Salvation by faith alone

  • Thread starter Thread starter MEE
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
M

MEE

Guest
I was reading today that some believe salvation is achieved simply by believing in Jesus and accepting Him as your Savior - works, Sacraments, etc. are not helpful. I read this on a “Fellowship” website while researching the significance of the three crosses at Calvary. If I understand the thinking, because the one criminal was saved by believing in Jesus (without time remaining to repent and do good in this life), Scripture tells us our salvation is achieved simply by believing in Jesus. I think this line of thought is also held by Baptists. Can you tell me if I understand this correctly and how a Catholic Apologist responds to this?
 
This view is founded on many verses, but this is probably one of the most significant. Elsewhere, “Whoever believes my words has eternal life.” Indeed, but this is just the first step of many to God. However God is clearly a Just God, but at the same time, “abounding in Mercy, from age to age.”
And Christ hanging on the cross, God and Man, was left alone by everyone in the storm, after they all challenged Him to prove Himself…probably desperate and hopeless in His humanity…and this man accepts Him and calls Him Lord, as a final act of reverence. Well, as a man, it’s no wonder why Christ said, “I say to you, this day you shall be with Me in paradise”! But this doesn’t just apply to this man. Indeed it applies to many. Such as people who have been lukewarm but on their deathbed, under the Holy Spirit’s influence, believes in Jesus and offers Himself. Surely God will not forget this man or leave Him. But we shouldn’t take for this reason, a way of saying that whoever simply ‘believes’ in Jesus are saved. Jesus said, “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord!’ will enter the kingdom of Heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father in Heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from Me, evildoers!’” (Matthew 7:21-23). Here, Christ plainly says that belief in Him isn’t enough. It must be understood in the context that He established His church on the rock of Peter, who was the first Bishop of Rome, and held the ‘keys to the kingdom’. And this Church, as history is certain, is the Roman Catholic Church, which became the official religion of Rome when an apparition of Christ bid Constantine, the emperor, “Conquer in My Name.” This is the Church that has spread throughout the world, and is guided under the Holy Spirit in the fullest sense, while Protestants reject certain and other doctrines for their own, while still holding to some basic truth.
And say in the case of a stillborn child whom the parents intended on baptizing; or unborn babies who were the victims of abortion. This problem goes with the teaching of Augustine that anyone not baptized won’t be saved, and hand in hand with the teaching, ‘No salvation outside the Church.’ But surely, we can’t say that this unborn child has no right to enter Heaven, can we?! God alone is the judge of every soul, and such a soul, though marked by original sin, must be saved through the merits of Jesus and His Church, atleast I think it so, because God is Love, and Jesus “loved” the children.

But back to the issue of faith vs works, this verse from the letter of James, Ch 2:14-19 pretty rightly sums up the whole ordeal of faith alone:
"What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him? Suppose a brother or sister is without clothes and daily food. If one of you says to him, ‘Go, I wish you well; keep warm and well fed,’ but does nothing about his physical needs, what good is it? In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.
But someone will say, ‘You have faith and I have works.’ Well, demonstrate your faith to me and I will demonstrate my faith to you by my works. You believe that God is one. Shudder~even the demons know such."


The theme of these verses is the relationship of faith and works, as mutual partners in the whole teaching of Christ. The arguement by protestants, however, is that the teaching here contradicts that of Paul, particularly in Romans 4:5-6. The problem can only be understood if the different viewpoints of the two authors are seen. Paul argues against those who claim to participate in God’s salvation because of their good deeds as well as because the have committed themselves to trust in God through Christ Jesus (Pauls concept of faith). Paul certainly understood, however much it may be argued, the implications of true faith for a life of love and generosity, especially in Galatians 5:6.13-15:
“For in Christ Jesus, neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love”…“For you were called for freedom, brothers. But do not use this freedom as an opportunity for the flesh; rather, serve one another through love. For the whole law is fulfilled in one statement, namely ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ But if you go on biting and devouring one another, beware that you are not consumed by one another.”…James is well aware, though, that proper conduct and good works can only come about with an authentic committment to God in faith, but also well aware that faith alone is not the end of it. Many think he was in fact seeking to correct any misunderstandings of Paul’s view.

Therefore, it’s clear that faith and works are necessary. But in grave situations, faith (or even, God’s mercy) alone can be enough according to God’s providence and merciful love. I hoped this helped somewhat. God Bless.
 
I was reading today that some believe salvation is achieved simply by believing in Jesus and accepting Him as your Savior - works, Sacraments, etc. are not helpful. I read this on a “Fellowship” website while researching the significance of the three crosses at Calvary. If I understand the thinking, because the one criminal was saved by believing in Jesus (without time remaining to repent and do good in this life), Scripture tells us our salvation is achieved simply by believing in Jesus. I think this line of thought is also held by Baptists. Can you tell me if I understand this correctly and how a Catholic Apologist responds to this?
The thief on the cross was saved because Jesus took his repentance as a declaration, not just of belief but of a true change of heart, what the Church calls perfect contrition, that would have led to him leading a life of righteousness, which involves constant renewal of heart and mind, if he had survived. He died shortly afterwards and so had no time to sin again. We humans can always sin again, though. The idea that God will simply overlook our sins is a damnable one–it is the sin of presumption. God is not so merciless as to let us remain in our sins in that way. He desires us to be perfected and formed into the image of his Son and that takes time and effort on our part.
 
If I understand the thinking, because the one criminal was saved by believing in Jesus (without time remaining to repent and do good in this life), Scripture tells us our salvation is achieved simply by believing in Jesus. I think this line of thought is also held by Baptists. Can you tell me if I understand this correctly and how a Catholic Apologist responds to this?
The thief on the cross did everything he could to follow Christ after his repentance on his cross. We do not know if he was formally baptized or not. His repentance included a confession of Christ, the act of publicly defending Christ, and included suffering for the Gospel as best as he could for the remainder of his life. Those are the works he did as part of him living out the Gospel for those short moments at the end of his life. We should do the same and follow Christ as best we can for the remainder of our lives. :o
 
I was reading today that some believe salvation is achieved simply by believing in Jesus and accepting Him as your Savior - works, Sacraments, etc. are not helpful. I read this on a “Fellowship” website while researching the significance of the three crosses at Calvary. If I understand the thinking, because the one criminal was saved by believing in Jesus (without time remaining to repent and do good in this life),
It is clear that Dismas (the penitent thief) did more in the way of good works than most of us. He spoke up in defense of Christ when Jesus was being mocked by the other thief. Also Dismas was Crucified with Christ, what more can one do?

BTW, the Bible most certainly does not say we are saved by Faith Alone. The Bible explicitly says that we are saved not by faith alone. Elsewhere Scripture also tells that faith without works is dead.
 
I was reading today that some believe salvation is achieved simply by believing in Jesus and accepting Him as your Savior - works, Sacraments, etc. are not helpful. I read this on a “Fellowship” website while researching the significance of the three crosses at Calvary. If I understand the thinking, because the one criminal was saved by believing in Jesus (without time remaining to repent and do good in this life), Scripture tells us our salvation is achieved simply by believing in Jesus. I think this line of thought is also held by Baptists. Can you tell me if I understand this correctly and how a Catholic Apologist responds to this?
Of course salvation is by faith. The New Testament clearly indicates this. However, faith is not “simple” and is not independent of “works” i.e. how Catholics live out their salvation.
 
The thief on the cross was saved because Jesus took his repentance as a declaration, not just of belief but of a true change of heart, what the Church calls perfect contrition, that would have led to him leading a life of righteousness, which involves constant renewal of heart and mind, if he had survived. He died shortly afterwards and so had no time to sin again. We humans can always sin again, though. The idea that God will simply overlook our sins is a damnable one–it is the sin of presumption. God is not so merciless as to let us remain in our sins in that way. He desires us to be perfected and formed into the image of his Son and that takes time and effort on our part.
Well said. Thanks for the answer.
 
The thief on the cross was saved because Jesus took his repentance as a declaration, not just of belief but of a true change of heart, what the Church calls perfect contrition, that would have led to him leading a life of righteousness, which involves constant renewal of heart and mind, if he had survived. He died shortly afterwards and so had no time to sin again. We humans can always sin again, though. The idea that God will simply overlook our sins is a damnable one–it is the sin of presumption. God is not so merciless as to let us remain in our sins in that way. He desires us to be perfected and formed into the image of his Son and that takes time and effort on our part.
Cleansing from sin is an important pre-requisite to salvation. But it is for God to judge who deserves to be saved. Israel’s biggest sin was not recognising that Jesus was from God. The thief’s greatest virtue was in recognising that Jesus was from God.

In Judaism and Christianity “salvation” means being saved from sin. In India “salvation” (mukthi or moksha) means ultimate union with God. The gospels clearly tell us that no one can go to the Father except through Jesus. Believing Jesus is the only way to be saved (united with God). Recall John 11: 26. “He who believes in me will live, even though he dies; and whoever lives and believes in me will never die.”
The meaning is: Belief in Jesus will free those who are slaves to sin. Those who are not slaves to sin will never be enslaved by sin if they believe in Jesus.
 
Okay, I could be completely off base here… there are verses that say faith without works is lost but I think what this means is that if you HAVE faith, you act accordingly. If you believe, if you love, you act on that belief and love. The woman who touched Jesus’ robes had faith BUT she also acted and because she had action as well as a profession of faith she was healed.

Read the Gospels, anytime someone had faith they also had actions to back up that faith and/or ‘works’ as it were.

My thought of the day is this:

If I say I love you but I rarely listen to your advice, seek your time only when it’s convenient and disrespect your children, do I really love you?

If I say I love God yet rarely listen to His Word, seek His time only when it’s convenient to me and disrespect His children, do I really love God?

If you have faith you will have action as well, your works will show your faith. 🙂

I have no Bible quotations to back this up, and I don’t know if that’s what the Church teaches, it’s just my two cents.
 
Okay, I could be completely off base here… there are verses that say faith without works is lost but I think what this means is that if you HAVE faith, you act accordingly. If you believe, if you love, you act on that belief and love. The woman who touched Jesus’ robes had faith BUT she also acted and because she had action as well as a profession of faith she was healed.

Read the Gospels, anytime someone had faith they also had actions to back up that faith and/or ‘works’ as it were.

My thought of the day is this:

If I say I love you but I rarely listen to your advice, seek your time only when it’s convenient and disrespect your children, do I really love you?

If I say I love God yet rarely listen to His Word, seek His time only when it’s convenient to me and disrespect His children, do I really love God?

If you have faith you will have action as well, your works will show your faith. 🙂

I have no Bible quotations to back this up, and I don’t know if that’s what the Church teaches, it’s just my two cents.
Action is proof of faith. Bible offers several examples:
  1. Abraham preparing his son for sacrifice, because of his faith in God.
  2. The Israelites sacrificing the passsover lamb and smearing the blood on their door posts to escape destruction because they believed God’s word revealed through Moses.
  3. The king and citizens of Nineveh repenting in dust and ashes because they believed God’s word revealed through Jonah.
  4. Joseph accepting Mary despite her pre-marital pregnancy because he believed what God revealed in a dream.
 
I was reading today that some believe salvation is achieved simply by believing in Jesus and accepting Him as your Savior - works, Sacraments, etc. are not helpful. I read this on a “Fellowship” website while researching the significance of the three crosses at Calvary. If I understand the thinking, because the one criminal was saved by believing in Jesus (without time remaining to repent and do good in this life), Scripture tells us our salvation is achieved simply by believing in Jesus. I think this line of thought is also held by Baptists. Can you tell me if I understand this correctly and how a Catholic Apologist responds to this?
Abraham believed and it was counted to him as righteousness. This was attaining salvation. This was of grace and not works lest it be of debt. James said Abraham was justiified by works when he offered Isaac as a sacrifice. Faith without works is dead so faith is never alone in the work of grace.so works is the fruit of salvation. The thief. Attained salvation and showed the fruit by repenting and asking foriveness and believing in Jesus as his savior.
Some will say that after iniitial act of salvation works will not affect the possibility of losing salvation because Abraham presenting Isaac as a sacrifice is the same as us believing and being obedient. Though this appears to be true the scriptures across the board do not support this.
Romans 8 talks about christians are to live in the spirit and to be carnally minded is death. This is different than the carnal christians in 1 Corinthians 3 for they were ignorant or had lack of knowledge. This carnal mind knows better and he that knows to good and doeth it not is sin. Without holiness no man shall see the lord Paul said in Timothy.
1 Corinthians 3 talks about works not affecting salvation but, this is talking about the works according to build on the foundation of the church. Right after that Paul says that one who are saved and don’t take care of their own temple(themselves), god will destroy. Galatians 6:7-8 Be not decievved; God is not mocked; for whatsoever a man soweth that shall he also reap. For he that soweth to the flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the spirit shall of the spirit reap life everlasting. The flesh and the spirit deal with the soul, not works that is about building on the foundation of the church. The soul can lose salvation not daily works. God Bless! Jerry Kelso
 
The problem with many Protestants (and some Catholics) is that they rely on the Bible in place of the Church. We should never ask, “Where is that in the Bible?” when seeking to validate a belief. We should ask, instead, “What does the Church teach?” in that regard.

That being said, there are two types of “belief” work here. One is mere intellectual assent. (“Yes, I believe in Jesus Christ.”) The other is real, salvific belief that penetrates our very being, and more importantly, guides our actions. That’s why St. James in his epistle says that faith without works is dead. A dead faith cannot save. We must LIVE our faith for it to be effective. And we can do none of this without God’s grace. That’s why the Church says we are saved Sola Gratia (solely by God’s grace). The Church never says we are saved Sola Fide (solely by faith).
 
=MEE;6720021]I was reading today that some believe salvation is achieved simply by believing in Jesus and accepting Him as your Savior - works, Sacraments, etc. are not helpful. I read this on a “Fellowship” website while researching the significance of the three crosses at Calvary. If I understand the thinking, because the one criminal was saved by believing in Jesus (without time remaining to repent and do good in this life), Scripture tells us our salvation is achieved simply by believing in Jesus. I think this line of thought is also held by Baptists. Can you tell me if I understand this correctly and how a Catholic Apologist responds to this?
While you state the case correctly, there is a lack of understanding that is of great signifiance.

Fist One ought to NOTE that Jesus, mutiple times forgave sinners sins when He healed them.

Second: “baptism of desire” which is as valid in certain circumstanes, like when Baptism of Water in the Spirit is not possible, as is the case here; so this “Good thief” would have benefitted from ALL THE BENEFITS OF BAPTISM. Remission of all sin and as well as the latent effects of sin. THUS he qulaified for heaven on God’s terms.

Love and prayers,
 
After doing some studying I think I understand this a bit better.

We are indeed saved by faith ‘alone’, except people are misunderstanding…

Faith is not a feeling.

Faith is action.

So Protestants are misunderstanding the concept of being saved by faith alone as are Catholics.

PS: Thank you Pitcharan. 🙂 I finally GET it.
 
There are some who are not Catholic who believe the same. On the Calvinist side they are called “Lordship salvationists”. They say that those with real faith make Jesus Lord and do the works they were created for.

On the Arminian side you have those who believe the same.

Based on sensus plenior interpretations, the focus is placed on bread and fish. Man does not live by bread alone (the broken body of Christ**) but by fish (every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.)

Those who trust in Christ are obedient to his word, otherwise he tells them to depart for he never knew them.

**which wasn’t broken at all but with the split rock, torn veil, parted water, etc. is a symbol of God being torn… Father/Son, Body/Spirit.

I say that though we have received grace, he died not for lazy grace but loving Holiness. Holiness is the perfect keeping of the law of love written on our hearts, not legalism. The law of love is putting others first. Be ye therefore perfect! Go and sin no more!
 
After doing some studying I think I understand this a bit better.

We are indeed saved by faith ‘alone’, except people are misunderstanding…

Faith is not a feeling.

Faith is action.

So Protestants are misunderstanding the concept of being saved by faith alone as are Catholics.

PS: Thank you Pitcharan. 🙂 I finally GET it.
You’re right fatih involves action, yet faith is also a gift (unearned, undeserved, etc.).
 
Greetings to all and Nickybr38 from Pitcharan:)
Both sinner and saint have access to God only through faith. Recall John 11:25b-26b
He who believes in me will live, even though he dies; and whoever lives and believes in me will never die. The meaning that came to me:
Belief in Jesus will free those who are enslaved by sin; those who are not slaves to sinful habits can remain so and will never ever be ensalved if they believe in Jesus.

While the thief was saved because of faith, Mother Mary was one of those who did not sin; but her salvation came through faith: “Blessed is she who has believed that what the Lord has said to her will be accomplished!” (Lk 1:45)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top