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John89
Guest
I have heard many people say that no one outside the catholic church is saved, is that true ???
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Genesis315
Guest
Yes, but it doesn’t mean that only formal Catholics are saved. Here’s what the Catechism says:
846 How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers?335 Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body.
It is also Catholic teaching that Baptism is the door by which we enter the Church. We also acknowledge that if Baptism is lacking through no fault of the person, a desire for it–even an implicit desire–can suffice.
More from the Catechism:
**1260 **"Since Christ died for all, and since all men are in fact called to one and the same destiny, which is divine, we must hold that the Holy Spirit offers to all the possibility of being made partakers, in a way known to God, of the Paschal mystery."62 Every man who is ignorant of the Gospel of Christ and of his Church, but seeks the truth and does the will of God in accordance with his understanding of it, can be saved. It may be supposed that such persons would have desired Baptism explicitly if they had known its necessity.
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Mannyfit75
Guest
John,
Here is your answer straight from the Catechism of the Catholic Church.
“Outside the Church there is no salvation”
846 How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers?335 Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:
Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He **himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism **as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.336
847 This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church:
Those **who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience **- those too may achieve eternal salvation.337
848 "Although in ways known to himself God can lead those who, through no fault of their own, **are ignorant of the Gospel, to that faith without which it is impossible to please him, the Church still has the obligation **and also the sacred right to evangelize all men."338
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kenmd
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how do you reconcile that argument when Jesus and the Gospels repeatedly state that salvation is gained only by faith in Christ, not denominational identifications. The idea that someone - either Catholic or Protestant- can claim to know with certainty if another person is in a right relationship with God is extremely arrogant. Remember, we can only judge the action, not the person.
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xfrodobagginsx
Guest
Who cares what the catechism says. I only care what God’s word says. Obviously the catechism is wrong because it CONTRADICTS God’s word and God would NEVER contradict His word.
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Eileen_T
Guest
Give examples, please.
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Eileen_T
Guest
We don’t judge, God does that. Jesus founded a Church and gave it His Authority. You can read that in Scripture. He founded ONE Church, so that is the Church that continues to wield its God-given Authority.
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jmcrae
Guest
If we had real faith in Christ, we would not be afraid to be members of His Church, which is the Catholic Church, headed by St. Peter’s successor, Pope Benedict XVI.
No one is claiming any such thing. We have no idea what happens to non-Catholics when they die.
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deanarrca
Guest
First of all the catechism is a book of Catholic teaching. It gives Biblical support for the statements throughout the book. I am sure you have never used another book or others readings to help you understand scriptue? ie Moody, Scoffield your own Pastor’s teaching etc…
Secondly there are pockets of people who know nothing of the Gospel or have never even heard about Christ. The Bible clearly teaches that they have no excuse for not knowing God because God is constantly revealing himself to everyone in the world. But it also says that those who recognize that there is a God and are living Godly lives (those who in this life never were presented with the Gospel or have no knowledge of Jesus) have a chance at Salvation because of the condition of there hearts. Says so in the book of Romans.
Romans 1:19-20
19 because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.
20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.
Romans 2:14-16
14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves,
15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them,
16on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.
Same principle holds for those who recognize God and are instinctively obeying Christ’s command ie: Loving God and their Neighbor etc. (even if they have never heard of Jesus) will and can be saved. God is fair and merciful and judges the heart.
The Catechism agrees perfectly with this.
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John_Hiner
Guest
Laudatur Iesus Christus.josethekke said:
The above is the beginning of a similar discussion. There are responses in that thread which might be helpful.
Pax Christi nobiscum.
John Hiner
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