"Scholarly consensus" sees Moses as a mythical figure?

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Moses existed, but we should recognize that the genre of Exodus was not meant to be taken as historical fact in every sense. The Bible is a library, there is mythology, poetry, history, etc. It’s a big book.

I prefer the revised Kenite hypothesis which has gained a lot of traction among scholars and explains a lot of the things we find in the Old Testament. The hypothesis posits that YHWH was the God of the Kenites, a tribe of the Midianites. Moses came into contact with Kenites through his fahter-in-law Jethro, adopted YHWH, and formed a priestly tradition around him as the Levites. It was likely the Levites were the one that came out of Egypt and brought their Yahwehist tradition to Canaan (explaining their itinerancy in Israel) along with other Midianite tribes who migrated into Canaan. This hypothesis fits well with the data of the Old Testament.

First, there is a strong southern origins tradition in the Hebrew Bible, and one of the earliest portions of the Hebrew Bible can be found in Judges which has YHWH marching from the south into Canaan,
“Lord, when thou didst go forth from Se′ir, when thou didst march from the region of Edom, the earth trembled, and the heavens dropped, yea, the clouds dropped water. The mountains quaked before the Lord, yon Sinai before the Lord, the God of Israel.” - Judges 5:4-5
Mt. Sinai was probably the original place where Yahwehist worshipped YHWH, and this area was most likely in northern Arabia in the region of Midian. It difficult to make sense why a Canaanite religion would venerate such a mountain in their traditions unless this place was originally associated as the dwelling place of YHWH by migrants who imported in the Yahwehist religion to Canaan.

Further indications of a southern origin can be found in Hosea 12:13 where it’s mentioned God used a prophet to bring Israel out of Egypt, and Habakkuk 3:3 where it is mentioned God came from Teman and from Mt. Paran, which is in Arabia on the coast of the Red Sea, and was likely the same as Sinai.

There is also much archaeological evidence that YHWH originated in the south, such as the discovery of the 14th century BC Egyptian text which mentions the “Shasu of YHWH”, which is the earliest reference to YHWH ever, even predating the text of the Hebrew Bible; the Shasu are thought to have resided in the region of Edom by scholars.

The discovery of the 9th century BC Kuntillet Ajrud confirms YHWH was worshiped by the Edomites for it mentions “YHWH of Teman.”

It is suggested that Yahweh was adopted by the Israelite monarchy, likely by King Saul whose family may have had YHWH as their God, but eventually the monarchy became extremely syncretist in their worship of Yahweh, which caused the push back of some of the “traditionalist” Yahwehist (who imported YHWH in the first place with their religious traditions around him) to emphasize sole worship of Yahweh and a tradition of prophets was started. Indeed, the Rechabites were a group of Kenites in Israel who were strictly devoted to Yahweh alone, and their founder Jehonadab was a zealot for YHWH worship alone who seemingly appears out of nowhere with Jehu (2 Kings 10, Jeremiah 35).
 
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It’s impossible to prove that he didn’t exist, so he can’t conclusively be proven to be mythical. It’s just that he hasn’t been proven to be historical by academic standards either.
 
From an academic standpoint, taking something as fact because a single source said it is bad history. The Bible is not seen as an unfallible source in secular academia, and large parts of the Bible aren’t backed up by other sources. The reason for Moses being seen as mythical is the lack of Egyptian records concerning the Jews in captivity or the plagues. Christian academia differs from secular academia in that the Bible is always assumed to be based on the truth, although many Christian academics believe parts of the OT were lost before being written down, so some of the truth is lost to us.
 
To supplement this post, Old Testament scholar Carol Meyers remarks:
“Can one imagine Christianity without Jesus? Islam without Muhammad? The mystery of how high land farmers began considering themselves Israelites may lie in their acceptance of a new god, brought in by a small group of refugees from Egypt, led by a charismatic figure convinced that the escape was the result of this new deity who had been encountered in Midian.” - Exodus, by Carol Meyers, p.15
 
To give one last note, several Levites such as Moses himself, Aaron, Phineas, and others, have Egyptian names.
 
That would explain the lack of evidence of Jews in Egypt. There’s plenty of other theories of course, and Moses being mythical doesn’t mean he didn’t exist, just that his story is told in a mythic tradition rather than a historical one.
 
What would that do to your faith?

It doesn’t do much to mine.
Respectfully pondering then what about Jesus who speaks of Moses and repeats, throughout his teaching, the Laws of Moses, The Ten Commandments, Sermon on the Mount and the story where Jesus meets with Moses and Elijah on the mount and then there is the Gospel of Matthew, Jesus speaking about the Seat of Moses the Law Giver and Jesus stating >>do not think I have come to change one tittle or jot of the Laws of Moses?

Then what about Noah? Abraham? Enoch? And all the bible OT verses of God chosen people and punishment and restoring the House of Israel from which comes from Moses etc? Oh and what about the Ark of the Covenant they carried stories?

Then who was it that spoke to Moses, stating I Am what I Am? What there is no I Am >>>then if Moses was just a myth or a legendary story of mans ideology, story telling?
Then God did not write with his finger the Ten commandments?
Then God spoke not in what is written? Commanding this or that of Moses and the Israelites?
And building all theses altars along the way?
What about the story of where God gives Manna in the dessert?
All ancient stories and myths created by man? etc
Then what about Jesus who comes out of the OT?
Then if Moses is just a myth or stories created by man, what about Adam and Eve?
Ark of Covenant, oh my?
If Moses was a myth, stories made by man, then what about Jesus speaking preaching on Moses and he was God and where one gets I Am?
Peace 🙂
 
There is also much archaeological evidence that YHWH originated in the south, such as the discovery of the 14th century BC Egyptian text which mentions the “Shasu of YHWH”, which is the earliest reference to YHWH ever, even predating the text of the Hebrew Bible; the Shasu are thought to have resided in the region of Edom by scholars.

The discovery of the 9th century BC Kuntillet Ajrud confirms YHWH was worshiped by the Edomites for it mentions “YHWH of Teman.”
Not to discount anything that you’ve written in your post, since I haven’t studied it before, but this one piece could be explained alternatively by the biblical data. The people of Edom are seen in Scripture as the descendents of Esau, Jacob’s brother, Issac’s son, descendant of Abraham. If this is true,it would make sense for them to know of YHWH and even possibly worship him in some way, albeit not in the same way as the Israelites would have since they received special revelation that the Edomites did not receive.
 
Wikipedia is a problematic source if the article is about an emotion-laden, political or religious topic.
Some of the Bible articles are very good (some are marked as “good articles” also which mean they have been through a peer review process).

Unfortunately, this Moses article is not one of the “good” ones, and the other poster is right that any article dealing with Israel is prone to biased, agenda-driven editing.

I spent some time as a very active Wikipedia editor so I’m aware of all these issues. I mostly find Wiki useful for directing me to primary sources. In this case it seems to have fallen down on the job even on that point.
 
Any more hilarious than Joshua stopping the sun from moving across the sky?
 
Respectfully pondering then what about Jesus who speaks of Moses and repeats, throughout his teaching, the Laws of Moses, The Ten Commandments, Sermon on the Mount and the story where Jesus meets with Moses and Elijah on the mount and then there is the Gospel of Matthew, Jesus speaking about the Seat of Moses the Law Giver and Jesus stating >>do not think I have come to change one tittle or jot of the Laws of Moses?
^^This. Especially the Transfiguration.
We accept the Transfiguration as an actual real happening in the Gospel.
St. Pope John Paul II also made it one of the Luminous Mysteries.

if Jesus is in both the Gospel and in a Holy Mystery propagated by a sainted Pope, appearing in a transfigured form talking with Moses, who was recognized by Peter, James and John as being Moses, then no way am I going to believe that Moses was just some composite character, “legendary” figure a la Paul Bunyan, etc.
 
if Jesus is in both the Gospel and in a Holy Mystery propagated by a sainted Pope, appearing in a transfigured form talking with Moses, who was recognized by Peter, James and John as being Moses, then no way am I going to believe that Moses was just some composite character, “legendary” figure a la Paul Bunyan, etc.
Respectfully toward, one fully understands what one is saying ! 🙂

Have a question thou, when you used the word>recognized<< how would St Peter, James and John>> recognize>>it was> Moses, Elijah, when all 3 never saw or meet or spoke with Moses or Elijah?🤔 Peace 🙂
 
I would presume they were divinely inspired by God to understand they were seeing Moses and Elijah, as the Gospel did not indicate that Jesus explained this to the Apostles, yet Peter right away shows that he knows they are Moses and Elijah when he suggests putting up three tents.

Also, it is possible that there was some description, depiction or understanding among the Jewish people as to how Moses or Elijah would look, the same way as we today can recognize a statue of St. Francis of Assisi, St. Anthony, St. Patrick etc. by the clothing and by what the statue is holding in its hands, and perhaps the figures of Moses and Elijah conformed to this understanding to make it easier.
 
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I was disappointed when I read that too as while I also don’t take all of the bible as being literal (eg:I don’t believe in a literal one only Adam and Eve and also thought the Jonah and the whale story may be mythical), I at least thought the Moses and Egypt exodus story was real.

I love the film 10 Commandments (and the men in it) lol…to think this could all be not true…😦
Obviously the film is elaborated and bits added to make it more “TV worthy” etc,but I still thought the general story of Moses leading the Jews out of Egypt into the desert was true.
If this truly is untrue,if the locusts etc were never ordered by God over Egypt,if Moses never turned the river to blood,if God never provided the 10 commandments to Moses on the mountain,if God never parted the Red Sea etc…then what else is untrue??!
How can we take anything in the bible as factual at all?
 
There are parts of the Bible that are supported by historic evidence. For example, there is independent historic evidence that Jesus existed, was baptized by John the Baptist, and was crucified under Pontius Pilate. So if someone were to claim that Jesus never existed, then even scholars who don’t believe in Jesus being the Son of God, Savior, etc. would tell them they were wrong because of the evidence.

The problem comes when we are dealing with parts of the Bible for which there is no independent historic evidence.
 
I’d like to hear what @Moses613 and @meltzerboy2 have to say about this possibility.
“Scholarly consensus” indeed. It’s a meaningless phrase and unreferenced. Which scholars, and where is the published secondary source affirming this consensus?
I’m not into editing Wikipedia. The Judaism project has a lot of garbage, though it’s gotten better over the years.
 
Do you know if there are any scholars,archeologists or Jews who believe that the Exodus story is historically factual?

Also,regarding the pyramids,if these weren’t built by Jewish slaves do historians suggest they were built by Egyptian labour themselves?
 
I haven’t researched either of those questions in depth and I’m not a Jewish history expert. Last I looked there was some archaelogical evidence for parts of the Exodus. I think Wiki says there isn’t any, and cites one source in support of this contention, which again to me seems like more of the mess one usually encounters on articles dealing with Israel on Wikipedia.
 
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You asked more question without answering mine.

But your point that a can of worms is opened is well made. Each question would have to be reconsidered. Our standard understanding would have to be reexamined.
 
Also,regarding the pyramids,if these weren’t built by Jewish slaves do historians suggest they were built by Egyptian labour themselves?
Note that the Bible never actually says the Israelites built pyramids. They built the store-cities of Pithom and Raameses.
 
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