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geoformeo
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Why not? If you made a system of rules that you personally did not have to abide by, but subordinates to you did have to abide by the rules, would you note be “outside” of that “universe”?I explained why you cannot use “he created science” or “he’s outside the universe” as an excuse.
Name a scientific law that has been falsified. Also, you say that “scientific laws are the result of our observations.” So are you implying that if we were not here to observe them, they would not exist? I’m afraid you are gravely mistaken. The natural laws are physical truth, not anything we humans made up. They simply are (exist). Just like 1+1=2 whether or not you or I are here to objectively verify it. So asking why these natural truths exist and why they are unchangeable makes perfect sense.You are somewhat incorrect. The difference is not as concrete as you think, though I did say “a law is like a theory” not identical to. But, for example, a theory is also proven by observation and experimentation time and again, and laws have predictive and explanatory power, and most importantly, laws most certainly can be falsified. But you are missing the point. Scientific laws are the result of our observations about how the world functions. Knowing that, asking “who enforces these laws” makes no sense.
Name the natural law that explains why natural laws are immutable. And I thought you just said that natural laws “most certainly can be falsified.” So let me get this straight: you believe that natural laws are immutable, but can be falsified? How exactly does that work?Science can certainly address that. Natural laws are immutable because if we find them to be wrong, then they’re not laws. That’s simply how they’re defined. That’s like asking why squares have 4 sides.
I was not insulting you, I was merely pointing out your error, which is what you do in a debate. If you’re not okay with that, I can find someone else to debate with.Before you start insulting other people, you better make sure you’re not the one in error.
It makes no scientific sense to ask that question, because it is beyond the scope and domain of science to address it, because it is by its very nature supernatural. Yet given our human experience and the fact that everything we know that begins to exist has a cause, and knowing that the natural laws began to exist (Big Bang), it is very reasonable and sensical to ask that question. You simply have to realize that the answer will not come from science.Again, given what natural laws are, it makes no sense to ask how natural laws were brought into existence.
So now I’m not honest? Please, you are clutching at strawsNo, I’m not going to provide links to prove psychology and neurology exist. You are clearly not arguing honestly if you are demanding that.
Wow. Your ignorance is telling. And if “it’s very interesting stuff”, then why aren’t you going out of your way to provide a link for me to enlighten myself?YOU should actually check out the field of neurotheology, and not just take the claims of psuedoscientists as fact. Check out some accepted established neuroscience and psychology. It’s very interesting stuff, and far more complicated and fascinating then this ghosts and goblins ****.
Asking “why” with those questions may be valid scientifically, but are misleading. The more appropriate question is “how come?” (ex: How did it come to be that there are waves in the ocean?) The question “why” demands a sense of purpose. Or are you willing to admit that there is purpose to the natural laws?No, why are there waves in the ocean, why is the sky blue, etc; are all perfectly valid scientific questions. Your insistence that starting a question with “why” automatically makes it theological is just absurd.
My mistake. The point still stands that it cannot be verified, and thus cannot be considered logically true.That wasn’t my premise, that was my conclusion.
Excellent rebuttal.Wrong
No, arguing with logical fallacies is not arguing with logic. Here we go again, I guess I’m lying and being dishonest. I take it you would rather retreat to attacks on my character rather than attempt to logically justify your position?Nope, I argued with logic. Ignoring my logic and simply claiming I argued from incredulity is a lie.
My only question is, why? If you believe there is no purpose to the universe, and that all morality is a physical construct and subject to individual interpretation, then why do you have any concern at all for the future? Why do you have the hope that “science and morality continue to advance, civil rights get better, and the standard of life continues to increase” if there is no purpose to existence?I would imagine so! Which only furthers my point. I hope we continue to get smarter, and that science and morality continue to advance, civil rights get better, and the standard of life continues to increase. I would be profoundly disappointed if future generations decided, for no reason, “let’s rewind the clock and only listen to a bunch of sexist, racist, unenlightened boobs about how to run the world.”
Sounds to me like you realize that you have the same hopes as us religious folks that are “written on the hearts of men” by God. You only need to open your mind to the Truth. Keep searching and keep questioning. God bless you, Mersenne.