Satanism

[Tantum_ergo]

Wikipedia is edited by ‘anyone’. I’m sorry it’s a little too late for me (had to work for a friend today) to skip over to my library today but that is where I would go to do research on a given topic. I love the internet but it is limited when it comes to doing research. No one doing a college research project (or beyond) would be permitted to use “only” Internet sources, and would receive an automatic “F” at my alma mater for using ‘one’ source, period, let alone one so questionable as wikipedia.

So if you want facts, go to your public library. They can help with interlibrary loan if the book (s) you need aren’t at your branch. You can also try a good university library if one is available in your town.

But for pity’s sake do not think that going to check out ‘wikipedia’ amounts to getting ‘facts’ enough to speak as an expert, or even a qualified amateur, on any given topic.

 

[Valke2]

Longinus, why even mention Mel Gibson. Remember he made “The Passion of The Christ”, and the Jews taunted him forever. They didn’t treat him right at all. They were afraid of the movie that people would take revenge out on them, but in the papers, they said that the man who beat Jesus (a Roman), was harrassed, and his daughter was harrassed at school.
I am not saying that justifies his actions, but I can understand his statements b/c he was ridiculed by the very same people accusing him. Besides, he grossed almost a billion dollars in the making. Enough to make anyone jealous.

wow. really? Sounds like those jews had it coming for what they did to poor mel. And you are saying that it justified his actions.

 

[bella5110]

Wrong Valke, I am simply saying that you aren’t always the victim. That’s all. By the way, Gehenna is a Jewish term. Very good, that’s cuz Jesus was Jewish. And that is what He said.

 

[Denise_Shae]

Hi all,

In my search for “satanism”, most, if not all of the definitions, agree with what Loginus posted.

I was only able to come up with one article where a group of “satansts” actually worshipped the devil and committed other unholy acts.

Jacquie Balodis

• “I was born into Satanism,” the 49-year-old Garden Grove woman said. As she describes it, her early years in Pueblo, Colo., included devil worship, human sacrifice and cannibalism…"

Loginus,

Would I be incorrect in concluding that satanism is a religion centered on the “self” and self-indulgence, as well as existentialism?

Thanks and God Bless!

 

[Tantum_ergo]

I believe that Mr. Gibson apologized for the remarks that he made in what he called the ramblings of a drunkard, with the additional response that even though he was under the influence of a depressant/substance, that still made no difference and that the remarks were totally deplorable no matter what.

No one is attempting to justify Mr. Gibson’s remarks-- anti-Semitism, like anti-Catholicism or any other anti-isms – is despicable.

However, a person who seeks forgiveness, makes public restitution/acknowledgment, and takes responsibility for his actions, should be given at least conditional forgiveness, don’t you think? I honestly don’t see what more he could do. He sinned, he realized, he apologized. Can any person do more?

 

[Valke2]

Wrong Valke, I am simply saying that you aren’t always the victim. That’s all. By the way, Gehenna is a Jewish term. Very good, that’s cuz Jesus was Jewish. And that is what He said.

I accidently broke my ignore bella streak. Didn’t know you had made that mel gibson comment. Imagine my surprise. Now I have to start all over.

 

[Kevin42]

They dont actually worship Satan, they just admire how in the tale of Paradise Lost, Satan defied order to find his own place.

This is enough to make it “evil”. Satan does not deserve any admiration, and a religion that promotes admiration of him is an abomination. That is not to say that the people who are a part of this group go around killing people, defiling holy objects, or worshipping Satan (although admiring him is certainly too close anyways). I don’t really know what they do…for all I know, they may or may not do these things. However, from what you said (they admire what Satan did) that makes it evil and sinful. Satan deserves no admiration for any part of his existance. All glory and honor is to the one true God. Jesus did not honor Satan, he said, “Get away, Satan! It is written: ‘The Lord, your God, shall you worship and him alone shall you serve.’”

 

[Valke2]

I believe that Mr. Gibson apologized for the remarks that he made in what he called the ramblings of a drunkard, with the additional response that even though he was under the influence of a depressant/substance, that still made no difference and that the remarks were totally deplorable no matter what.

No one is attempting to justify Mr. Gibson’s remarks-- anti-Semitism, like anti-Catholicism or any other anti-isms – is despicable.

However, a person who seeks forgiveness, makes public restitution/acknowledgment, and takes responsibility for his actions, should be given at least conditional forgiveness, don’t you think? I honestly don’t see what more he could do. He sinned, he realized, he apologized. Can any person do more?

Actually, Bella did attempt to justify his remarks. Peronsally, the PR damage control after the arrest means little to me. There’s a saying that some Jews have about people like Mr. Gibson: “F - him.”

 

[Tantum_ergo]

I’m sorry, Valke. I’m not attempting to justify Mel’s actions or statement–he himself has said they are not justifiable.

Just for myself though (I’m a softy) I don’t think that I could ever get to where I could use that kind of remark (especially that one word) about another human being. We all make mistakes. Even the most evil person was still created by God and even the most desperate villain is capable of repentence. Except that I don’t think we people are capable of that kind of forgiveness for evil without God’s help.

 

[Valke2]

I’m sorry, Valke. I’m not attempting to justify Mel’s actions or statement–he himself has said they are not justifiable.

Just for myself though (I’m a softy) I don’t think that I could ever get to where I could use that kind of remark (especially that one word) about another human being. We all make mistakes. Even the most evil person was still created by God and even the most desperate villain is capable of repentence. Except that I don’t think we people are capable of that kind of forgiveness for evil without God’s help.

Well, I’m from Jersey.

Besides, what is so bad about saying “Forget Mel”? I agree that Mel could easily repent. I just don’t believe he did.

 

[Kevin42]

There’s a saying that some Jews have about people like Mr. Gibson: “F - him.”

I don’t know whether Mel Gibson hates the Jewish people or not. He has made it clear he doesn’t, and that his actions are unexcusable, but who knows what is in his heart. Either way though, treating people like that certainly isn’t going to get people to like you, and I’m certain that many other Jewish people do not want to be represented by such lack of charity.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

I’m originally from Philly-love Jersey (mom’s from Summit).

Forgetting a person (to the extent of shunning which is the sense I got) I just think is extremely hurtful to both groups. It just presupposes that the sinner will never be capable of a good. This can drive the sinner to despair, or it can solidify his evil (heck, if they hate me I might as well make myself even more hateable, what’s the use in trying to be good?) And (though this is subtle and I don’t think it is universally the case) it also presupposes that the judgers themselves will either never be capable of sin, or never be capable of so ‘bad’ a sin. And that can drive them into the sin of pride. It keeps them from ‘loving their neighbor as themselves’. So to me, that sort of behavior winds up in just perpetuating sin on both sides.

I don’t know if he really repented. I mean, I try to live a good life myself and to be kind and thoughtful, and every single day there is at least one situation where I blow it! so people might argue did I really truly repent, if I still make the same mistakes? I think that I’m sincere at the time, but there are still certain things that are stumbling blocks for me. I won’t give up though.

We’ll probably never know on this earth Mr. Gibson’s intentions, his mind and heart. As a Christian, I believe that at the Last Judgment all hearts and minds will be judged, and we will know then how he ‘really’ feels, and whether he will have gained heaven or hell because of it. So right now the best thing to do is pray for him, and for all of us, not to be led into temptation, and to be delivered from evil.

 

[Denise_Shae]

Forgetting a person (to the extent of shunning which is the sense I got) I just think is extremely hurtful to both groups. It just presupposes that the sinner will never be capable of a good. This can drive the sinner to despair, or it can solidify his evil (heck, if they hate me I might as well make myself even more hateable, what’s the use in trying to be good?) And (though this is subtle and I don’t think it is universally the case) it also presupposes that the judgers themselves will either never be capable of sin, or never be capable of so ‘bad’ a sin. And that can drive them into the sin of pride. It keeps them from ‘loving their neighbor as themselves’. So to me, that sort of behavior winds up in just perpetuating sin on both sides.

I don’t know if he really repented. I mean, I try to live a good life myself and to be kind and thoughtful, and every single day there is at least one situation where I blow it! so people might argue did I really truly repent, if I still make the same mistakes? I think that I’m sincere at the time, but there are still certain things that are stumbling blocks for me. I won’t give up though.

We’ll probably never know on this earth Mr. Gibson’s intentions, his mind and heart. As a Christian, I believe that at the Last Judgment all hearts and minds will be judged, and we will know then how he ‘really’ feels, and whether he will have gained heaven or hell because of it. So right now the best thing to do is pray for him, and for all of us, not to be led into temptation, and to be delivered from evil.

I’m originally from Philly-love Jersey (mom’s from Summit).

Me too! Born and bred is So. Philly. And all my relatives live in Jersey.

I don’t know if he really repented.

No one but Mr. Gibson and God knows the answer to that.
I’d like to hope he did, but still… those anti-Semitic remarks won’t easily be forgotten. (If ever)
Personally, it would be hard for me to trust someone who made racial slurs, again.

Forgive; yes, I’d eventually have to, according to Christ, but trust? I’m not so sure.

God Bless!

 

[bella5110]

Well, I’m from Jersey.

Besides, what is so bad about saying “Forget Mel”? I agree that Mel could easily repent. I just don’t believe he did.

Oh please…and you’ll hold on to that forever in retribution for the making of his film…who even knows he said what he said…did the Jews repent after what THEY did to Mel? Not just a one way street sir.

 

[bella5110]

Actually, Bella did attempt to justify his remarks. Peronsally, the PR damage control after the arrest means little to me. There’s a saying that some Jews have about people like Mr. Gibson: “F - him.”

And so what if I did, at least I admit it. He was persecuted by the Jewish people for making this film, you see people here don’t know this. But you Valke do know…
So your from Jersey, I’m from Boston. Very street smart…

 

[TOP]

And so what if I did, at least I admit it. He was persecuted by the Jewish people for making this film, you see people here don’t know this. But you Valke do know…
So your from Jersey, I’m from Boston. Very street smart…

Southie?

 

[Loginus]

Hi all,

In my search for “satanism”, most, if not all of the definitions, agree with what Loginus posted.

I was only able to come up with one article where a group of “satansts” actually worshipped the devil and committed other unholy acts.

Loginus,

Would I be incorrect in concluding that satanism is a religion centered on the “self” and self-indulgence, as well as existentialism?

Thanks and God Bless!

ot quite. Remember, little s for the evil variety and big S for the one that is worship of the self. May not seem like much being a single capitalization, but a comparable one would God v god, they mean different things.

Hope it hlps

PS> for you ppl attcking wiki, check the bottom of the arctile. For this case, there are links to interviews, websites, newpaper articles and the excerpts are from the Satanic Bible itself.

 

[Shy_Violet]

There are different types of Satan worship. I’ll just mention the main two here. One is the type seen in most movies. The adherents do sacrifices, hold Black Masses, etc. We have those types of people here in NC. Bleh. Then there are people who belong to the Church of Satan. They believe in worshipping the self. Their motto is basically, “If it feels good, do it.” Their religion believes in expressing the ego to the max. This is the group that Longinus was talking about in his post.

 

[Denise_Shae]

ot quite. Remember, little s for the evil variety and big S for the one that is worship of the self. May not seem like much being a single capitalization, but a comparable one would God v god, they mean different things.

Hope it hlps

PS> for you ppl attcking wiki, check the bottom of the arctile. For this case, there are links to interviews, websites, newpaper articles and the excerpts are from the Satanic Bible itself.

Okay, got it. Thanks for the clarification. (I’ve never done research on the subject before, so please excuse my ignorance)

BTW: Is Wikipedia fairly new? I’ve only just learned about it when I signed up for CAF?

Anyway, thanks again and God Bless!

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Attacking wiki? Come on now. It’s not a **bad **site, for heaven’s sake, but it is not as authoritative as other sources, specifically scholarly sources.

Anybody can put anything into wiki. Sure there are some safeguards, but as someone who knows research, the idea of taking even a ‘big’ article, and even following out all the links provided, and thinking that one then knows enough about that article to make an educated judgment. . .for someone who talks about the ‘opinions’ of others and wants facts, arguing based solely on the basis of a wiki article (even with links–and did you read every single one? If you did, you have my admiration), well, I guess we will have to agree to disagree or to have a ‘difference of opinion’ here.

You’ll notice that I am not saying anything myself about Satanism, because I have not done enough solid research to do so.

I am sure that were I to do so I would, indeed, find a fair amount of that article to be accurate–but I would also find an equally fair amount, at least, to be slightly questionable to downright wrong. I make this judgment based upon my knowledge of several different articles on wikipedia that I have studied for various projects and topics. It is a very mixed bag there at best.