Santa Claus is blasphemous

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My wife and I have three young kids and we use Santa Claus as a teaching tool. We teach our kids that the name Santa Claus comes from the name St. Nicholas and we teach them about his history as a bishop and his saintly works. He teach them about his giving nature and how he was fiercely devoted to God. My wife and I use Santa as a compass that points to Christ. The example and message that Santa provides is easy for small children to grasp when used as a tool to highlight the birth of Jesus it makes it easier for kids to understand the unseen and mystical. IMO the complexity of Jesus’ birth, life, death, and resurrection are too much for a small child to fully understand. Santa (aka St. Nick) provides a good starting point in faith education and understanding and with correct focus it can illuminate the great gift that was Jesus Christ. With the aid of the myth/cultural tradition/historical figure of Santa Claus the focus of Christmas remains on Jesus as it should and my children get to experience something wonderful.
 
stanczyk said:
Well sure, telling children about the real Saint Nicholas is hardly a lie. But I was talking about Santa Claus, the fictional character who lives at the North Pole with elves and flying reindeer. Santa Claus might be based on St. Nicholas, but they are not identical.

I did read you post and I thought it was very insightful. I’d encourage you to read my posts, because I think we are in total agreement.
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I agree with the CCC’s definition of lying. However, here I think is the point of contention:
in order to lead someone into error.
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Most parents would never say they are intentionally deceiving their children. Yes, Santa Claus is not real. Neither is the Ugly Duckling, Snow White, Rumpelstiltskin, or (according to the notes in my New American Bible, so take it with a grain of salt) the Books of Tobit and Judith in the Bible.

BUT people tell their children these stories not because of the verity of the situation, but because of the underlying moral truth. Santa, for example, teaches us that generosity makes others feel good, and when we are generous, we feel pretty good, too. Also, we ought to behave, or else we will not be rewarded.

In the words of G.K. Chesterton, “Fairy Tales are more than true; not because they tell us that dragons exist, but because they tell us that dragons can be beaten.”

HOWEVER, given the special situation of Santa - in that he’s no longer just a mythical figure, but almost the central figure, tantamount to the Baby Jesus, of the non-Christian “Winter Holiday”, I can certainly understand your and others’ feelings. And Santa must be made the servant of the Baby Jesus. Something like this:



I don’t think it is sinful to tell children about Santa. But unless we relay it back to Jesus, it will be counterproductive to developing healthy Christian faith.

I also see nothing completely wrong with telling our children about Santa because, in a way - not the way atheists make it out to be, though - he is analogous to God.When we were young, we used to believe God really was a big, old man with a long white beard (as the atheists would make Him out to be). That was because we could not understand or accept God in His true form. Most of us still can’t understand God’s infinity or being outside of the universe. But we can accept it.

Yes, we could understand Saint Nicholas as he really is when we are children. But I don’t think children much understand the wonder of Heaven, when candy and toys are so much more entertaining here and now, much less the power Saint Nicholas has when he’s not on Earth physically anymore.

Santa Claus, if we as Christians wield him properly, can segueway into Saint Nicholas, just as the “old guy in the clouds” can segue into the infinite, eternal, living God. We can use things that children grasp easier to lead them into deeper truths. It would also make the transition from “Santa is real” to “We lied to you” much, much less jarring, and it still leaves the kids with something to believe in, that is real.

I do believe teaching kids Santa is real and then telling them he is not is a very bad idea, analogous to telling kids God is a big, powerful man in the sky and then telling us He doesn’t exist.
 
Words have meaning.

Check the definition of blasphemy.

Even a secularized Santa Claus is in no way blasphemous. But he is a saint, make no mistake about it. Saint Nicholas is one of my favorite saints.
 
triumphguy said:
Folklore isn’t a lie, fairy tales aren’t a lie, local/national traditions aren’t a lie, Santa isn’t a lie.
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Folklore, fair tales, local/national traditions and Santa are all lies if and when they are presented a fact for the purpose of deceiving another into believing that they are true.
 
Your life is going quite well if you spend time complaining about Santa Claus being a myth or sinful. Nothing else to complain about? Quick! Let’s complain about Santa Claus!
 
I have known children that think Christmas day is santa’s birthday and even Catholic children who think midnight Mass is something to do with santa and not Jesus.

Just make sure your children understand about Jesus and that he is the most important, santa can be fun for some.
 
bmullins said:
Do you consider lying in order to save a life anywhere near on par with telling a child that Santa is real? While I see no harm in children believing in Santa Claus, I also don’t see those two as anywhere near the same.

A moral action has three parts:

objective act (what we do)
subjective goal (intention, why we do it)
concrete situations or cicrumstances (when, where, how, with whom, etc)

All three determine if it is bad. The subjective goal of lying to someone to keep someone from being killed is much different than whatever goal lying about Santa Claus is for. What is the subjective goal of lying to our children? I don’t mind those who simply don’t tell them that Santa isn’t real, but what about those who tell their kids things like “If you don’t believe in Santa, you won’t get any presents.” etc.
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Santa Claus is real. I don’t get your problem with him.
 
kbwall said:
I see a lot whining in this topic. Nobody has even addressed the fact that it is clearly a lie. Sure, you can try to get around my point about Santa leading people astray, and you might even be right. But nobody has even challenged it’s a lie. Last I checked, lies were still sin, even if you’re lying to children.
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I don’t have time to read all posts in this thread, but I will assume for the sake of argument that your challenge still stands.

I will address this point, from a Platonic philosophical viewpoint.

As a newspaper editor once said, nobody has seen Santa Claus. But can you deny that the idea exists? Or that it has a preponderance of positive connotations for most people? No, you can’t.

The idea persists. The idea, and the “ideality” of that idea, is quite real—apparently indestructible, evidenced by the fact that the debate goes on and on, and there are always people who defend the idea of Santa Claus.

And even if the last believer in Santa Claus recanted that belief, or died and took belief in Santa Claus out of the world of men, the idea (in all its archetypal glory) would persist in the mind of God. You know He never forgets anything. He is the repository of all ideals and archetypes, the thing that Plato was groping toward when he postulated the concept of “the ideal.”

In that shining, unchanging, indestructible place, Santa Claus and all the love and good feelings that have always trailed along after him, still exists and always will.

“Yes, Virginia, there IS a Santa Claus.”
 
colmywaykurtz said:
I don’t have time to read all posts in this thread, but I will assume for the sake of argument that your challenge still stands.

I will address this point, from a Platonic philosophical viewpoint.

As a newspaper editor once said, nobody has seen Santa Claus. But can you deny that the idea exists? Or that it has a preponderance of positive connotations for most people? No, you can’t.

The idea persists. The idea, and the “ideality” of that idea, is quite real—apparently indestructible, evidenced by the fact that the debate goes on and on, and there are always people who defend the idea of Santa Claus.

And even if the last believer in Santa Claus recanted that belief, or died and took belief in Santa Claus out of the world of men, the idea (in all its archetypal glory) would persist in the mind of God. You know He never forgets anything. He is the repository of all ideals and archetypes, the thing that Plato was groping toward when he postulated the concept of “the ideal.”

In that shining, unchanging, indestructible place, Santa Claus and all the love and good feelings that have always trailed along after him, still exists and always will.

“Yes, Virginia, there IS a Santa Claus.”
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And his footprints were captured in talcum powder put down by my kids.
So there…😃
 
TarkanAttila said:
I agree with the CCC’s definition of lying. However, here I think is the point of contention:

Most parents would never say they are intentionally deceiving their children. Yes, Santa Claus is not real. Neither is the Ugly Duckling, Snow White, Rumpelstiltskin, or (according to the notes in my New American Bible, so take it with a grain of salt) the Books of Tobit and Judith in the Bible.

BUT people tell their children these stories not because of the verity of the situation, but because of the underlying moral truth. Santa, for example, teaches us that generosity makes others feel good, and when we are generous, we feel pretty good, too. Also, we ought to behave, or else we will not be rewarded.

In the words of G.K. Chesterton, “Fairy Tales are more than true; not because they tell us that dragons exist, but because they tell us that dragons can be beaten.”

HOWEVER, given the special situation of Santa - in that he’s no longer just a mythical figure, but almost the central figure, tantamount to the Baby Jesus, of the non-Christian “Winter Holiday”, I can certainly understand your and others’ feelings. And Santa must be made the servant of the Baby Jesus. Something like this:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-q4wsqzr6n...FNyrE/s400/Santa+kneeling+over+baby+Jesus.jpg

I don’t think it is sinful to tell children about Santa. But unless we relay it back to Jesus, it will be counterproductive to developing healthy Christian faith.

I also see nothing completely wrong with telling our children about Santa because, in a way - not the way atheists make it out to be, though - he is analogous to God.When we were young, we used to believe God really was a big, old man with a long white beard (as the atheists would make Him out to be). That was because we could not understand or accept God in His true form. Most of us still can’t understand God’s infinity or being outside of the universe. But we can accept it.

Yes, we could understand Saint Nicholas as he really is when we are children. But I don’t think children much understand the wonder of Heaven, when candy and toys are so much more entertaining here and now, much less the power Saint Nicholas has when he’s not on Earth physically anymore.

Santa Claus, if we as Christians wield him properly, can segueway into Saint Nicholas, just as the “old guy in the clouds” can segue into the infinite, eternal, living God. We can use things that children grasp easier to lead them into deeper truths. It would also make the transition from “Santa is real” to “We lied to you” much, much less jarring, and it still leaves the kids with something to believe in, that is real.

I do believe teaching kids Santa is real and then telling them he is not is a very bad idea, analogous to telling kids God is a big, powerful man in the sky and then telling us He doesn’t exist.
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My daughter and I both got a bit misty-eyed looking at that wonderful image there. Thank you for posting it. 🙂
 
Rascalking said:
Your life is going quite well if you spend time complaining about Santa Claus being a myth or sinful. Nothing else to complain about? Quick! Let’s complain about Santa Claus!
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Your life is so good that you’re complaining about people complaining about Santa Claus.

Sounds like we all have a lot to be thankful for.
 
Nelka said:
I have known children that think Christmas day is santa’s birthday and even Catholic children who think midnight Mass is something to do with santa and not Jesus.

Just make sure your children understand about Jesus and that he is the most important, santa can be fun for some.
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Are you certain the kids aren’t being funny when they say this? My 18 year old stated quite loudly as we walked into midnight mass, “exactly what time was Santa born again?”. He was being funny and making a joke. Someone who was not familiar with his sense of humor would likely go home and say, “Those kids are so poorly catechized that they think Christmas is santas birthday!”. :rolleyes:
 
stanczyk said:
Your life is so good that you’re complaining about people complaining about Santa Claus.

Sounds like we all have a lot to be thankful for.
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And now YOU’RE complaining about people complaining about people who complain about Santa Claus! 😃

Honestly, this could go on forever…:rolleyes:
 
stanczyk said:
Your life is so good that you’re complaining about people complaining about Santa Claus.
.
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Guess so, but if you feel the need to throw darts in someones ballon about their belief in Santa Claus-your probably doing quite well if that’s what you spend your time complaining about.
 
Rascalking said:
Guess so, but if you feel the need to throw darts in someones ballon about their belief in Santa Claus-your probably doing quite well if that’s what you spend your time complaining about.
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I think you need to chill out. Santa Claus is a lie, that much is a fact. The tradition is an absurd fiction, possibly dangerous to a child’s faith-formation, and borders on idolatrous. Santa Claus distracts from Christ. These are all facts.

Is it a sin to lie to children about Santa Claus? As I said earlier in the thread, that is not for me to judge. So I am hardly “throwing darts.” You might want to examine your own behavior in that regard. God bless.
 
TarkanAttila said:
And now YOU’RE complaining about people complaining about people who complain about Santa Claus! 😃

Honestly, this could go on forever…:rolleyes:
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Well, yes it could. It was a silly line of thought to begin with.

This is a fair and reasonable discussion about the merits of belief in Santa Claus. Everybody should be able to participate, whatever side of the argument they are on, and not be criticized for their mere participation in the discussion.
 
stanczyk said:
I think you need to chill out. Santa Claus is a lie, that much is a fact. The tradition is an absurd fiction, possibly dangerous to a child’s faith-formation, and borders on idolatrous. Santa Claus distracts from Christ. These are all facts.

Is it a sin to lie to children about Santa Claus? As I said earlier in the thread, that is not for me to judge. So I am hardly “throwing darts.” You might want to examine your own behavior in that regard. God bless.
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I need to chill out? Um…okay. How excatly am I getting excited? I’m not the one saying it’s hurtful to to Christ or anything else.

Santa Claus is a wonderful and glorious belief. Those who deny that to their children are missing out on something truly magical. Their are priests who talk about Santa to children after mass.

I’m not going to change your mind. If you really feel this way, I feel sorry for you-but knock yourself out. I’ll still manage to check my behavior-and while I admit I’m not perfect, the fact that I believe in Santa and strongly support that belief for others is of zero concern for me. Maybe I’ll tell my confessor about that-I’m sure it’s a sure fire mortal sin.

That “chill” enough for you? 😃
 
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