Hi Richard: The dialog simply brings to the forefront some profound differences in perception that exist between various religions in regards to the nature of our being and our relationship to God. Primarily I am trying to gain a better foundation of the Christian view, and in the course of doing so, the conversation necessarily requires that I reveal some of what my religion believes so that I can sort out the divergences between the belief systems. That is not to say that I would change what Christians believe or that I would change what I believe. It’s simply a matter of gaining an understanding.
This does not appear to be what stew says. He is saying that sanctification is a process. A process that is a continual transforming into the image of Christ.
This gives me another point of confusion to deal with. If we are made in the image of God, and Jesus is God, why would we need to transform into the image of Jesus, who is a component of the Triune Being that we were already made in the image of? Again, this would lead me back to my sense that what is needed is more of a realization of what we are rather than a change in our nature. In my limited view, it appears that it’s not a matter of what we are, but inability to properly perceive what we are.
So you don’t believe that there is a need for sanctification?
I believe that all things are holy and all things are sacred, and insofar as I am able to ascertain, the definition of sanctity is indeed to be holy and sacred. If we are not seeing ourselves and the world around us as holy and sacred then we are not likely to be feeling holy or sacred, and if we are not feeling holy or sacred, we are not likely to be acting holy or sacred. Not in a genuine way. For one who knows that he or she is holy and sacred, holy behavior is only an outward manifestation of an inner state of being that has been achieved or fully realized. Acting that way otherwise is just acting. I read some things that Saint Paul wrote where he suffered immensely in an unending battle he had with the desire for sense pleasures. From the perspective of eastern thought this would be because he tried to work it in reverse order, or more specifically, trying to act holy while still wanting to act in unholy ways. True realization of holiness expunges our being of the desire to act in unholy ways. The change that needs to take place is not in the core nature of our being, but in the awakening, or resurrection of the Christ within us. This is why someone such as myself would not see the Second Coming to be one universally experienced historical event to be anticipated, but something that happens to each person one by one, as we resurrect the Christ within us.
Yes, sin is the inability to see our true nature of holiness and sacredness. One who feels holy and sacred, and sees the world around them as the same, will not lie, cheat, steal, kill, lust for, want for or otherwise desire that which is unholy. We build on this problematic perception of ourselves throughout life because of our inundation in the world of sense objects and sense perception, which obscures our view into the divine effulgence of the inner light that is the true core of all beings. Therefore it would stand to reason that the lack of perception of our holiness is the original sin, and the gateway sin to all other acts of sin that follow.
So again, you don’t see any need for change?
I don’t perceive that one can change the core essence of what one is. What you are is what you are. It is the wrongful perception of what we are that needs changing. If you see yourself as being separated from God, you will feel separated from God, and if you feel separated from God, you are in effect and for all practical purposes, separated, alone, and looking for salvation. So you behave yourself as best you can, avoid bad actions, do good deeds, attend services, participate in rights, and yet you still feel separated from God, alone, and in need of salvation. We are in fact only separated from God because we are not seeing Him in ourselves, the people around us, in other beings and in the world around us. If you feel the ground you walk on is holy, then you will walk on it like it is holy, and you will feel it’s holiness and your own holiness. You will no longer feel separated. People who have near death experiences often describe this ability to perceive their oneness with all things and the sacredness of all things. During these experiences, the day to day normal distractions of the sensory world have been removed.
So you see the process of becoming sanctified (holy) would render us incapable of seeing holiness in others. I’m afraid you’re going to have to explain how that follows.
I do not see it as a process, but an awakening to our natural state of being. I am not suggesting that you abandon the mainstream Christian perception of such things. Your journey is your own to take, and how you do that is up to you to a large extent, and largely based on what you’ve been taught. I am only explaining what others like myself see, while trying to better understand what you see.
Your friend
Sufjon
