Saints: How Would They Live In Today's World?

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this is sort of related to this thread…

my cousin who was struck with spinal menengitis in late february, was in a coma for three days, and has had a miraculous recovery. many in the family have been praying to fr. solanus casey for him. just recently my cousin was contacted by the priest at st. bonaventure’s who is working on fr. casey’s cause for canonization. :bounce:
 
this is sort of related to this thread…

my cousin who was struck with spinal menengitis in late february, was in a coma for three days, and has had a miraculous recovery. many in the family have been praying to fr. solanus casey for him. just recently my cousin was contacted by the priest at st. bonaventure’s who is working on fr. casey’s cause for canonization. :bounce:
:eek: No kidding! I remember when you mentioned his sudden illness then. That is exciting news! :yup:

So, cousin is doing well then?
 
This is one of the most perfect theological definitions of humility and it’s so practical.

True humility comes from God and gives us peace and a special sense of joy. A truly humble person is a grateful person. He or she recognizes how much God loves them and the gifts that God has given him.

A truly humble man or woman can recognize their virtues and their faults.

Today, at spiritual direction, my superior and I were talking about some of the things that God is doing in my life and yours too. Yes, I said yours. I spoke to him of this ministry.

We came to this very topic. I was concerned as to whether or not this ministry was the work of Christ and his Holy Spirit. As we talked, Brother and I were listening to the Spirit and he quoted from Teresa this very citation.

I explained how little I felt I could do on this thread and others, but how others seemed to feel differently. I was unsure how much of these feelings were me and how much of them were from God. He reminded me that all things that come with faith, joy and without taking away our inner silence, were gifts of grace.

“Therefore, thank God you can do some good through this ministry with what you have.”

Real humility is knowing that you can do small things with great love and you know it when you experience the joy and override the frustration.

JR 🙂
 
:eek: No kidding! I remember when you mentioned his sudden illness then. That is exciting news! :yup:

So, cousin is doing well then?
he’s not perfect yet, but considering the initial prognosis, he’s wonderful. 🙂
 
he’s not perfect yet, but considering the initial prognosis, he’s wonderful. 🙂
I’m glad to hear that and hope that it works out well for your cousing and Fra. Solanus. I’ll pay for both.

JR 🙂
 
Today, at spiritual direction, my superior and I were talking about some of the things that God is doing in my life and yours too. Yes, I said yours. I spoke to him of this ministry.

We came to this very topic. I was concerned as to whether or not this ministry was the work of Christ and his Holy Spirit. As we talked, Brother and I were listening to the Spirit **and he quoted from Teresa this very citation.
**
I’d say the Holy Spirit has been busy today. 🙂
I explained how little I felt I could do on this thread and others, but how others seemed to feel differently. I was unsure how much of these feelings were me and how much of them were from God. He reminded me that all things that come with faith, joy and without taking away our inner silence, were gifts of grace.

“Therefore, thank God you can do some good through this ministry with what you have.”

Real humility is knowing that you can do small things with great love and you know it when you experience the joy and override the frustration.

JR 🙂
Key is to let go of the frustration, I think there must be a learning curve to take into account here. 😃

So, as to whether there is a good work to be done around these parts, we who have had faith all along, we know what we’re talking about, is that what I’m hearing? 😛
 
I’d say the Holy Spirit has been busy today. 🙂

Key is to let go of the frustration, I think there must be a learning curve to take into account here. 😃

So, as to whether there is a good work to be done around these parts, we who have had faith all along, we know what we’re talking about, is that what I’m hearing? 😛
Maybe we’re saying the same thing, but in different languages. In Franciscan spirituality, frustration is accepted as part of the spiritual journey. Francis and the great Francisan mystics were very conscious of human psychology, long before Freud came around. Bonaventure was one of those people.

He believed that human beings are always going to have to face obstacles, including people who are like boulders on a road. You can’t always wish frustration away. It’s there. It’s part of the journey. It’s part of the cross.

Our Lord experienced great frustration with Peter and with his disciples, not to mention with the Jewish leadership. He would often go away in prayer or ask the Apostles to take out the boats and cross the lake. He would get great refreshment from being on the water with the holy Apostles.

St. Francis experienced great frustration with the Church and his brothers when they asked him to lighten up his rule, even though it had been dictated to him by Christ himself. He went away to pray on a mountain, much like Christ.

We don’t just let go of something that is real to us and that is part of being human, becasue wishing it to go away is wishing that God will take away something of our humanity. Our humanity is the gift that God gave us. With this gift comes frustration, anger and other strong emotions.

Like Christ and Francis, we acknowledge that we have these feelings and we live with them. We continue to do what we have to do, be it at work, home or prayer.

This is part of embracing the cross of Jesus Christ. It is love in action. We do not get rid of our feelings, we embrace them by accepting them and recognizing that they are part of the gift of our humanity. But we do not allow these feelings to violate charity or prayer.

JR 🙂
 
Maybe we’re saying the same thing, but in different languages. In Franciscan spirituality, frustration is accepted as part of the spiritual journey. Francis and the great Francisan mystics were very conscious of human psychology, long before Freud came around. Bonaventure was one of those people.

He believed that human beings are always going to have to face obstacles, including people who are like boulders on a road. You can’t always wish frustration away. It’s there. It’s part of the journey. It’s part of the cross.

Our Lord experienced great frustration with Peter and with his disciples, not to mention with the Jewish leadership. He would often go away in prayer or ask the Apostles to take out the boats and cross the lake. He would get great refreshment from being on the water with the holy Apostles.

St. Francis experienced great frustration with the Church and his brothers when they asked him to lighten up his rule, even though it had been dictated to him by Christ himself. He went away to pray on a mountain, much like Christ.

We don’t just let go of something that is real to us and that is part of being human, because wishing it to go away is wishing that God will take away something of our humanity. Our humanity is the gift that God gave us. With this gift comes frustration, anger and other strong emotions.

Like Christ and Francis, we acknowledge that we have these feelings and we live with them. We continue to do what we have to do, be it at work, home or prayer.

This is part of embracing the cross of Jesus Christ. It is love in action. We do not get rid of our feelings, we embrace them by accepting them and recognizing that they are part of the gift of our humanity. But we do not allow these feelings to violate charity or prayer.

JR 🙂
Thanks for explaining this further, I have found it very helpful personally.
 
It’s time to update this thread with another great saint, this time a contemporary for many of us, St. Maximilian Kolbe, OFM, Conv. Brother Maximilian Kolbe was a Franciscan Friar and a priest. He gave his life in a concentration camp to save the life of a young Jewish man who was about to be executed. Being as the young man had a wife and family, Max stepped up to the plate and offered to take his place.

As a young man Max prayed to the Blessed Mother and asked her what was to become of him. While in deep prayer he saw an image of Our Lady. She was holding two crowns, a white one and a red one. She asked him which one he preferred. When he asked the vision what they meant, Our Lady said that one was for purity and the other for martyrdom. Then she repeated her question, “Which do you want?” Max responded, “Both of them.”

Here was a man who was not afraid to ask God for “too much.” He knew that God could give him both the crown of purity and the crown of martyrdom. How this was to happen, he had no idea, but that didn’t matter. The important thing is that he believed that nothing was impossible for God. Like his Holy Father Francis, he believed that God in his mercy could give us anything that we ask for our salvation and the salvation of others. God can not only do it, be he desires to do so.

Another beautiful and exciting quality about Max is his fidelity to his Holy Father Francis. He does not pray to Our Lady to ask her to give him what he believes he needs. Instead his prayer is truly framed in holy poverty as St. Francis had taught the Brothers centuries before. Max presented himself before the Blessed Mother completely detached. He was open to the will of God in his life. He could not have approached a better person. Mary too had said, “Be it done to me according to they word.” Just like Mary was poor, detached from her own will and her own desires, so was Max. His only desire was to know God’s will in his life. This is why he asks our Lady this question. We too are called to approach the Lord and his Blessed Mother with the same spirit of detachment in our time. It is not up to us to ask God to do this or that for us or to fix the Church this way or that way, because we find it more beautiful or more acceptable to our idea of truth. We are not to ask God to lead us down this path or that path, because we believe it will make us happier or holier.

Our happiness and our holiness are to be found in the will of God for our lives. So, Max is not asking our Lady to foreshadow the future for him. She’s not a fortune teller. He’s really asking her to show him the way. “What is to become of me?” is his way of asking, where is God leading me. Max does not want to know this just out of mere curiosity. He wants to know because he wants to fulfil God’s plan in his life. Are you wiling to ask such an open-ended question of God?

Interestingly enough, Max’s time in history was not so different from our own. There were many errors and the Church had many enemies. Max set out to combat these errors. But unlike the many of us here on these threads, Max took the responsible approach. He did not settle for reading a few documents and quoting citations out of context. At 16 he became a serious student of theology, by the time he was 25 he has two PhDs, one in Theology and one in Philosophy. He founded Our Lady’s Militia.

The term militia was taken from the expression “the Church Militant.” How different was Max’s understanding of the Church militant to the way that many people throw that term around today. He understood it in its proper context, the context given by Thomas Aquinas and Francis of Assisi. The Church militant consisted of those souls who are still struggling for their salvation, no people seeking conflicts with others or doing battle with others.

In fact, he remembered what Francis had told Anthony of Padua when Anthony requested permission to teach the friars theology. Francis responded, “It is permissible to teach the Brothers theology on one condition, that it does not extinguish the spirit of prayer, obedience to me and my successors, charity toward neighbour and breed pride.” With this exhortation in mind, Max sets out to found a parallel community of Franciscans whom he names our Ladies Militia and Later would be renamed the Franciscans of the Immaculate, a branch of the Third Order Regular Franciscans. They were also to have secular members. Whether the individual lived in a friary or with his or her family, the mission was the same.

Error would be combated by living the virtuous life, prayer, work and suffering.

Max would later give the greatest example of this in a concentration camp where he prayed, performed forced manual labour and give his life in place of a Jewish man who had been selected by the Nazis to be punished for an escaped prisoner.

You may ask why he took the Jewish man’s place. Max may have been set free. He was not Jewish. Max also believed in Ecumenism. Like Francis before him and Bishop Woytyla who was then the bishop in Max’s home diocese, Max was convinced that the Jews were our older brothers and sisters in the faith. He loved them. It was because he loved them that he was arrested and sent to a concentration camp in the first place. The arresting Nazi officers had shouted and spat on his face, “if you love the dirty Jews so much, then go and be one with them.” To which Maximilian responded, “We are already one. For even as it is unknown to them at this time, one of their own gave his life so that all of us can have eternal life.”

I will have the honour of a private meeting with his niece and the grandson of the Jewish inmate that Max saved, this summer when she visits our parish which will be renamed in honour of her uncle. I can’t wait to meet her.

americancatholic.org/Features/SaintOfDay/default.asp?id=1107

JR 🙂
 
Like Francis before him and Bishop Woytyla who was then the bishop in Max’s home diocese, Max was convinced that the Jews were our older brothers and sisters in the faith.
Thanks to Catharina, who caught this mistake in my timeline. Karol Woytyla would become bishop after Max’s death. I am sorry for the timeline distortion.

The idea is the same, both held the same belief. But the timeline is wrong.

I apologize and hope it didn’t upset anyone.

JR 🙂
 
I have a question. I have been trying to find out in what “type” of spirituality Pope Benedict XVI was educated.

I am interested because I just ordered Jesus of Nazareth and am curious about his formation.

He entered St. Michael Seminary, but that was closed and I can find no further information.
Was it Benedictine? Franciscan?

Judging by the name Benedict, I am thinking probably Benedictine, but I could be way off base. Anybody know?
 
I have a question. I have been trying to find out in what “type” of spirituality Pope Benedict XVI was educated.

I am interested because I just ordered Jesus of Nazareth and am curious about his formation.

He entered St. Michael Seminary, but that was closed and I can find no further information.
Was it Benedictine? Franciscan?

Judging by the name Benedict, I am thinking probably Benedictine, but I could be way off base. Anybody know?
Pope Benedict is not a religious. He is a secular priest. They are not educated in any specific spirituality. It is up to the individual to discover a spirituality that works for him.

Judging from his writings I would say that he leans toward Jesuit spirituality. He’s very disciplined and very oriented toward the head over the emotions. This is very Ignatian.

Franciscans are oriented toward the heart, very big on love.

Benedictines and Carmelites are oriented toward the mystical, very big on silence and union with God.

Jesuits are oriented toward understanding God, very big on the intellect.

I’m only speculating. But Benedict seems to be very big into the intellect. I believe that’s why he tood the name Benedict. The last Benedict was also very big into the intellect. You maintain a cool demeanor and keep all feelings under control, so that you can better understand what God means. He also has a touch of Dominican. He is very scholastic (philosophical). Everything has to have logic. The Dominicans and Jesuits complement each other well.

JR 🙂
 
Pope Benedict is not a religious. He is a secular priest. They are not educated in any specific spirituality. It is up to the individual to discover a spirituality that works for him.

Judging from his writings I would say that he leans toward Jesuit spirituality. He’s very disciplined and very oriented toward the head over the emotions. This is very Ignatian.

Franciscans are oriented toward the heart, very big on love.

Benedictines and Carmelites are oriented toward the mystical, very big on silence and union with God.

Jesuits are oriented toward understanding God, very big on the intellect.

I’m only speculating. But Benedict seems to be very big into the intellect. I believe that’s why he tood the name Benedict. The last Benedict was also very big into the intellect. You maintain a cool demeanor and keep all feelings under control, so that you can better understand what God means. He also has a touch of Dominican. He is very scholastic (philosophical). Everything has to have logic. The Dominicans and Jesuits complement each other well.

JR 🙂
So given these descriptions, what would we say John Paul II’s spiritualities are?

Very mystical, so that would be Carmelite? Very philosophical, Dominican? But he had the love of Francis too. :hmmm:

Sounds like quite a mixture! What do you think, do I seem close?
 
1953July: Ratzinger receives his doctorate in theology from the University of Munich. In connection with his doctoral studies he produces his first important work: Volk und Haus Gottes in Augustins Lehre von der Kirche [People and House of God in Augustine’s doctrine of the Church].

Ratzinger devotes his Habilitationsschrift – book-length contribution to original research in order to teach at the university level – to Bonaventure’s theology of history and revelation.

With Benedict XVI, looks like we get the best of ALL spiritualities.
 
So given these descriptions, what would we say John Paul II’s spiritualities are?

Very mystical, so that would be Carmelite? Very philosophical, Dominican? But he had the love of Francis too. :hmmm:

Sounds like quite a mixture! What do you think, do I seem close?
I think that everyone takes from all of the great saints. No one is 100% anything. For example, I’m very oriented toward the Franciscans, but I love Carmelite mysticism and Benedictine asceticism. But you always have one that stands out more than the others.

If I were to guess I would say that you have all of the above correct, regarding John Paul II. I would also have to say that he was more pronouncedly Salesian. Like John Bosco, he was a lover of youth and had worked in youth ministry for most of his priestly life. He was also a teacher and college professor. When he became pope, one of the things that he initiated were the World Youth Days. He loved being with youth.

One of the things that he liked about the NO was that he could celebrate mass in the language of the kids and allow the kids to participate using their music and their skills.

He loved sports and he had led many youth groups and youth sport competitions in his younger days.

He did a lot to bring young people back to the Church.

Nonetheless, he was also a philosopher and a theologian. His favorite theologian was St. Thomas Aquinas. And yet his favorite saint was St. Francis. He loved going to Assisi.

Pope Benedict definitely has a great deal of love for St. Benedict and St. Francis. At a resent Marian Congress of American youth the Holy Father finished his talk by telling the youngsters to go back to America and stay close to St. Benedict and St. Francis, which is interesting, because niether are scholars. Both are mystics and ascetics. Maybe there is a side of Benedict XVI that we have not seen.

JR 🙂
 
1953July: Ratzinger receives his doctorate in theology from the University of Munich. In connection with his doctoral studies he produces his first important work: Volk und Haus Gottes in Augustins Lehre von der Kirche [People and House of God in Augustine’s doctrine of the Church].

Ratzinger devotes his Habilitationsschrift – book-length contribution to original research in order to teach at the university level – to Bonaventure’s theology of history and revelation.

With Benedict XVI, looks like we get the best of ALL spiritualities.
I believe that you’re right as regards his career as a theologian. Yet, I think that in his daily life he comes across as more Jesuit. I’m just looking at his discipline. It’s almost military the way that he has lived his life.

This is a very Ignatian quality. This wouldn’t stop him from loving the study of Augustine and Bonaventure.

When we speak of a person’s spirituality, we’re not speaking of what they enjoy reading or teaching, bu how they guide their lives.

Despite his knowledge of Bonaventure, he does not come across as St. Francis. Franciscan spirituality is very extraverted, Benedict is almost shy. I’ve noticed that he does not feel comfortable in front of TV cameras, whereas Pope John Paul was almost a ham in front of the cameras. He didn’t seem intimidated by them. Benedict is now becoming for comfortable with them.

There is an interesting anecdote of him and a TV reporter. He was going to be interviewed by a reporter as he led a tour through the Vatican. In fact, it’s going to be on TV this week.

Anyway, he asked the reporter what he needed to do. The reporter said, “Just relax Your Holiness. We’re going to walk and talk. I’ll ask questions and you answer. I’ll ask you about your favourite parts of the vatican and you tell me what you’re thinking. Just walk and talk.”

The Holy Father looked at the American reporter and said, “Walkie-Talkie? I can do that.”

JR 🙂
 
Today at mass the preacher reminded us that today is Vocation Sunday. While he was speaking about the different vocations in the Church: Holy Orders, Religious Life, Marriage, Single Life, he also discussed the different forms of ministry (service) that God calls us to perform in life.

I couldn’t help remembering what we posted yesterday about St. Max. St. Max asked our Lady a very poignant question, “What is to become of me?” He’s asking her to clarify his vocation.

This is the different between a saint and a worldly person. A saint asks God “What do you want me to do? Where do you want me to go? How do you want me to do it?”

A worldly person asks God, “Please let me be a dentist, lawyer, engineer, and mother or find a spouse.” He or she asks God “Please let me get this contract or this job.” The worldly person asks God, “Please let me get to where I want to go.”

There is nothing immoral about asking God for any of these things. Don’t get me wrong. These are all good things. But it’s horizontal thinking. When we pray this way we are staying on this plane of existence. We’re not thinking vertically. We’re not asking God to show us what he wants of us and how to get there.

This is what St. Max brings to today’s world. He shows us how to ask God a very simple question, “What are you calling me to do?”

We’re not all going to have visions, like St. Max. Even St. Max’s vision of our Lady was not very specific. She showed him the crowns of martyrdom and purity and asked him to choose. He chose both. But she didn’t give him a straight answer.

Max had to go with is gut. God had led him to know St. Francis and fall in love with the way that St. Francis lived the gospel. St. Max employed the free will that God gave him and chose to live the Gospel in the same manner as his beloved Francis, not out of adoration or some distorted devotion to St. Francis, but out of love for Christ. St. Francis’ way felt comfortable and attractive to him. He trusted that God would lead him elsewhere, if the Franciscan path was the wrong path for him. But he had to begin somewhere.

St. Max began to respond to God’s call by choosing a virtuous life, from there, the rest was up to God. This is how we, if we are to be saints in today’s world are to proceed. We choose the good and pray that God will steer us from that point forward. This is how we respond to God’s call or vocation.

JR 🙂
 
Lovely explication above, JR.

My mother’s primary prayer was that she always be led to accept and perform the will of God in her own life.
 
This is one of the most perfect theological definitions of humility and it’s so practical.

True humility comes from God and gives us peace and a special sense of joy. A truly humble person is a grateful person. He or she recognizes how much God loves them and the gifts that God has given him.

A truly humble man or woman can recognize their virtues and their faults.

Today, at spiritual direction, my superior and I were talking about some of the things that God is doing in my life and yours too. Yes, I said yours. I spoke to him of this ministry.

We came to this very topic. I was concerned as to whether or not this ministry was the work of Christ and his Holy Spirit. As we talked, Brother and I were listening to the Spirit and he quoted from Teresa this very citation.

I explained how little I felt I could do on this thread and others, but how others seemed to feel differently. I was unsure how much of these feelings were me and how much of them were from God. He reminded me that all things that come with faith, joy and without taking away our inner silence, were gifts of grace.

“Therefore, thank God you can do some good through this ministry with what you have.”

Real humility is knowing that you can do small things with great love and you know it when you experience the joy and override the frustration.

JR 🙂
Good post. I’ve always believed that we have found both true humility & the self-image that God wants us to have, when we can shout with the psalmist:

“I praise YOU because I am fearfully & wonderfully made.”
 
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