Salvation of Non-Christians

[In_Hoc_Signo312]

Dear Friends,

I’m here because of something absolutely horrific that happened recently. This past Tuesday, a friend I went to middle school with, who was a Muslim, was murdered by her own father. What happened has left me absolutely shaken. I have experienced little joy or peace since I learned about this, but instead feel as though I am in pieces now. I’m starting to ask whether I even have any faith now, to be honest with you.

A large part of this (but not all) comes from the fact that, as I said, she was Muslim. I don’t think I’ve ever heard a definitive answer whether salvation is extended to non-Christians, or how easily they can obtain it. If my friend isn’t in Heaven now, unless there is some miracle that will happen with her, I shudder to think about it. Is there any official doctrine on the Salvation of non-Christians?

 

[Hatikvah]

I’m aware that your friend was a Muslim, but many sources concerning Pope Francis and the salvation of non-Christians are about atheists. This source is just about non-Christians and their salvation in particular with Pope Francis’ comments in mind.

The skeptics will point out that these comments by the Pope were not acts of the Magisterium. True. But it seems clear that Pope Francis has in mind to teach on this subject, under the Magisterium, soon. He has publicly said that he expects his pontificate to last only a few years. And we are two years into his pontificate already. I believe that Pope Francis will teach on the subject of salvation at the Bishops’ Synod.

What will he teach? Perhaps he will teach that atheists and agnostics can be saved without converting to belief in God, and that non-Christian believers can be saved without converting to Christianity. Jews, Muslims, and believers in other religions could be saved without converting to Christianity. [Source]

 

[JurisPrudens]

Dear Friends,

I’m here because of something absolutely horrific that happened recently. This past Tuesday, a friend I went to middle school with, who was a Muslim, was murdered by her own father. What happened has left me absolutely shaken. I have experienced little joy or peace since I learned about this, but instead feel as though I am in pieces now. I’m starting to ask whether I even have any faith now, to be honest with you.

A large part of this (but not all) comes from the fact that, as I said, she was Muslim. I don’t think I’ve ever heard a definitive answer whether salvation is extended to non-Christians, or how easily they can obtain it. If my friend isn’t in Heaven now, unless there is some miracle that will happen with her, I shudder to think about it. Is there any official doctrine on the Salvation of non-Christians?

Everyone who 1) is not baptised, 2) does not know the true teaching of the Catholic Church, but 3) sincerely searches for God, has a chance of being saved. There is no guarantee, but it is possible.

 

[PaulfromIowa]

Your friend obviously had little or no free choice regarding her religion, so I cannot imagine that God would hold that against her.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Dear Friends,

I’m here because of something absolutely horrific that happened recently. This past Tuesday, a friend I went to middle school with, who was a Muslim, was murdered by her own father. What happened has left me absolutely shaken. I have experienced little joy or peace since I learned about this, but instead feel as though I am in pieces now. I’m starting to ask whether I even have any faith now, to be honest with you.

A large part of this (but not all) comes from the fact that, as I said, she was Muslim. I don’t think I’ve ever heard a definitive answer whether salvation is extended to non-Christians, or how easily they can obtain it. If my friend isn’t in Heaven now, unless there is some miracle that will happen with her, I shudder to think about it. Is there any official doctrine on the Salvation of non-Christians?

We are to leave it in a loving God’s hands. But it is also important to evangelize. We have been given this mission. And yes, even to Muslims.

 

[Withburga]

Is there any official doctrine on the Salvation of non-Christians?

You might be reassured by a reading of the catechism, sections 839-843, which defines the Church’s relationship with non-Christians:

vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P29.HTM

This is not an innovation of the Catechism, but a clear citation of the teaching of Lumen Gentium:

16. Finally, those who have not yet received the Gospel are related in various ways to the people of God.(18) In the first place we must recall the people to whom the testament and the promises were given and from whom Christ was born according to the flesh.(125) On account of their fathers this people remains most dear to God, for God does not repent of the gifts He makes nor of the calls He issues.(126) But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator. In the first place amongst these there are the Muslims, who, professing to hold the faith of Abraham, along with us adore the one and merciful God, who on the last day will judge mankind. *

See: vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19641121_lumen-gentium_en.html

As a dogmatic constitution, Lumen Gentium represents the highest level of teaching - equal to an ex cathedra declaration - which the Church is able to make, and is guaranteed by the promise of Christ that the gates of hell will not prevail against her authority. This makes it non-negotiable.

There is a commonly expressed opinion that this theological understanding is a post-Vatican II phenomenon, but it is in fact entirely consistent with the Church’s long-established doctrine regarding baptism by blood and baptism by desire, which clearly articulate that one does not have to be a Christian by affiliation or by theological insight to be able to receive the fruits of the incarnation. That particular doctrine was recorded as normative in the annotations to the first edition of the Douay-Rheims Bible in 1582, and the Catholic Encyclopedia offers a good analysis of the apostolic and patristic origins of this doctrine:

newadvent.org/cathen/02258b.htm#x

I would also add that it is likewise common to encounter the belief that the possibility of salvation for non-Christians is somehow more slim or less certain than it is for Christians; that is not normative Church teaching, and we should not kid ourselves that our Christianity is a greater guarantee of either a good life or of salvation. God has given us the gift of Christian faith, and also the sacraments to make the path easier for us, yes. But of those who are given more, more is expected: and perhaps a life of heroic virtue lived by someone without the benefits of Christian faith and the sacraments could, in some cases, be a greater achievement in God’s eyes. That is a challenging thought, but it is not the teaching of the Church that our Christianity is a free pass to the beatific vision.

Before anyone else suggests it, I will also add that is not a recipe for religious indifferentism, either - we should evangelise and give Christ to everyone not only because of the solace that it can bring to each human being to know that God became human and shared their burdens, but also because the more people who understand and enact Christian praxis and morality, the more the world reflects God’s plan for humanity. But each individual will be judged according to what they did with the level of faith and understanding God granted them, not the amount of theological learning they were able to acquire.

God does not only love those of us who have, typically through no effort of our own, been born Catholic or given the gift of Catholic faith at some stage in our life: to imply that we have earned heaven would be Pelagian; to imply that we have been specially selected by God, unlike others, would be Jansenist; and neither is an acceptable Catholic position.

All of the above will not, I would guess, take away from you the shock and hurt caused by the terrible event that you have described. I’m sorry if I have allowed this to become overly academic, but I wanted to emphasise that you have good reason to hope that your friend is now with God, as much reason as we would have to hope that anyone will obtain the beatific vision. I will pray for her and for everyone who loved her, and also that such appalling violence may not happen again.

In Christ,
Withburga

 

[Don_Ruggero]

Dear Friends,

I’m here because of something absolutely horrific that happened recently. This past Tuesday, a friend I went to middle school with, who was a Muslim, was murdered by her own father. What happened has left me absolutely shaken. I have experienced little joy or peace since I learned about this, but instead feel as though I am in pieces now. I’m starting to ask whether I even have any faith now, to be honest with you.

A large part of this (but not all) comes from the fact that, as I said, she was Muslim. I don’t think I’ve ever heard a definitive answer whether salvation is extended to non-Christians, or how easily they can obtain it. If my friend isn’t in Heaven now, unless there is some miracle that will happen with her, I shudder to think about it. Is there any official doctrine on the Salvation of non-Christians?

I grieve with you the loss of your friend. It is unspeakably tragic that this happened to her.

Of course, you are bereft by this loss and still more by the events. That you are so young means you are confronting these horrors at a season of your life earlier than you should have to begin saying good-bye to friends.

I hope your love for your friend will inspire you not only to always remember her and never forget her but that it will inspire you so that this issue will continue to motivate you as you move through life…for there are many who face ordeals like your friend.

None of us can know the state of another’s soul before God. Even for dear friends who are Catholic, we pray for the happy repose of their soul…we pray that they died reconciled to God and in His grace. We entrust them to His mercy knowing that He wants to save all and that none would be lost.

The Council Fathers, at Vatican II, spoke of the Church’s relationship to those outside her visible boundaries. In part, they said in Lumen Gentium, the Dogmatic Constitution on the Church:
16. Finally, those who have not yet received the Gospel are related in various ways to the people of God. In the first place we must recall the people to whom the testament and the promises were given and from whom Christ was born according to the flesh. On account of their fathers this people remains most dear to God, for God does not repent of the gifts He makes nor of the calls He issues. But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator. In the first place amongst these there are the Muslims, who, professing to hold the faith of Abraham, along with us adore the one and merciful God, who on the last day will judge mankind. Nor is God far distant from those who in shadows and images seek the unknown God, for it is He who gives to all men life and breath and all things, and as Saviour wills that all men be saved.
Knowing, therefore, that the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, I join you in confiding the soul of your friend to the All Merciful Father…may the prayers of Abraham, our father in faith, and of the holy angels escort her to the throne of God. I assure you of my prayers for you and for all who are touched by this terrible event.

 

[In_Hoc_Signo312]

I read about this in the news, if this is the same incident.
27-year-old Tahani Mansour?

I don’t feel comfortable saying my friend’s name on here.

As someone who is non-religious, may I ask…why does this make you question whether you have any faith?

I would have thought anybody would have guessed this one already. I don’t know (nor am I sure I even want to know) how this could have happened in a world supposedly created by an all-known, all-loving God. Why didn’t He protect her more? Why didn’t he do anything to stop it? Why did this happen to her?

I’d originally said that I was uncertain of whether non-Christians reach Heaven. If, Heaven forbid, she isn’t there now, how am I supposed to continue with my life if my friend, who was by all accounts a kind and gentle soul, suffered such a horrible death, and is now suffering for all eternity? How am I supposed to continue if I don’t know, and feel as thought I need to know this? :imsorry::bighanky:

I’m guessing you have heard of these kinds of tragedies before…

Yes, I know of many of them. I know what happened to Palestina Isa in Missouri in 1989. I know what happened to Aqsa Parvez in Ontario in 2007. I know what happened to Amina and Sara Said in Texas in 2008. I know what happened to Aasiya Zubair in 2009. I know what happened to Noor Almaleki in Arizona in 2009. I know that Rifqa Bary fled her home in 2009 for fear that the same thing would happen to her. I know that this has happened too many times in the past and has now might have happened to my friend as well.

 

[puzzledtoo]

May you all be filled with loving kindness. May you all be well. May you all be peaceful and at ease. May you all be happy. Blessings.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Yes, I did guess that part.
But what I wasn’t understanding is…that there have been hundreds, thousands, and hundreds of thousands of innocent, loving, gentle souls–including children–who have been victims of violent, senseless tragedies…so I’m assuming you asked these same soul-searching questions before your dear friend’s death, too?
But before this, you did not question your faith?

Yeah. I hear you on that one.
That’s one of many reasons why religion makes no sense to a lot of people.

.

Of course the flip side to religion not making sense is the friend is dead and gone and ceases to exist. Not exactly the merciful sense making alternative.

 

[Ron_Conte]

Non-Christians can enter the state of grace by a baptism of desire, and they are thereby made true children of God by spiritual adoption. A baptism of desire can occur by perfect contrition from grave sin, or by love of God, or by love of neighbor.

“God predestines no one to go to Hell; for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end.” (CCC 1037)

Pope John Paul II: “The universality of salvation means that it is granted not only to those who explicitly believe in Christ and have entered the Church. Since salvation is offered to all, it must be made concretely available to all.” (RM 10)

 

[In_Hoc_Signo312]

But what I wasn’t understanding is…that there have been hundreds, thousands, and hundreds of thousands of innocent, loving, gentle souls–including children–who have been victims of violent, senseless tragedies…so I’m assuming you asked these same soul-searching questions before your dear friend’s death, too?

I felt that those were different. Those often happen in troubled parts of the world.

 

[NeedImprovement]

Matt 7:21 [NAB]

"Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven.

Surely someone who is " by all accounts a kind and gentle soul" , can be considered someone who does the will of the Father - a Father loves us so much.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Matt 7:21 [NAB]

Surely someone who is " by all accounts a kind and gentle soul" , can be considered someone who does the will of the Father - a Father loves us so much.

I’ve always wondered how these “kind and gentle” souls rid thier souls of mortal sins. Ignorance is always an option for some things. But not all. A soul that has never stolen, commited impure sexual acts etc…

I’m sure God can provide the necessary means as he is not bound by the sacraments he instituted but if it’s so common, why have them at all? A Catholic must confess all mortal sins even if they are a kind and gentle soul. It seems that some think it’s more likely that a person not bound by the church and not aware of the gospel has a better or equal chance of salvation as someone who has the gospel.

Which begs the question…

 

[XndrK]

I’ve always wondered how these “kind and gentle” souls rid thier souls of mortal sins. Ignorance is always an option for some things. But not all. A soul that has never stolen, commited impure sexual acts etc…

I’m sure God can provide the necessary means as he is not bound by the sacraments he instituted but if it’s so common, why have them at all? A Catholic must confess all mortal sins even if they are a kind and gentle soul. It seems that some think it’s more likely that a person not bound by the church and not aware of the gospel has a better or equal chance of salvation as someone who has the gospel.

Which begs the question…

Picky freakout: It doesn’t beg the question. Begging the question is a very specific type of logical fallacy. It prompts the question, or leads up to the question, but it doesn’t beg the question.

Okay, rant over.

God is unknowable, so we can’t know when he makes exceptions until we get there, but God promised the sacraments, so they’re a sure bet.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Picky freakout: It doesn’t beg the question. Begging the question is a very specific type of logical fallacy. It prompts the question, or leads up to the question, but it doesn’t beg the question.

Okay, rant over.

God is unknowable, so we can’t know when he makes exceptions until we get there, but God promised the sacraments, so they’re a sure bet.

It’s not a picky freak out, it’s a petty freak out.

Rant over…

 

[jtav]

Pray for the repose of her soul. God is more merciful than we’ll ever know, and we hope for the salvation of all and don’t write anyone off.

 

[BornInMarch]

Picky freakout: It doesn’t beg the question. Begging the question is a very specific type of logical fallacy. It prompts the question, or leads up to the question, but it doesn’t beg the question.

Okay, rant over.

God is unknowable, so we can’t know when he makes exceptions until we get there, but God promised the sacraments, so they’re a sure bet.

I believe that God is All-Loving. He won’t deny someone entry into Heaven over a technicality. Case in point, the links below that says people who commit mortal sins can still go to Heaven without going to Confession.

catholic.com/quickquestions/can-mortal-sins-be-forgiven-without-confessing

cathdal.org/lightisonfaq#33

 

[NeedImprovement]

I’ve always wondered how these “kind and gentle” souls rid thier souls of mortal sins…

. . .
God is unknowable, so we can’t know when he makes exceptions until we get there, but God promised the sacraments, so they’re a sure bet.

Personally, I don’t know if I could survive in this life, without the sacraments. . . thinking in particular of the sacrament of Reconciliation and the Holy Eucharist here. It leads me to wonder , in a similar manner, how other Christians and fellow Catholics who no longer avail themselves of the sacrament of Reconciliation , are able to cope - I’m firmly convinced that I would not be able to. God’s grace for each one of us has a dimension which is individualized and is surely not something we can calculate.

The posts from Withburga,* Don Ruggero* and jtav remind us that, as Catholics , we are meant to take the initiative when it comes to praying for others, and more specifically, praying for those who have already left this life.

St Padre Pio reminds us that God loves us beyond understanding, and that it is never too late to start praying for a departed soul:

From Close Encountersof a Special Kind With Padre Pio

“. . . God loves us so much. He formed us at his image. God loves us beyond understanding. And it is my belief that when we have passed from the consciousness of the world, When we appear to be dead, God, before He judges us, will give us a chance to see and understand what sin really is. And if we understand it properly, how could we fail to repent ?”

From a different page (Purgatory) at the same site

One day Padre Pio told his doctor: “I’m praying for the good death of my great great grandfather.” “But he died more than one hundred years ago!” “Remember that for God there is no past and no future, and everything is present. So God made use at that time of the prayers I’m saying now.”

The testimonials reveal that, in his concept of the timelessness of God, on most of the occasions when Padre Pio had told someone that a particular soul was “saved” , he frequently added, “** Now we have to pray for them**.” . . . :idea:

 

[Peter_J]

Dear Friends,

I’m here because of something absolutely horrific that happened recently. This past Tuesday, a friend I went to middle school with, who was a Muslim, was murdered by her own father. What happened has left me absolutely shaken. I have experienced little joy or peace since I learned about this, but instead feel as though I am in pieces now. I’m starting to ask whether I even have any faith now, to be honest with you.

A large part of this (but not all) comes from the fact that, as I said, she was Muslim. I don’t think I’ve ever heard a definitive answer whether salvation is extended to non-Christians, or how easily they can obtain it. If my friend isn’t in Heaven now, unless there is some miracle that will happen with her, I shudder to think about it. Is there any official doctrine on the Salvation of non-Christians?

Let me first say, I agree with your way of putting the question – I mean seeing the issue as someone being non-Christian (as opposed to saying non-Catholic).

My answer is, We generally don’t know a person’s fate after death, but we can trust in God’s mercy. I hope and pray that he will bring you some peace about your friend, and about the senseless tragedy she suffered during her lifetime.