Sacrifice of the Mass

[Christ_Bearer]

In my first thread I asked about the veneration of Mary. Very helpful thoughts everyone contributed. I am still chewing on much of it. Thank you!

Here goes number 2 comment/question from a traditional protestant…

*The Mass being a fresh sacrifice of Christ is a blasphemy. The book of Hebrews among other scriptures clearly states that Christ’s sacrifice was “once for all”. I even knew of a former Catholic Priest who left the Catholic Church because he said that when he read the book of Hebrews “things just weren’t lining up”. How can Christ be sacrifice over and over again when he said on the cross “it is finished!” ?

 

[Anna_Scott]

In my first thread I asked about the veneration of Mary. Very helpful thoughts everyone contributed. I am still chewing on much of it. Thank you!

Here goes number 2 comment/question from a traditional protestant…

*The Mass being a fresh sacrifice of Christ is a blasphemy. The book of Hebrews among other scriptures clearly states that Christ’s sacrifice was “once for all”. I even knew of a former Catholic Priest who left the Catholic Church because he said that when he read the book of Hebrews “things just weren’t lining up”. How can Christ be sacrifice over and over again when he said on the cross “it is finished!” ?

According to the beliefs of Catholics, Anglicans, Eastern Orthodox, Lutherans and other Christians who believe in the Real Presence of Christ in the Holy Eucharist—Christ is not sacrificed over and over again. His sacrifice was, indeed, once for all.

Peace,
Anna

 

[Christianus_Dei]

He isn’t sacrificed over and over. It’s the same event as 2000 years ago, at another point in time, Jesus isn’t sacrificed again, the sacrifice is re-presented. Think of it as not saying the same prayer twice, but saying the prayer once, at two points in time. At least I think that’s how it works. Anyways, the sacrifice is re-presented.

 

[Trishie]

The Mass is not a fresh Sacrifice, nor does the Church teach that it is one.
From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p2s2c1a3.htm

From the Council Of Trent, and Vatican 2 documents

“The One that offers Sacrifice is the same One who, after having sacrificed himself on the Cross…to obtain for us eternal redemption…offers Himself now by the ministry of the priest; there is no difference except in the manner of offering.” [Council of Trent, S. 22, c.2]

“For in it Christ perpetuates in an unbloody manner the sacrifice offered on the Cross, offering Himself to the Father for the world’s salvation through the ministry of priests.” [Vatican 2 Documents.9:3]
“perpetrates”, not creates a new thing.

“The Eucharistic Sacrifice is the source and summit of the whole of the Church’s worship and of Christian life. The faithful participate more fully in the sacrament of thanksgiving, propitiation, petition and praise not only when they wholeheartedly offer the sacred Victim, and in it themselves to the Father with the priest, but also when they receive this same Victim sacramentally.” [Vatican 2 Documents :9]

“The other sacraments, as indeed every ministry of the church and every work of the apostolate, are linked with the Eucharist and are directed towards it. For the Eucharist contains the entire spiritual good of the Church, namely, Christ Himself, our Passover and living bread, offering through His flesh, living and life-giving in the Spirit, life to all who are thus invited and led on to offer themselves, their labours, and all created things together with Him.” [Vatican 2 Documents.9:6]

“The faithful are gathered by the preaching of Christ’s Gospel and the mystery of the Lord’s Supper is celebrated, ‘so that through the Body and Blood of the Lord the whole brotherhood is united…Christ is present, by whose power the one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church is united. For the partaking has no less an effect than to change us into what we have received.’” [Vatican 11.9:7. Constitution of the Church, n.26]
“But union with Christ…is not to be limited to the duration of the celebration of the Eucharist; it is to be prolonged into the entire Christian life…(as) a continual thanksgiving under the Holy Spirit and may produce fruits of greater charity.” [Vatican 11.9. iii. 38]

 

[Anna_Scott]

CATECHISM OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH
SECOND EDITION

PART TWO
THE CELEBRATION OF THE CHRISTIAN MYSTERY

SECTION TWO
THE SEVEN SACRAMENTS OF THE CHURCH

CHAPTER ONE
THE SACRAMENTS OF CHRISTIAN INITIATION

ARTICLE 3
**THE SACRAMENT OF THE EUCHARIST **

1330 The memorial of the Lord’s Passion and Resurrection.

. . .The Holy Sacrifice, because it makes present the one sacrifice of Christ the Savior and includes the Church’s offering. The terms holy sacrifice of the Mass, “sacrifice of praise,” spiritual sacrifice, pure and holy sacrifice are also used,150 since it completes and surpasses all the sacrifices of the Old Covenant. . . .

. . . .1353 In the epiclesis, the Church asks the Father to send his Holy Spirit (or the power of his blessing180) on the bread and wine, so that by his power they may become the body and blood of Jesus Christ and so that those who take part in the Eucharist may be one body and one spirit (some liturgical traditions put the epiclesis after the anamnesis).

In the institution narrative, the power of the words and the action of Christ, and the power of the Holy Spirit, make sacramentally present under the species of bread and wine Christ’s body and blood, his sacrifice offered on the cross once for all. . . . .

Link: scborromeo.org/ccc/p2s2c1a3.htm

Peace,
Anna

 

[Trishie]

ENCYCLICAL LETTER
ECCLESIA DE EUCHARISTIA
OF HIS HOLINESS
POPE JOHN PAUL II

"The Mass makes present the sacrifice of the Cross; it does not add to that sacrifice nor does it multiply it.16 What is repeated is its memorial celebration, its “commemorative representation” (memorialis demonstratio),17 which makes Christ’s one, definitive redemptive sacrifice always present in time. The sacrificial nature of the Eucharistic mystery cannot therefore be understood as something separate, independent of the Cross or only indirectly referring to the sacrifice of Calvary.

1. By virtue of its close relationship to the sacrifice of Golgotha, the Eucharist is a sacrifice in the strict sense, and not only in a general way, as if it were simply a matter of Christ’s offering himself to the faithful as their spiritual food. The gift of his love and obedience to the point of giving his life (cf. Jn 10:17-18) is in the first place a gift to his Father. Certainly it is a gift given for our sake, and indeed that of all humanity (cf. Mt 26:28; Mk 14:24; Lk 22:20; Jn 10:15), yet it is first and foremost a gift to the Father: “asacrifice that the Father accepted, giving, in return for this total self-giving by his Son, who ‘became obedient unto death’ (Phil 2:8), his own paternal gift, that is to say the grant of new immortal life in the resurrection”.18 "

In giving his sacrifice to the Church, Christ has also made his own the spiritual sacrifice of the Church, which is called to offer herself in union with the sacrifice of Christ. This is the teaching of the Second Vatican Council concerning all the faithful: “Taking part in the Eucharistic Sacrifice, which is the source and summit of the whole Christian life, they offer the divine victim to God, and offer themselves along with it”.19"

vatican.va/holy_father/special_features/encyclicals/documents/hf_jp-ii_enc_20030417_ecclesia_eucharistia_en.html

 

[campeador]

The Sacrifice of the Mass foretold in scripture:

10 “Oh that there were one among you who would shut the gates, that you might not uselessly kindle fire on My altar! I am not pleased with you,” says the LORD of hosts, “nor will I accept an offering from you.

11 For from the rising of the sun even to its setting, My name will be great among the nations, and in every place incense is going to be offered to My name, and a grain offering that is pure; for My name will be great among the nations,” says the LORD of hosts. (Malachi 1:10-11)

 

[JRKH]

In my first thread I asked about the veneration of Mary. Very helpful thoughts everyone contributed. I am still chewing on much of it. Thank you!

Here goes number 2 comment/question from a traditional protestant…

*The Mass being a fresh sacrifice of Christ is a blasphemy. The book of Hebrews among other scriptures clearly states that Christ’s sacrifice was “once for all”. I even knew of a former Catholic Priest who left the Catholic Church because he said that when he read the book of Hebrews “things just weren’t lining up”. How can Christ be sacrifice over and over again when he said on the cross “it is finished!” ?

The Phrase that I bolded is the crux of this error.

The Mass is not a “Fresh sacrifice” but is a “making present” of the one sacrifice. It is, in a sense, taking us to Calvary so that we are present at the one sacrifice.

Simple enough even for me to understand…

Peace
James

 

[mark_a]

I even knew of a former Catholic Priest who left the Catholic Church because he said that when he read the book of Hebrews “things just weren’t lining up”. ?

Just curious, did this priest subsequently marry?

 

[Christ_Bearer]

Thanks for the answers. I hope to see more. This is why I am posting these threads; to shatter my misconceptions and possibly confirm other conceptions. We’ll see how the other threads bear out. I am pleased to see the responses to this post. I am more encouraged than ever, and even more enticed by the Mass. Hopefully many of you “cradle Catholics” will at least get an idea of where protestants are coming from and why we think of Catholics the way we do. Hopefully you can gain patience toward us as well for our misunderstandings.

 

[Christ_Bearer]

Just curious, did this priest subsequently marry?

Yes. He did marry and I think had a few kids. My father in law went to Bible college with him at Liberty College in Pensacola, FL.

 

[Anna_Scott]

The Phrase that I bolded is the crux of this error.

The Mass is not a “Fresh sacrifice” but is a “making present” of the one sacrifice. It is, in a sense, taking us to Calvary so that we are present at the one sacrifice.

Simple enough even for me to understand…

Peace
James

James,
Very concise. I can’t seem to be concise about anything. lol.

Part of the problem with misconceptions about Catholicism is that they are perpetuated on websites that spew and spin anti-Catholic messages. So, by the time a non-Catholic actually asks Catholics directly, they are still suspicious and have trouble believing what Catholics say. I’m not saying that is the case with Christ Bearer. He/she seems very sincere.

Peace,
Anna

 

[Christ_Bearer]

James,
Very concise. I can’t seem to be concise about anything. lol.

Part of the problem with misconceptions about Catholicism is that they are perpetuated on websites that spew and spin anti-Catholic messages. So, by the time a non-Catholic actually asks Catholics directly, they are still suspicious and have trouble believing what Catholics say. I’m not saying that is the case with Christ Bearer. He/she seems very sincere.

Peace,
Anna

I am a he. Unless we want to be gender inclusive I could be a “one”. Is this gender inclusive language a problem in Catholic circles as much as it is in Protestant circles? Specifically in the area of modern bible translation? Off topic I know, just curious.

 

[mark_a]

Is this gender inclusive language a problem in Catholic circles as much as it is in Protestant circles? Specifically in the area of modern bible translation? Off topic I know, just curious.

I don’t know if its as much of a problem, but its a problem.

 

[Anna_Scott]

I am a he. Unless we want to be gender inclusive I could be a “one”. Is this gender inclusive language a problem in Catholic circles as much as it is in Protestant circles? Specifically in the area of modern bible translation? Off topic I know, just curious.

Christ Bearer,

Depends on who you ask. I don’t care for the gender neutral trend. I think a Bible translation needs to remain as true as possible to reliable manuscripts.

Anna

 

[Christ_Bearer]

Christ Bearer,

Depends on who you ask. I don’t care for the gender neutral trend. I think a Bible translation needs to remain as true as possible to reliable manuscripts.

Anna

I agree. Not a big fan of the gender inclusive bibles. What are some good Catholic bibles that don’t have this feature, yet are essentially literal? The old RSV I know is pretty good, but the NRSV is loaded with gender inclusiveness.

 

[Boogie43]

Christbearer, If you are truly seeking the ONE, HOLY, CATHOLIC, AND APOSTOLIC CHURCH, it will boil down to Church authority and the Eucharist. This is coming from a former Baptist that converted. Study what the Church teaches about The Real Presence and what The Early Church Fathers taught, then study The Gospel of John chapter 6. I promise you it is hard to argue with

 

[Anna_Scott]

I agree. Not a big fan of the gender inclusive bibles. What are some good Catholic bibles that don’t have this feature, yet are essentially literal? The old RSV I know is pretty good, but the NRSV is loaded with gender inclusiveness.

I know. Actually, the Catechism of the Catholic Church uses the RSV and NRSV.

Anna

 

[Anna_Scott]

I agree. Not a big fan of the gender inclusive bibles. What are some good Catholic bibles that don’t have this feature, yet are essentially literal? The old RSV I know is pretty good, but the NRSV is loaded with gender inclusiveness.

Christ Bearer,
The Catholic Bible Association adopted the Revised Standard Version, used primarily by non-Catholics–though ecumenical–and edited it for Catholic use. The RSV became the Revised Standard Version- Catholic Edition. It has been reissued under the title, The Ignatius Bible (there may be other titles at this point.)

Anna

 

[Anna_Scott]

Christbearer, If you are truly seeking the ONE, HOLY, CATHOLIC, AND APOSTOLIC CHURCH, it will boil down to Church authority and the Eucharist. This is coming from a former Baptist that converted. Study what the Church teaches about The Real Presence and what The Early Church Fathers taught, then study The Gospel of John chapter 6. I promise you it is hard to argue with

Boogie43,

Welcome to CAF.

Keep in mind Christ Bearer is here to ask about the Catholic faith to clear up misconceptions–such as worshiping The Blessed Virgin Mary, when Catholics actually venerate her (addressed on another thread.)

In this thread, he is asking if Christ is sacrificed over and over again in the Holy Eucharist, which is another misconception.

Right now, he just needs some answers. I know you are passionate about your faith; but maybe ease up on the sledge hammer a bit. uch:

Peace,
Anna