Santa Claus and friends bad for the kids?

[Suslar]

I have a 5.5 yr old. We LOVE Christmas and Easter. She knows all of the Jesus stories inside and out. We bake a cake together and bring it (with candles) to Mass on Christmas morning so she can sing to Baby Jesus. Trust me, she “gets” the reason for the season.

But, that said, we also do Santa Claus. Like someone else mentioned earlier on, she knows it’s another name for St. Nicholas and that he was a saint who helped people. So during the days of Advent, she & I decide on ways we can help St. Nicholas by doing something nice for others. Then, on Christmas morning, after Mass, she finds her three presents (only 3 because that’s how many Baby Jesus got) by the tree. She doesn’t get to dictate what she wants - St. Nicholas picks out things that are special for her to have. And she ends the day by writing a thank you note to St. Nicholas.

Not only does our tradition seem harmless, but it seems like a good way for her to understand that St. Nicholas/ Santa Clause are the spirit of love or giving. On the day she asks if it’s me leaving the gifts, you bet your boots I will say yes – and that she has been leaving gifts for people too . . . and that she will need to continue to imitate the saints . . . like St. Nicholas.

 

[jwashu]

I just don’t get the whole no Santa Clause and I don’t think it’s cool that some people keep it from their kids. Although as long as their kids can keep quite, it’s up to them as parents (that’s not a knock Jen, I’m sure people don’t think some of the things I teach my kids are cool either )

However remember that Santa Clause is based upon Saint Nicholas of Myra (who was a Bishop and is a real Saint in OUR Church). This understanding of the secret giving rather than the wanting is something the parents should be teaching their children as it’s important to the Church and comes right out of the New Testament. Sure you can go with the flow and say Santa is all about want but you can also go with the flow and say a lot of other things as well. You can even fall off the right side and say Santa is really (in a Church Lady voice)… hmmm Satan!

Culturally we celebrate both the season of giving and the birth of our Lord Jesus Christ. It’s easily proven that Christ was not born on Dec 25th yet that fact doesn’t take away from the reverence or the importance we put on that date as Christians.

Christmas, Easter etc… mean to our children what we teach them it means… they have no preconceived notion of what that big fat guy in a suit is doing. If we teach them he is giving, if we teach them about St. Nicholas then that is what they will grow up believing… and they won’t be the only kids on the block who don’t know who Santa is…

Joe

 

[estesbob]

Yes, Virginia, There is a Santa Claus

By Francis P. Church, first published in The New York Sun in 1897. [See The People’s Almanac, pp. 1358–9.]

We take pleasure in answering thus prominently the communication below, expressing at the same time our great gratification that its faithful author is numbered among the friends of The Sun:
Dear Editor—
I am 8 years old. Some of my little friends say there is no Santa Claus. Papa says, “If you see it in The Sun, it’s so.” Please tell me the truth, is there a Santa Claus?
Virginia O’Hanlon
Virginia, your little friends are wrong. They have been affected by the skepticism of a skeptical age. They do not believe except they see. They think that nothing can be which is not comprehensible by their little minds. All minds, Virginia, whether they be men’s or children’s, are little. In this great universe of ours, man is a mere insect, an ant, in his intellect as compared with the boundless world about him, as measured by the intelligence capable of grasping the whole of truth and knowledge.

Yes, Virginia, there is a Santa Claus. He exists as certainly as love and generosity and devotion exist, and you know that they abound and give to your life its highest beauty and joy. Alas! how dreary would be the world if there were no Santa Claus! It would be as dreary as if there were no Virginias. There would be no childlike faith then, no poetry, no romance to make tolerable this existence. We should have no enjoyment, except in sense and sight. The eternal light with which childhood fills the world would be extinguished.

Not believe in Santa Claus! You might as well not believe in fairies. You might get your papa to hire men to watch in all the chimneys on Christmas eve to catch Santa Claus, but even if you did not see Santa Claus coming down, what would that prove? Nobody sees Santa Claus, but that is no sign that there is no Santa Claus. The most real things in the world are those that neither children nor men can see. Did you ever see fairies dancing on the lawn? Of course not, but that’s no proof that they are not there. Nobody can conceive or imagine all the wonders there are unseen and unseeable in the world.

You tear apart the baby’s rattle and see what makes the noise inside, but there is a veil covering the unseen world which not the strongest man, nor even the united strength of all the strongest men that ever lived could tear apart. Only faith, poetry, love, romance, can push aside that curtain and view and picture the supernal beauty and glory beyond. Is it all real? Ah, Virginia, in all this world there is nothing else real and abiding.

No Santa Claus! Thank God! he lives and lives forever. A thousand years from now, Virginia, nay 10 times 10,000 years from now, he will continue to make glad the heart of childhood.

 

[Jennifer_J]

I just don’t get the whole no Santa Clause and I don’t think it’s cool that some people keep it from their kids. Although as long as their kids can keep quite, it’s up to them as parents (that’s not a knock Jen, I’m sure people don’t think some of the things I teach my kids are cool either )

However remember that Santa Clause is based upon Saint Nicholas of Myra (who was a Bishop and is a real Saint in OUR Church). This understanding of the secret giving rather than the wanting is something the parents should be teaching their children as it’s important to the Church and comes right out of the New Testament. Sure you can go with the flow and say Santa is all about want but you can also go with the flow and say a lot of other things as well. You can even fall off the right side and say Santa is really (in a Church Lady voice)… hmmm Satan!

Culturally we celebrate both the season of giving and the birth of our Lord Jesus Christ. It’s easily proven that Christ was not born on Dec 25th yet that fact doesn’t take away from the reverence or the importance we put on that date as Christians.

Christmas, Easter etc… mean to our children what we teach them it means… they have no preconceived notion of what that big fat guy in a suit is doing. If we teach them he is giving, if we teach them about St. Nicholas then that is what they will grow up believing… and they won’t be the only kids on the block who don’t know who Santa is…

Joe

Let me try to 'splain this again. I was brought up with very little in the way of religion or faith. We were very secular. Santa and the Easter Bunny were what the holidays were about. It was empty and the holidays were all about getting (and giving, but mostly getting as a child). Each holiday was a huge let down after the ripping open of gifts…

I don’t want that for my children–I want it to mean more. So we de-emphasise or refocus Santa to St Nicholas–we celebrate his feast day and talk about his giving. We do an advent calendar and wreath. We keep advent as advent-y as possible (ie I hold out on the Christmas music as long as I can, which is very hard for me!). We put up a tree and exchange gifts on Christmas (after Mass). We even put up stockings (we talk about the stocking thing on St Nicholas day), but Santa takes a huge back seat. The children know the day is honoring the birth of Christ. We adopt a family through a giving tree at the kids school.

Please remember I had nothing to draw on from my childhood–no role model, no religious traditions. It was easier to just let go of Santa. I know not everyone can understand this, but the secular focus on Santa was damaging to me. I’m happy so many of you can do it and give it more meaning. I couldn’t figure out how to do it. I’m grateful that the Catholic Church has so many rich traditions that I can draw on to make holidays so much more meaningful.

 

[SMHW]

Let me try to 'splain this again. I was brought up with very little in the way of religion or faith. We were very secular. Santa and the Easter Bunny were what the holidays were about. It was empty and the holidays were all about getting (and giving, but mostly getting as a child). Each holiday was a huge let down after the ripping open of gifts…

I don’t want that for my children–I want it to mean more. So we de-emphasise or refocus Santa to St Nicholas–we celebrate his feast day and talk about his giving. We do an advent calendar and wreath. We keep advent as advent-y as possible (ie I hold out on the Christmas music as long as I can, which is very hard for me!). We put up a tree and exchange gifts on Christmas (after Mass). We even put up stockings (we talk about the stocking thing on St Nicholas day), but Santa takes a huge back seat. The children know the day is honoring the birth of Christ. We adopt a family through a giving tree at the kids school.

Please remember I had nothing to draw on from my childhood–no role model, no religious traditions. It was easier to just let go of Santa. I know not everyone can understand this, but the secular focus on Santa was damaging to me. I’m happy so many of you can do it and give it more meaning. I couldn’t figure out how to do it. I’m grateful that the Catholic Church has so many rich traditions that I can draw on to make holidays so much more meaningful.

I’m a Santa lover but I can appreciate this.

(I grew up in a family that emphasized all the secular aspects of Christmas and Easter but it was also a given that these were RELIGIOUS days and everything else was scheduled around Mass.)

 

[dixieagle]

This hot topic again!!!

We were pretty upfront about the Easter Bunny (how did THAT get started, anyway?) and the Tooth Fairy, treating them jokingly, but Santa Claus was rather a big deal. As my husband’s family background is Eastern European/Byzantine Catholic, St. Nicholas was quite significant to him. So, we always taught about St. Nick and celebrated his feast day, leaving shoes out to be filled with small goodies, etc. And, we also stressed that Santa was, indeed, St. Nicholas.

Of course, we also did the Advent wreath, Advent calendar, and the main focus was always Baby Jesus.

I think that the St. Nicholas emphasis, and the fact that the girls knew he was a real bishop, eased the transition to knowing the truth about Santa, when the time came. They knew it wasn’t just a made-up concept. But, each family must decide what’s best for them (just make sure your kids don’t spoil it for anyone else.)

 

[shannyk]

I was pro Santa as recently as the very last time we had this topic come up. If you look up the old threads on it you’ll see me debating on Santa’s/St Nick’s side. Because of the very wise insight of my 11 yr old I’ve changed my mind. Last year she finally came out and asked me point blank about Santa (whom I’d always been VERY careful to relate to St. Nick) and admitted she’d suspected since the previous Christmas that Santa doesn’t bring presents, mom does, but was hoping she was wrong. When I told her the truth she said

“well why did you LIE to me”?





Good question. Why did I lie? (And yes, I did just that. Anyone who tells their child that Santa brings gifts on Christmas Eve is lying. Whether you’re comfortable with that or not is your decision to make) And my answer is, I really don’t know why. Probably ‘peer pressure’ from other adults and family is my best lame excuse. That’s it. :blush:

My DD went on to explain that if she had just known from the beginning that Santa is a story and we get presents from parents on Christmas, there would have been nothing to be disappointed in nor would she have to wrestle with the fact that I lied to her for years. She also said that she would have been better able to focus on the REAL excitement of Christmas if I hadn’t keep up with the oooooh Santa is coming soon charade.

You know I just couldn’t argue with her. She’s right. It’s one thing to go back and remember my own childhood but it’s another thing when you’re confronted with your own kids perspectives, which aren’t your own. It’s pretty humbling.

We dropped Santa except for in books and movies which we won’t avoid this Christmas, but the character of Santa will stay in the book and in the imagination where he belongs, just like Frog and Toad, and The Wild Things, and Thomas the Tank Engine. I’ve explained the whole thing to my now 5 yr old and she’s not crushed and she’s still excited about Christmas. When I told her she was going to get presents under the tree from me and NOT Santa, she said " I’m going to put a present under the tree for you too Mamma!". She didn’t seem too upset

I’m completely comfortable with this decision. I guess I’m uncool for yet another reason now:shrug:

(For what it’s worth I’ve never done the tooth fairy or Easter Bunny:shrug

 

[BrokenFortress]

I don’t have children as of yet, but when I do, I will not tell them that Santa brings their Christmas presents. Nor that the Easter Bunny hides eggs or that a Tooth Fairy takes their old teeth.

Yes, I was told all these things as a child and I believed them. But I remember being so disappointed when I found out. And even now I remember thinking about being lied to, I was very sad about it all.

So, no, I will not tell them these things. I will tell them the story of St. Nicholas, but I will not say that a Santa comes down the chimney and brings them presents or any of those other such stories.

I don’t look down on the parents that do tell these things, so I expect the same respect. It’s up to each parent to decide what they want to teach their children.

I just personally don’t see the point. Sure, children love the idea of Santa bringing them presents, but I think any child will love the idea of presents anyways! They don’t really care who brings them. If you put them under the tree I can guarantee that they won’t be disappointed that a Santa didn’t put them there, that you did. They’re just happy with presents!

Just my thoughts on it!

 

[_Jenn]

This? Already? LOL

I usually stay out of this sort of discussion, but I feel like “biting” tonight.

I don’t, and will never, get the whole “I was so traumatized by my parents lying to me that I will never put my kids through that” argument. I very clearly remember figuring it out (on my own, 2nd or 3rd grade - kept it to myself until I decided to approach my mom). Told her what I thought, she confirmed it, and then promptly delivered the “if you ruin this for your little sister, I will kill you” speech. I never felt lied to, never was upset, it was just a rite of passage on the road of growing up, IMO.

We “do” all 3 for our son. Although, I highly suspect this will be our last year of him truly believing (he’s 7). Heck, I think he was on the fence last year about Santa, and while he’s never said anything, I don’t think he’s truly bought into the whole Easter bunny charade. Finally lost his first tooth 2 weeks ago, so I was just glad he lost at least one before figuring that one out. haha

If he approaches me, I’ll give him the truth. If not, he’s free to believe as long as he wants to. I know that I still get presents from Santa.

 

[Kit15]

Even after we all knew, my parents still continued to give their Christmas gifts to us “Santa style”. Mainly because of the warm fuzzy family feeling it tended to generate. It may have been magical to us back in the days when we really did believe that Santa gave us those gifts. But I think it was something magical for my parents too.

I guess part of it was because they had 5 children spaced over 10 years. After I “learned the truth” (my mom was a great Santa but a lousy tooth fairy…I eventually figured it out and also suffered minimal trauma) I was expected to help my parents keep the wonder going for my siblings…which I did. It was kinda cool actually as it spawned one of our greatest traditions. To keep my siblings from accidentally discovering what was going on, mom had us all sleep in the same bedroom to keep each other company in case someone woke up super early. If someone needed to use the toilet, they needed to be accompanied by an older sibling so they wouldn’t go snooping.

Then one by one we all “grew up” and it was 4 of us trying to keep the youngest going. Then she “grew up” as well…and no one really wanted it to end. If there was no Santa…then my brother and sisters and I would no longer have a reason to cram like sardines into one bedroom, play Christmas music all night, and talk until we passed out. We only did this one night of the year. It was our ultimate bonding session and I wouldn’t have traded that for anything. Then in the morning, a bunch of teens and young 20-somethings come down the stairs to see what’s under the tree and to give our gifts to our parents. It keeps us all feeling young. I admit I miss it now that I’m out of the house.

Last Christmas Eve was my first one not spent as a sardine…it was rather bittersweet and I suddenly felt really…old. It doesn’t help that DH is somewhat of a Grinch!

We still do “Easter Bunny” too. We’re hardcore competitive egg hunters.

Did it get in the way of our understanding of the true meaning of Christmas? No. My parents would always read us a Nativity bedtime story on Christmas and a few times throughout December. For the first few years they tried to read it to me on Christmas Eve but I always insisted on “The Night Before Christmas” because it was the night before Christmas…DUH! I don’t remember ever doubting the existence of God after learning about Santa and the Easter Bunny. God…was presented to me in a completely different way. So when I learned the truth about Santa…it never occurred to me to consider that God might not be real either. I knew, somehow, the difference between God and Santa.

I know someone who tells his son that the Baby Jesus comes and leaves presents under the tree and that Santa isn’t real. Okay fine…Jesus is real and Santa Claus is not…but I’m a little nervous over what he’s going to think about baby Jesus once he learns the truth. I can just imagine him coming to the conclusion that Jesus isn’t real either.

 

[BrokenFortress]

I don’t, and will never, get the whole “I was so traumatized by my parents lying to me that I will never put my kids through that” argument.

You may not get it, but it doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen.

Like I said, I respect those who want to tell their kids there’s a Santa, I just expect the same respect also. It’s only fair.

As I also said, I just don’t see the point. Kids will be happy no matter who brings them presents.

I do agree though that saying Baby Jesus brings them is a bit much…

 

[happymommy]

I do agree though that saying Baby Jesus brings them is a bit much…

Sneaks out of hiding…glad this thread is still nice, but I’m watching you all!npatrol:

The way we have done it is to say that Jesus wants us all to share in His birthday and Santa is so very giving, that he brings us gifts so that we can be a part of Jesus’ birthday party too. I still get gifts from Santa!! I don’t want to grow up!! It’s fun, but our holiday season (not just one day) is all about Jesus!!

I remember asking about Santa as a kid. I wasn’t upset about it. But everyone is different.

Oh, and with baby #4 due mid December we are decorating the second week of November!! That way it’s done, I can sit and enjoy it and won’t have boxes everywhere if little one decides to show up before we are done!!

Okay, I’ll go hide again:christmastree1:

 

[BrokenFortress]

haha! Well, I just think that no one should get upset one way or another. There’s not really a wrong way to do it. If you want to tell your kids there’s a Santa, that’s fine! But it’s also fine not to

 

[pnewton]

Isn’t it a little early for this thread? It isn’t even November yet! But then again, I’m not sure this topic came up last year so maybe it IS time for it.

Maybe he went to s store that was starting to put up its decoration and play Christmas carols.

Pro- Santa dad here, BTW.

 

[purplesunshine]

I think that Santa Claus is part of the fun for young children. It also takes the pressure off of parents to provide everything for the kids. If they want something they can “ask santa” and if they don’t get it it’s “santa’s fault.”

Even as a kid I baught into the idea of good will. I never got the Easter bunny. We had rabbits and bunnies in our back yard and even at 3 or 4 I just KNEW that they didn’t bring any basket. Although, for a while I was convinced they brought toothbrushes.

As far as the toothfairy. I don’t know if I believed in a vary per-se but I did believe that SOMETHING took my teeth and I left it ransom notes No babies would get my teeth until she told me where she lived.

Honestly, I was much more devastated when I found out Snuffalupugus wasn’t real but a figment of Big Bird’s imagination.

 

[Matrix_Refugee]

I’ll admit to being “agnostic” about Santa Claus: I was a weird kid who was terrified of men with heavy beards, so the traditional image of Santa freaked me out; thus “the Christmas Angel” brought presents to our house at Christmas. When I got older (about ten or twelve, believe it or not – an age when most kids are outgrowing Santa), we started the tradition of leaving teeny little presents in each other’s shoes on St. Nicholas’s feast day (December 6th). I even found a lovely statue of St. Nicholas at a Catholic book and gift shop which sort of makes him look a little like Santa Claus: he’s wearing a bishop’s miter and carrying a crosier, but he’s also dressed in red robes and in the crook of his arm, he’s carrying several wrapped packages, plus a little boy and girl are standing with him, holding toys and looking up at him gratefully.

 

[whatevergirl]

I’ll admit to being “agnostic” about Santa Claus: I was a weird kid who was terrified of men with heavy beards, so the traditional image of Santa freaked me out; thus “the Christmas Angel” brought presents to our house at Christmas. When I got older (about ten or twelve, believe it or not – an age when most kids are outgrowing Santa), we started the tradition of leaving teeny little presents in each other’s shoes on St. Nicholas’s feast day (December 6th). I even found a lovely statue of St. Nicholas at a Catholic book and gift shop which sort of makes him look a little like Santa Claus: he’s wearing a bishop’s miter and carrying a crosier, but he’s also dressed in red robes and in the crook of his arm, he’s carrying several wrapped packages, plus a little boy and girl are standing with him, holding toys and looking up at him gratefully.

‘‘agnostic’’ about santa…I like that.

 

[Matrix_Refugee]

‘‘agnostic’’ about santa…I like that.

:: Giggles:: Hee, yeah, I may not believe in him per se, but I always respect those who do. Hey, I even watch NORAD’s “Santa Tracker” on Christmas Eve since it’s neat to watch.

 

[_Jenn]

You may not get it, but it doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen.

Like I said, I respect those who want to tell their kids there’s a Santa, I just expect the same respect also. It’s only fair.

As I also said, I just don’t see the point. Kids will be happy no matter who brings them presents.

I do agree though that saying Baby Jesus brings them is a bit much…

I respect the other side as well. Just saying that I don’t “get” the argument.

What I don’t like is the parents (and I know it’s not all) who when telling their kids that Santa isn’t real, don’t bother to also teach their kids to respect the kids who do believe. I’ve seen many a kid (when I was teaching in schools/daycares) cause a real issue by telling a peer “You do know that Santa isn’t real, don’t you? And it’s true because my mom said so.”

I think (or I’d like to think) that most parents talk with their kids and ask them not to spoil it for other kids and explain that some parents don’t tell their kids the same thing. But there are some who don’t.

 

[Jennifer_J]

I respect the other side as well. Just saying that I don’t “get” the argument.

What I don’t like is the parents (and I know it’s not all) who when telling their kids that Santa isn’t real, don’t bother to also teach their kids to respect the kids who do believe. I’ve seen many a kid (when I was teaching in schools/daycares) cause a real issue by telling a peer “You do know that Santa isn’t real, don’t you? And it’s true because my mom said so.”

I think (or I’d like to think) that most parents talk with their kids and ask them not to spoil it for other kids and explain that some parents don’t tell their kids the same thing. But there are some who don’t.

And this doesn’t necessarily come from people who don’t do Santa, it comes from the Santa believing families as well and I would say, mostly. Some kids just can’t not share the info they have that was a “secret”, and I imagine it comes MORE from those who “discover” that there is no Santa then from those brought up not focusing on Santa. It’s always more fun to share the “forbidden”.