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Prodigal_Son
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Two men living together is not necessarily the near occasion of sin. Especially if they have no attraction to each other.
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Joe_73
Guest
This is a quote from the 1973 us catholic bishops document(Principles to Guide Confessors in Questions of Homosexuality):
A homosexual can have an abiding relationship with another homosexual without genital sexual expression. Indeed, the deeper need of any human is for friendship rather than genital sexual expression … If a homosexual person has progressed under the direction of a confessor, but in the effort to develop a stable relationship with a given person has occasionally fallen into a sin of impurity, he should be absolved and instructed to take measures to avoid the elements which lead to sin without breaking off a friendship which has helped him grow as a person. If the relationship, however, has reached a stage where the homosexual person is not able to avoid overt actions, he should be admonished to break off the relationship.
now granted, this is pretty old, but its pretty interesting.
A homosexual can have an abiding relationship with another homosexual without genital sexual expression. Indeed, the deeper need of any human is for friendship rather than genital sexual expression … If a homosexual person has progressed under the direction of a confessor, but in the effort to develop a stable relationship with a given person has occasionally fallen into a sin of impurity, he should be absolved and instructed to take measures to avoid the elements which lead to sin without breaking off a friendship which has helped him grow as a person. If the relationship, however, has reached a stage where the homosexual person is not able to avoid overt actions, he should be admonished to break off the relationship.
now granted, this is pretty old, but its pretty interesting.
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BoomBoomMancini
Guest
Are you deliberately misunderstanding the argument, or do you genuinely not understand the difference between a sin and a disorder?To nurse it…is a sin…to put oneself in the near occasion is a sin.
Being bipolar is an unfortunate disorder, but it is not a sin.
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Irishmom2
Guest
Desire of the Everlasting Hills is a wonderful film.
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Edward_H
Guest
So here’s the “minimalism” that pops up in CA so frequently…how can we love God minimally…never maximally.
Can we find a little corner to hide our behavior behind…some matter perhaps not fully laid out to our fancy in Scripture…“there…see it says this…but it really doesn’t say that…”
It’s this lukewarm, low stretching, half-stepping, lukewarmness, search for an excuse that saps the energy of the Christian people.
Can we find a little corner to hide our behavior behind…some matter perhaps not fully laid out to our fancy in Scripture…“there…see it says this…but it really doesn’t say that…”
It’s this lukewarm, low stretching, half-stepping, lukewarmness, search for an excuse that saps the energy of the Christian people.
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Joe_73
Guest
I think attraction to the other would be OK actually provided it is not a sexually focused attraction, and they maintain reasonable boundaries. I think you meant sexual attraction though. unhealthy infatuation is something to watch out for too. But being close friends with someone is an oppurtunity to work through any unhealthy feelings in a relationship.
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Edward_H
Guest
See my point below regarding minimalism. It’s all over this site.
So now you’re trotting out bipolar to provide cover for SSA? Interesting.
So now you’re trotting out bipolar to provide cover for SSA? Interesting.
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Edward_H
Guest
Could be…if they are attracted to each it would be reasonably be considered risk and imprudent.
Being imprudent can be a sin.
Being imprudent can be a sin.
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Prodigal_Son
Guest
How could anyone be MORE on fire for Jesus than the person who casts aside all his hopes and dreams for his own personal satisfaction and throws himself at the mercy of Jesus, BEGGING him to give him something good in exchange for these beautiful dreams – perhaps delusions, but dreams nonetheless – that have filled his mind since his youth? I am in awe of exclusively gay individuals who choose to follow Jesus!So here’s the “minimalism” that pops up in CA so frequently…how can we love God minimally…never maximally.
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BoomBoomMancini
Guest
You are being incredibly callous to the struggle that people who experience SSA and are trying to live chastely face. It’s, quite frankly, gross.It’s this lukewarm, low stretching, half-stepping, lukewarmness, search for an excuse that saps the energy of the Christian people.
Yes, I’m “trotting it out” because both are “bad” but neither is the product of a conscious choice, and therefore not sinful. I mean, hell, brain cancer is a disorder too, and it’s objectively bad. Would you say someone is sinning because they have a tumor?So now you’re trotting out bipolar to provide cover for SSA? Interesting.
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Edward_H
Guest
Well that simply moves the goal line…how are mental illnesses formed…is our own behavior ever a reinforcing point to the development of them?
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Prodigal_Son
Guest
I was saying that it certainly wasn’t a problem if there was no attraction. If there is attraction, it becomes more complicated, but I can still see circumstances where I wouldn’t see it as an impediment to being friends who live together. The key question: would you be fine with someone else moving in? If the answer is no, you have a problem.I think attraction to the other would be OK actually provided it is not a sexually focused attraction. I think you meant sexual attraction though. unhealthy infatuation is something to watch out for too.
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TheLittleLady
Guest
Are you saying that SSA is a mental illness? The Church is clear that we do not know the cause.
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Rau
Guest
A fine sentiment. And while potentially applicable to the area of same sex relationships, it’s not applicable to the post to which you responded. It is not a “minimilisation” to say that to experience attractions to persons of the same sex is not sin - it is simply a fact.
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Edward_H
Guest
I knew this pat answer would come out…“callous”.
We’re speaking generically, until now civilly - you changed that, prior it never discussed this or that person…so the “callous” assertion is simply a sign that you ran out of gas. Your earlier attempt to try to assert some intellectual defect on my part was ignored.
The pattern here at CA is so predictable.
We’re speaking generically, until now civilly - you changed that, prior it never discussed this or that person…so the “callous” assertion is simply a sign that you ran out of gas. Your earlier attempt to try to assert some intellectual defect on my part was ignored.
The pattern here at CA is so predictable.
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Edward_H
Guest
To move in with another alcoholic, gambler, serial philanderer may not be the best idea.
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Edward_H
Guest
boom boom brought in bipolor.
The Church itself uses this language.
“Although the particular inclination of the homosexual person is not a sin, it is a more or less strong tendency ordered toward an intrinsic moral evil; and thus the inclination itself must be seen as an objective disorder.”
It doesn’t say mental or otherwise.
The Church itself uses this language.
“Although the particular inclination of the homosexual person is not a sin, it is a more or less strong tendency ordered toward an intrinsic moral evil; and thus the inclination itself must be seen as an objective disorder.”
It doesn’t say mental or otherwise.
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Joe_73
Guest
not always. But recovering people may be able to offer eachother mutual support. Sometimes its better to have 2 than one. If one person is struggling, the other can be there for accountability. they can mutually challenge eachother.
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Rau
Guest
Agreed. But you are rambling. That bears no connection to the statement in my post.To move in with another alcoholic, gambler, serial philanderer may not be the best idea.
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Edward_H
Guest
generally if they’re not on the wagon, not smart.
Why do we have people so earnestly searching for the narrow sliver of “ok…that’s the most you can do without sinning!!!”.
It’s incredible.
Half of CA is filled with such “how can I get by with all this stuff and still make it to heaven”.
Can you imagine a marriage that took that approach?
an employee?
why do we shoot lower with God?
Why do we have people so earnestly searching for the narrow sliver of “ok…that’s the most you can do without sinning!!!”.
It’s incredible.
Half of CA is filled with such “how can I get by with all this stuff and still make it to heaven”.
Can you imagine a marriage that took that approach?
an employee?
why do we shoot lower with God?
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