraments is on the east coast and so the inter-state travel does have us a bit concerned.

Being in California, we do know we are part of the Holy Protection of Mary. We are in the same eparchy as before we moved, but our former pastor is not. He has since been called to serve in another capacity in another eparchy.

Oddly enough, I never even thought about contacting the Eparchial Chancery! This looks like it needs to be one of my first steps. 🙂 Can I blame pregnancy brain on not thinking of this?

We will also be speaking with the priest at the Latin church we attend. Unfortunately, we were out of town this weekend and unable to have this conversation with him.

I think this covers some of the big questions asked in this thread by those of you kind enough to respond. My husband and I are very grateful that you are all offering such helpful advice. Thank you.
 
knowseauto said:
My husband was baptized in a non-denominational Christian service and several years later joined the Catholic church when he had his chrismation/communion at the Ruthenian church to which we belonged.
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Your husband is canonically Latin if he was a validly baptized Christian when he was chrismated in a Ruthenian parish. See this article Church Ascription Upon Conversion “Baptized Non-Catholics Coming Into Full Communion with the Catholic Church” written by Fr. George Gallaro, professor of canon law and ecumenism at the Byzantine Catholic Seminary of Ss. Cyril and Methodius. It’s not unusual for someone to think they are canonically Eastern Catholic by virtue of having come into the Church by chrismation in an EC Church. The Chancery can help you straighten this out, too.

We have two wonderful Ruthenian parishes near me- one in Sacramento, the other in Los Gatos/Palo/Alto.
 
5Loaves said:
Your husband is canonically Latin if he was a validly baptized Christian when he was chrismated in a Ruthenian parish. See this article Church Ascription Upon Conversion “Baptized Non-Catholics Coming Into Full Communion with the Catholic Church” written by Fr. George Gallaro, professor of canon law and ecumenism at the Byzantine Catholic Seminary of Ss. Cyril and Methodius. It’s not unusual for someone to think they are canonically Eastern Catholic by virtue of having come into the Church by chrismation in an EC Church. The Chancery can help you straighten this out, too.

We have two wonderful Ruthenian parishes near me- one in Sacramento, the other in Los Gatos/Palo/Alto.
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Fact is most Latin parishes would not bother checking to see if anyone is canonically Eastern, and would allow them to partake of various Sacraments whether or not allowed. I know one which is allowing someone to marry, without the “necessary” permission which only the Eastern bishop is allowed to give.
 
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