Same sex battle rages on

[Laurence_of_PA]

I edited my reply.

It has been held up by the courts that discrimination against a transsexual is NOT the same as sex discrimination.

We are considered mentally ill according to all medical communities and definitions, however we are also excluded from the ADA (Americans with Disablities Act).

So we are excluded both from Title VII and from the 1990 ADA. There are no laws at the federal level that protect me in any way shape or form.

Wait. What exactly do you mean by “transgender” or “transexual”?

Just a little curious/no offense intended.

 

[Voco_proTatiano]

My personal agenda is to prevent them from the lifestyle but not to have them worry about guilt over same sex attraction. I don’t want to see one child even think of suicide just because they find their own gender attractive. Just choose the single life in that case.

Dear Jim,
It is no business of yours to prevent, not try to prevent these unfortunates from following a lifestyle which they think best suits them.
Their lifestyle is only of concern to you IF and ONLY IF it causes harm to you, or others who do not share their lifestyle.
You might warn them of the moral danger they put themselves into, but the final judge in this case is their Creator, who gave them this cross to bear.
You cannot begin to appreceate the weight of this cross, so you cannot judge them should they fail to bear it as you feel they should.

Ask yourself: If they were extra-terestrials, with an entirely different reproductive biology, would you still judge them by straight human standards?

 

[pathia]

Wait. What exactly do you mean by “transgender” or “transexual”?

Just a little curious/no offense intended.

I am an intersexed transsexual, those are two modifiers. I will explain both.

Intersexed is the replacement term for the word ‘hermaphrodite’ which is considered offensive. When I was born, the doctor went “Congratulations, you have a perfectly healthy…(long pause)…baby!”. I was rushed into surgery a few months after my birth to patch things up, it left me numb, incapable of having sex in any fashion but it ‘looked nice’ so I wouldn’t get beaten up in the locker room. My parents were told I would develop like a completely normal boy. I did not, I developed breasts in highschool and never developed visible facial hair, or muscle mass.

That leads to Transsexual. I rejected this assignment of male from a fairly early age, though I didn’t really understand what I was doing. Most people, including my family and myself, thought I was just gay. I underwent hundreds of hours of therapy and exercises to ‘bring out my masculinity’. It completely failed and I rejected it from day one. I eventually was kicked out of the house and I began to live as a girl instead.

So, short summary. Intersexed is someone born ‘between sexes’. Transsexual is someone who was raised in one gender role, rejects that and switches to the other role.

Transgender is a more…volatile term, and I can’t really define it because it was created by crossdressers to give themselves a better name, so to speak. Some say that ‘trangender’ includes transsexuals though.

 

[KathleenElsie]

As far as I can tell the gay “agenda” essentially comes down to gay people wanting to be treated like other human beings in society. Special rights to require others to like another person no matter what they believe. Like not being fired from their job simply because they are gay (we hear this all the time but no one can point to an actual case in the last ten years as it is illegal to fire without cause in most states), being able to “marry” the person that they love and having the same rights and responsibilities as other “married” couples, not being arrested and jailed for being gay, being free from persecution and other such things that “normal” people take for granted. (marry like “normal” people? How does marriage protect children born within the marriage when no children can be conceived like in a “normal” family?)

Of course there are extreme elements involved, but that is true of every group/organization/agenda (the extrema elements are what is creating the backlash we see today. Extremism always causes the opposite of its intended effect).

 

[pathia]

we hear this all the time but no one can point to an actual case in the last ten years as it is illegal to fire without cause in most states

I guess I’m a liar then? I’ve been terminated multiple times for being an intersexed transsexual. It is not illegal in my state, therefore I cannot file any sort of claim, because it’s perfectly legal.

When something is legal, one can’t point to court cases to prove it doesn’t happen, because there is no case. I’ve contacted the ACLU about my firings, they wouldn’t take the case, because there’s no way they could possibly win!

 

[agangbern]

As far as I can tell the gay “agenda” essentally comes down to gay people wanting to be treated like other human beings in society. Like not being fired from their job simply because they are gay, being able to “marry” the person that they love and having the same rights and responsibilities as other “married” couples, not being arrested and jailed for being gay, being free from persicution and other such things that “normal” people take for granted.

Of course there are extreme elements involved, but that is true of every group/organisation/agenda.

Discrimination based on sex is prohibited by law, at least here in my country. One problem that gays confront is the fact that the Lord created only a male and a female. There are supposedly only two sexes: male or female. The law against sexual discrimination is primarily intended to protect the females. I simply don’t know how the gays could convince the Lord God that He did not create only a male and a female but also a gay. If they succeed in convincing the Lord, then so be it, let there be three sexes in this planet. But before they succeed in that, I hope they just strive their best to follow the line of males. Trying to create a third line without the Lord’s express permission is an act which insults the Lord’s will.

 

[pathia]

Discrimination based on sex is prohibited by law, at least here in my country. One problem that gays confront is the fact that the Lord created only a male and a female. There are supposedly only two sexes: male or female. The law against sexual discrimination is primarily intended to protect the females. I simply don’t know how the gays could convince the Lord God that He did not create only a male and a female but also a gay. If they succeed in convincing the Lord, then so be it, let there be three sexes in this planet. But before they succeed in that, I hope they just strive their best to follow the line of males.

He also created people like me.

How do you define male and how do you define female? Any definition you give, there are violations to that rule that occur for very real biological reasons that can be measured, examined and tested for, if not actually seen by blended genitalia such as my own.

 

[agangbern]

He also created people like me.

How do you define male and how do you define female? Any definition you give, there are violations to that rule that occur for very real biological reasons that can be measured, examined and tested for, if not actually seen by blended genitalia such as my own.

Yes, Pathia, you are also a child of God. As indicated in Genesis, female is one who from the beginning has the natural structure designed to bear a child, while male is one who from the beginning has the natural structure to beget a child. Which one of this do you have or did have, Pathia? I guess you are female.

 

[pathia]

Yes, Pathia, you are also a child of God. As indicated in Genesis, female is one who from the beginning has the natural structure designed to bear a child, while male is one who from the beginning has the natural structure to beget a child. Which one of this do you have or did have, Pathia? I guess you are female.

Neither.

 

[wifeandmomoftwo]

Yes, Pathia, you are also a child of God. As indicated in Genesis, female is one who from the beginning has the natural structure designed to bear a child, while male is one who from the beginning has the natural structure to beget a child. Which one of this do you have or did have, Pathia? I guess you are female.

you are aware that you can be born with both sex organs…hence the term intersexed.

 

[pathia]

you are aware that you can be born with both sex organs…hence the term intersexed.

I was not born with both, that is a misnomer and when it does happen it occurs only 1 in a million. I was born with neither, in between, something that is much more common. What I have is a blending of the two, neither male, nor female. I can neither father a child, nor birth a child as a mother. I have no womb, and I have no functional way to beget a child.

 

[Riley259]

I think here we are slipping into ‘special pleading’
Paul’s words and meanings are abundantly clear.
There are some humans who, without sexual release, will begin to malfunction. This is a fact of life. It is a fact accepted also by Our Lord.
Paul and Our Lord were offereing a means of directing this potentially destructive force into a productive direction.
Now obviously the option of a productive use is not available to homosexual couples, but at least they can direct that force in a non damaging direction.
It is not a good solution, but it is at least a least worst solution.
The ancient command comes to mind: ‘Firstly, do no harm!’

Do me a favor and read JP II and Chris West’s explanation of this very passage. You’re interpretation is simply wishful thinking and not at all in the spirit of Catholic teaching.

 

[Elric]

Special rights to require others to like another person no matter what they believe.

Is that right?

Thats a difficult one to enforce.

(we hear this all the time but no one can point to an actual case in the last ten years as it is illegal to fire without cause in most states)

So because you have not heard it, that means that it doesnt/didnt happen?

It was one of those “rights” that had to be fought for.

(marry like “normal” people?

Yes, that the one.

How does marriage protect children born within the marriage when no children can be conceived like in a “normal” family?)

Children?

Were we talking about having children?

(the extrema elements are what is creating the backlash we see today. Extremism always causes the opposite of its intended effect).

Oh you mean like what people like Fred Phelps does for christian religions.

Yep, extremist are attached to every affiliation.

 

[Elric]

Discrimination based on sex is prohibited by law, at least here in my country.

Umm, the term you are looking for is “sexual preference”. Gender would be something different.

One problem that gays confront is the fact that the Lord created only a male and a female. There are supposedly only two sexes: male or female. The law against sexual discrimination is primarily intended to protect the females. I simply don’t know how the gays could convince the Lord God that He did not create only a male and a female but also a gay. If they succeed in convincing the Lord, then so be it, let there be three sexes in this planet. But before they succeed in that, I hope they just strive their best to follow the line of males. Trying to create a third line without the Lord’s express permission is an act which insults the Lord’s will.

I think that gay people are well aware that there are only 2 genders, but I am not sure that you understand what “homosexual” actually means. There is no attempt to try and create a third gender, they prefer their own gender.

But hey, dont let me stand in the way of a rant.

 

[wifeandmomoftwo]

Umm, the term you are looking for is “sexual preference”. Gender would be something different.

I think that gay people are well aware that there are only 2 genders, but I am not sure that you understand what “homosexual” actually means. There is no attempt to try and create a third gender, they prefer their own gender.

But hey, dont let me stand in the way of a rant.

so if Joe Blow has a sexual preference for little children should he be protected by special laws?
if Jane Doe has a sexual preference for 4 legged animals should she be protected by special laws?.

 

[pathia]

so if Joe Blow has a sexual preference for little children should he be protected by special laws?
if Jane Doe has a sexual preference for 4 legged animals should she be protected by special laws?.

Children and animals cannot consent. They are not comparable.

 

[Elric]

so if Joe Blow has a sexual preference for little children should he be protected by special laws?
if Jane Doe has a sexual preference for 4 legged animals should she be protected by special laws?.

I should have known that was comming.

I dont think that I posed a case where they should be, did I?

 

[wifeandmomoftwo]

Children and animals cannot consent. They are not comparable.

Sure they are. Just becuase someone can not give consent does not mean that Joe and Jane should not be protected because of their sexual preferences.
I mean where does the speical treatment end Pathia? If it is good enough for one group then you better believe another group is going to demand the same special treatment!
It is a nasty circle and it never ends!!!

I should have known that was comming.

I dont think that I posed a case where they should be, did I?

Nope…I am just asking when does the special treatment stop?

 

[KathleenElsie]

Is that right?

Thats a difficult one to enforce. My point exactly. You can force anyone to approve of another persons actions of beliefs.

So because you have not heard it, that means that it doesn’t/didn’t happen? In this sue happy society of ours we would have heard and heard and heard of it.

It was one of those “rights” that had to be fought for. It is not a right. It is an option.

Yes, that the one. Marriage was protected to provide for families and the children in a consistent way. No fault divorce and free sex came in and has destabilized the idea of marriage. Thus it is that now marriage is not set but fluid and redefined as the individual would do so. The redefinition of marriage was the start of the downward trend to accepting “same sex” marriage in some places.

Children? Remember them they are the fruit of a marriage. Two persons of the same sex can not produce fruit.

Were we talking about having children? As the fruit of a marriage they are the reason for the need of stability. God made woman for man and they may be blessed with children. And no not all unions are so blessed. But, then we should leave this decision up to God for He creates the soul.

Oh you mean like what people like Fred Phelps does for Christian religions. Phelps will answer to God when his time comes. He is the other end of the spectrum that hate comes from.

Yep, extremist are attached to every affiliation. When one person is so extreme and s/he cries out loud alone we know their name. When a crowd protests we only know them by their cause.

 

[pathia]

Sure they are. Just becuase someone can not give consent does not mean that Joe and Jane should not be protected because of their sexual preferences.

Nope…I am just asking when does the special treatment stop?

Uh…consent means that any such sexual relationship would be rape. That is against the law, and no one on the left has ever spoken about repealing rape laws.

Consent stops your slippery slope argument. Consent is consent. Without consent is no longer a ‘sexual preference’ it is a RAPE. I find the comparison absurd.