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chemoangel
Guest
As catholics in my family we were allowed to believe in everything from Santa and the easter bunny to the tooth fairy and beyond.
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PatriceA
Guest
We didn’t forbid our daughter from believing, but we didn’t actively encourage it either. We did tell her Santa was just like Big Bird or Blue from Blue’s Clues. Make believe and how much she wanted to believe, we let her set the pace. But Jesus was/is always emphasized to be real, we purposely made a distinction between Santa being make believe and Jesus being the real deal. We also stressed the gifts came from us and the rest of the family,
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Phish_Phan
Guest
Every year at my Church on the Christmas Eve Mass, all the children gather to the altar and the Priest reads them the story of the birth of Christ. Then at the end of the story the pianist plays happy birthday and Santa Clause walks down the aisle with a birthday cake. It’s bringing tears of nostalgia to my eyes just thinking about it 
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mary_bobo
Guest
Don’t you just love these busy-bodies who feel it is their duty to inform all as to their way of thinking? That is not the place of anyone but the parents to carry on whatever is traditional in their family. Kids catch on quick enough and I have never seen any harm in their believing in Santa. You can still tell the story of the real Christmas and have a creche in the home.
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tafan
Guest
And I can’t help but feel a little sorry for your kids, and for the fiance’ of the OP. Catholics should not be skeptics. Santa Claus is a wonderful way to instill in kids the very idea of the supernatural. Our world denies the supernatural, our faith rejoices in it. Let kids believe in it, have fun with it, see the joy of it all.
And who says those gifts, we buy for those kids secretly,sneak into the living room on Christmas Eve after they have gone to bed, do not come from St Nick. He is a real saint, he exists. Our material blessings are gifts from God. Perhaps, those particular material blessings originate as a prayer, on our behalf, from St Nick to God. Nothing in our Catholic faith would prevent us from believing this.
Yes, there is a Santa Claus, and I want my kids, when they are little, to believe in him with all the fairytell trappings!!! The sleigh, the reindeer, the elves, the North Pole, all of it. And when they are bigger, to know that there is a supernatural part of our existence and to easily accept this.
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John21652
Guest
You’re forgetting who has the red nose!Just immagine if everyone left a beer for Santa. He would be driving drunk and endagering the reindeer!
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andrewstx
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ZhaneAugustine
Guest
ROFLMAO yes, that’s what old Saint Nick needs in his PR department, for everyone to leave beer out for him!OH! I absolutely LOVE this idea!How do I convince my wife and kids that this a better option than milk?
News Reporter Well kids, we HAVE seen Santa heading this way… but… for some reason he seems to be flying very irrationanl!
Oh my, I got one better, how is a police officer ever going to catch ol St. Nick to ask him if he’s been drinking while on the job or flying?!
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ZhaneAugustine
Guest
At our house we have santa.
And even at my age of 36 years I still believe in the good saint. Of course I have a theory that God allows St. Nicolas to go to earth and deliver some kind of gift to the poorest of the poor somewhere in the world. so as to give the poor children and their family hope.
And even at my age of 36 years I still believe in the good saint. Of course I have a theory that God allows St. Nicolas to go to earth and deliver some kind of gift to the poorest of the poor somewhere in the world. so as to give the poor children and their family hope.
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DaveBj
Guest
My kids turned out just fine, thank you. They’re in their upper 30s and both employed, productive citizens. And I did say to enjoy the myth, but always bear in mind that Santa, like Cinderella is a story. (St. Nicholas is not a story, but there is very little of him in Santa Clause.)
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tafan
Guest
I am sure they did. I can still feel sorry for them as toddlers, for not having the awe and wonder of expecting Santa. I am sure they came to believe in the supernatural in their own way, certainly Santa is not required for that, but it is a big help. And I see quite a bit of St Nick in the Santa Claus of modern times. A man who gives, and gives, and gives; seemingly limitlessly… A man who wants there to be a little bit of mystery to his giving. A man who loves Christmas.
“Fairy Tales are more than true; not because they tell us that dragons exist, but because they tell us that dragons can be beaten” - G.K. Chesterton
Would be pretty easy to apply that to Santa Claus, IMO.
“Fairy Tales are more than true; not because they tell us that dragons exist, but because they tell us that dragons can be beaten” - G.K. Chesterton
Would be pretty easy to apply that to Santa Claus, IMO.
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Calgar
Guest
My children get visits from santa and the easter bunny, but they have known from day one that it’s just make believe.
I just don’t see the purpose behind lying to them. Just as much fun is had even when they know it’s just a story.
I just don’t see the purpose behind lying to them. Just as much fun is had even when they know it’s just a story.
Why the Easter bunny? It’s pagan! A symbol of fertility and nothing to do with the Passion of Christ.
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John21652
Guest
Leaving a beer out for Santa is an Australian tradition.
The story goes that you northern hemisphere types gave Santa milk. Santa, unbeknownst to you, actually gave the milk to Rudolph. Milk is notorious for causing flatulence in reindeed and that’s how Rudolph found his propulsion.
However, Downunder research found that Australian beer, due to its magical and mystical qualities, was a far better producer of propulsive energy when fed to reindeer. What really swung it was that the beer gave a more consistent and more predictable propulsive energy and Santa was able to stick to his demanding schedule with greater ease. Milk, you see, caused Rudolp to stop and start.
There was an unexpected side effect of this new technology. Rudolph’s nose shone brighter than ever and Santa was even able to navigate through big cities, despite the lights blocking the stars which he uses for navigation.
So, always leave a beer or two out for Santa.
Trust me, it makes for a jollier Christmas!
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DaveBj
Guest
When the kids were toddlers, we live in military housing, not a fireplace or a chimney in site.
Okay, since you reject the testimony of Sacred Scripture on the subject, please read paragraphs 2475-2487 of the Catechism and show me the exemptions for Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy. Picking and choosing which teachings of the Catholic Church is the same kind of thinking that led to Protestantism. It doesn’t matter whether we’re talking about the authority of the Pope, contraception and abortion, or lying to children about mythical personalities. The Church says not to tell lies. Don’t tell lies.
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ZhaneAugustine
Guest
Where the children grew up to be well adjusted people I have no problems…. However I can not see how the following paragraphs slam against St. Nick, the Easter Bunny, nor the Tooth Fairy so long as the children are able to tell truth from reality in the right time.
2475 Christ’s disciples have "put on the new man, created after the likeness of God in true righteousness and holiness."274 By “putting away falsehood,” they are to "put away all malice and all guile and insincerity and envy and all slander."275
None of the three characters present any malice, guile, insecurity or envy, or slander. Now if Parents encouraged their kids, say to feel better than, let’s say a Jehovah’s Witnesss’ neighbor’s kids, because Santa or these characters came to them and not the JW neighbor’s kids, then I’d say yes, this would violate it. Otherwise, no.
2476 False witness and perjury. When it is made publicly, a statement contrary to the truth takes on a particular gravity. In court it becomes false witness.276 When it is under oath, it is perjury. Acts such as these contribute to condemnation of the innocent, exoneration of the guilty, or the increased punishment of the accused.277 They gravely compromise the exercise of justice and the fairness of judicial decisions.
None of the three lead to the condemnation, nor exoneration of the innocent or guilty. And the gravity of such a story of these three is so remote compared to the offenses meant to be dealt with up here, its no contest.
2477 Respect for the reputation of persons forbids every attitude and word likely to cause them unjust injury.278 He becomes guilty:
- of rash judgment who, even tacitly, assumes as true, without sufficient foundation, the moral fault of a neighbor;
- of detraction who, without objectively valid reason, discloses another’s faults and failings to persons who did not know them;279
- of calumny who, by remarks contrary to the truth, harms the reputation of others and gives occasion for false judgments concerning them.
2478 To avoid rash judgment, everyone should be careful to interpret insofar as possible his neighbor’s thoughts, words, and deeds in a favorable way:
I’d say this is the one and only good contest so far…. As it can be applied to the feelings on parents who let their children believe in the three, and look bitter at those parents who do not. OTHERWISE it’s a very low contest.
Every good Christian ought to be more ready to give a favorable interpretation to another’s statement than to condemn it. But if he cannot do so, let him ask how the other understands it. And if the latter understands it badly, let the former correct him with love. If that does not suffice, let the Christian try all suitable ways to bring the other to a correct interpretation so that he may be saved.280
This is a good case both ways. For the parents who allow their kids to believe, and those who do not.
2479 Detraction and calumny destroy the reputation and honor of one’s neighbor. Honor is the social witness given to human dignity, and everyone enjoys a natural right to the honor of his name and reputation and to respect. Thus, detraction and calumny offend against the virtues of justice and charity.
See above…. However, so long as the thoughts don’t influence the children, no slam against the three. If so, then in a way, yes. A matter of bringing up, ‘superiority’ is wrong, and that’s how I’m reading this paragraph.
more to follow
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ZhaneAugustine
Guest
2480 Every word or attitude is forbidden which by flattery, adulation, or complaisance encourages and confirms another in malicious acts and perverse conduct. Adulation is a grave fault if it makes one an accomplice in another’s vices or grave sins. Neither the desire to be of service nor friendship justifies duplicitous speech. Adulation is a venial sin when it only seeks to be agreeable, to avoid evil, to meet a need, or to obtain legitimate advantages.
This is only a case AND can be a strong one in a materialistic world if Santa takes the place of Jesus. Since this DOES happen, here’s the case against Santa, Easter Bunny, Toothfairy and everything else. HOWEVER if in a Christian household, Jesus is the focus, where the three and others take an innocent back seat in belief, then the case drops.
2481 Boasting or bragging is an offense against truth. So is irony aimed at disparaging someone by maliciously caricaturing some aspect of his behavior.
Can’t see where this applies, unless one believing child or parent mocks the non beliving. THEN it is a case. Otherwise, no. As Santa, Peter Cottontail and the like’s mission and influence are opposed to bragging, boasting, etc.
2482 "A lie consists in speaking a falsehood with the intention of deceiving."281 The Lord denounces lying as the work of the devil: "You are of your father the devil, . . . there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks according to his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies."282
Now this would be the biggest case. HOWEVER, in this instance, fairy tales must be thrown out the window, tales of knights and dragons, imaginary friends should be slammed shut faster than the child could blink. Imagination would be on trial when pressed with these scales. The biggest slam AGAINST this being towards the mythical childhood beliefs, is WHY HAS THE VATICAN NOT COME FORWARD TO DENOUNCE SANTA PUBLICALLY? Why? Before I answer that, I’d like you to. Really think about that.
2483 Lying is the most direct offense against the truth. To lie is to speak or act against the truth in order to lead someone into error. By injuring man’s relation to truth and to his neighbor, a lie offends against the fundamental relation of man and of his word to the Lord.
Because Santa was based on Saint Nicolas, and the good saint served the Lord I don’t think this applies ONE HUNDRED PERCENT. Especially for the well rounded parent who gives the ENTIRE story of Santa. Explaining where each piece comes from, and the culture that believes it.
2484 The gravity of a lie is measured against the nature of the truth it deforms, the circumstances, the intentions of the one who lies, and the harm suffered by its victims. If a lie in itself only constitutes a venial sin, it becomes mortal when it does grave injury to the virtues of justice and charity.
One can argue that the circumstances is to install a since of imagination, joy, and fun. The Intension is to install in the child a belief in the pure. NO child is harmed in normal 99.9% of the situations. I can not think of a single story where an adult goes on a rampage because mommy and daddy told him Santa delivered his toys.
2485 By its very nature, lying is to be condemned. It is a profanation of speech, whereas the purpose of speech is to communicate known truth to others. The deliberate intention of leading a neighbor into error by saying things contrary to the truth constitutes a failure in justice and charity. The culpability is greater when the intention of deceiving entails the risk of deadly consequences for those who are led astray.
2486 Since it violates the virtue of truthfulness, a lie does real violence to another. It affects his ability to know, which is a condition of every judgment and decision. It contains the seed of discord and all consequent evils. Lying is destructive of society; it undermines trust among men and tears apart the fabric of social relationships.
Since at least before their teen years children realize the truth mostly on their own or by family and friends, it does NO violence to them, the story of Santa. ONLY if they insisted and turned away from every shred of evidence as they got older, and even replaced God with a mythical creature or person, THEN it does harm.
2487 Every offense committed against justice and truth entails the duty of reparation, even if its author has been forgiven. When it is impossible publicly to make reparation for a wrong, it must be made secretly. If someone who has suffered harm cannot be directly compensated, he must be given moral satisfaction in the name of charity. This duty of reparation also concerns offenses against another’s reputation. This reparation, moral and sometimes material, must be evaluated in terms of the extent of the damage inflicted. It obliges in conscience.
Again this doesn’t apply. I’ve heard no stories of parents trying to make up for their telling their children these stories…. And the Vatican does NOT demand that they do!
Now if Santa and his friends FALL under these provisions, WHY AGAIN has the pope, the Curia, and the Church NOT condemned? Please think and answer. Because if Santa and the rest DO fall under it…. The pope and the Church is in MORAL OBLIGATION to do so……
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ZhaneAugustine
Guest
LOL well thats new to me. And since Australia is one of the first to celebrate Christmas in the world, it DOES explain WHY Grandma Got Run Over By A Reindeer when Santa hit the States! All that beer went to his and their heads!Leaving a beer out for Santa is an Australian tradition.
The story goes that you northern hemisphere types gave Santa milk. Santa, unbeknownst to you, actually gave the milk to Rudolph. Milk is notorious for causing flatulence in reindeed and that’s how Rudolph found his propulsion.
However, Downunder research found that Australian beer, due to its magical and mystical qualities, was a far better producer of propulsive energy when fed to reindeer. What really swung it was that the beer gave a more consistent and more predictable propulsive energy and Santa was able to stick to his demanding schedule with greater ease. Milk, you see, caused Rudolp to stop and start.
There was an unexpected side effect of this new technology. Rudolph’s nose shone brighter than ever and Santa was even able to navigate through big cities, despite the lights blocking the stars which he uses for navigation.
So, always leave a beer or two out for Santa.
Trust me, it makes for a jollier Christmas!
D
DaveBj
Guest
Because if lying is condemned in both Sacred Scripture and the Catechism, Rome shouldn’t have to say, “Oh yeah, that includes telling the Santa Claus story as if it were the truth.”
I get into this argument every couple years or so, and it’s always a losing cause for me. It seems people are more concerned with maintaining their traditions than they are in maintaining a relationship with Truth.
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