Scott Hahn

[Hesychios]

I simply believe most Catholics who leave the Chuch do so out of disobedience, some look for an easy denomination others just give up.

You might find that those who leave her love her the most.

I know that is a paradoxical thing to say, but let’s just leave it at that, shall we?

 

[Lapell]

I notice that there is no love lost for former Catholics/Protestants:​

• FCs: always insincere, never have a good reason to leave, at best ignorant of Catholicism while Catholic, could not have been real Catholics in the first place
• FPs: always insincere, never have a good reason to leave, at best ignorant of Protestantism while Protestant, could not have been real Protestants in the first place
• Converts to Catholicism: absolutely wonderful in every way (from Catholic POV)
• Converts to Protestantism: absolutely wonderful in every way (from Protestant POV)

No wonder there are atheists, when this is how the adherents of the “religion of love” behave.

I’d disagree with you, GoG. Not every convert necessarily is wonderful in every way. Even among the cradle ones, whether Catholic or Protestant, not everyone is seen by those of his/her Church as absolutely wonderful, far from it. There are all kinds of tastes, you know!!!

 

[Lapell]

He actually doesn’t fall into any of these categories…you’re generalizing him and that’s NOT fair. Read any one of his books in its entirety before you comment. After you read one of his books in its entirety (or listen to his CD’s/DVDs), without bias, then you’re allowed to comment…

How about this one Category: Those who look and leave because the Church they’re going into allows them to become more fulfilled Christians? This one is a more developed form of “Look and leave”, if you will.

 

[laurenharper]

Can you provide something from a catechism or council that says protestants are a different religion? I think you are engaging in private interpretation.

You are absolutely right, in my opinion, SemperReformada. The Catechism never calls Protestantism a different religion, or even implies that. Not to say that there are no differences, or that there is no reason to need/want to convert to Catholicism, but to call Protestants a different religion is simply incorrect. Isn’t it interesting how private interpretation can happen in both the Scriptures and the Catechism? But at least Catholics have to Pope to make the final call…

 

[Irish_Kathy]

Don’t know Hahn. Haven’t read his book. Don’t know anything about the man.

I am going to say this, though: there seem to be three sorts of people who change religions:

those who leave and then look,
Those who look and then leave,
Those who find–and find that didn’t really have anything TO leave.

Of those who leave first and then look for a new faith, the reasons for leaving are almost always personal, not theological: someone has hurt their feelings, or treated them badly; they have physically moved and the new place doesn’t have the right ‘feel’; they have done something so against the rules of their faith that they were either kicked out or feel so guilty (and resentful, perhaps) that they kick themselves out. When they find another faith to join, these folks tend to be bitter and attack their former faith; blaming it for something it was not responsible for.

Of those who ‘look then leave,’ we have people who, while they are active members of their first faith, look around at other faiths to learn more, or someone convinces them that their first faith isn’t what they always thought it was; there is this new faith that offers more, IS more, of what they need. These folks are far less likely to go all Ed Decker (OK, “Jack Chick” ) on their first faith, but some do.

Then there are those who simply live their lives–and get blindsided by something in a new faith that they didn’t even know they were missing. When they go forward, they do so because they didn’t have much of anything invested in their first faith (if they HAD a ‘first faith’) other than social networking, culture, or family tradition. THESE folks very seldom go after their first faith; they are too busy learning about this new one, that is filling a void they didn’t even know was there.

I don’t know which of these categories Kahn falls in, but if his books are all about his new found Catholic faith rather than condemnations of his former faith, it’s a safe bet that he is either a "look then leave,’ or a “those who find” sort of person. That would make him someone who is ‘running to,’ not ‘running from.’

I know, long winded answer to a short question…I do that.

Hi Dianaiad – I’m certain beyond any doubt that Dr. Hahn converted to the Catholic faith for all the right reasons. There have been many books mentioned here on this thread that confirm this without a doubt. As an LDS, I’d highly suggest you read one of his most well known books A FATHER WHO KEEPS HIS PROMISES. You can find it in Barnes and Nobel. In this book, he traces Salvation History from Adam all the way to the beginnings of the Catholic Church. I think it would be an especially good book for you as an LDS to read.

Kathy

 

[usemelord]

I came into the Catholic Church four years ago at the Easter Vigil, something that I would have confidently bet a large sum of money against ever happening. As I now rapidly approach my 65th birthday, I have to admit that Scott Hahn had a significant impact and influence as I made my way through the RCIA “journey.” In particular, I found Scott Hahn’s conversion story on CD to be tremendously powerful. He raised many questions that I had in my own mind about certain Catholic practices which I had always held to be superfluous. Besides his conversion CD, I also read at least a half dozen of his best known works and listened to countless tapes covering Scripture literally from Genesis to Revelation. First and foremost, he is absolutely brilliant. He is extremely articulate, well-read and an engaging and persuasive speaker. As an educator, he was constantly in search of the truth and eventually found it in the Catholic Church although, admittedly, he loathed the idea of that coming to pass. What more can I say except that he is my favorite author, one who brings new and refreshing insight to my faith in exciting and surprising ways. (And, no, I am not Scott Hahn is disguise.)

 

[Hisalone]

RC Sproul > Scott Hahn

 

[Irish_Kathy]

I came into the Catholic Church four years ago at the Easter Vigil, something that I would have confidently bet a large sum of money against ever happening. As I now rapidly approach my 65th birthday, I have to admit that Scott Hahn had a significant impact and influence as I made my way through the RCIA “journey.” In particular, I found Scott Hahn’s conversion story on CD to be tremendously powerful. He raised many questions that I had in my own mind about certain Catholic practices which I had always held to be superfluous. Besides his conversion CD, I also read at least a half dozen of his best known works and listened to countless tapes covering Scripture literally from Genesis to Revelation. First and foremost, he is absolutely brilliant. He is extremely articulate, well-read and an engaging and persuasive speaker. As an educator, he was constantly in search of the truth and eventually found it in the Catholic Church although, admittedly, he loathed the idea of that coming to pass. What more can I say except that he is my favorite author, one who brings new and refreshing insight to my faith in exciting and surprising ways. (And, no, I am not Scott Hahn is disguise.)

Hi Use Me Lord Thanks for sharing your particular journey with us. Also, wouldn’t it be great if Dr. Hahn really were here “in disguise?” He surely would make this discussion an interesting one for sure?

Kathy

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

I don’t dislike her at all. But I am often attacked and accused of being an anti-Catholic by her, which I am not. I have the utmost respect for Catholicism and the Catholic faith. I am all for peace.

Puh-lease… You constantly stalk me whenever I say anything about my Catholic faith. It hardly seems you have ANY respect for Catholicism…anyway, I don’t dislike you neither.

 

[Lapell]

Hi Dianaiad – I’m certain beyond any doubt that Dr. Hahn converted to the Catholic faith for all the right reasons. There have been many books mentioned here on this thread that confirm this without a doubt. As an LDS, I’d highly suggest you read one of his most well known books A FATHER WHO KEEPS HIS PROMISES. You can find it in Barnes and Nobel. In this book, he traces Salvation History from Adam all the way to the beginnings of the Catholic Church. I think it would be an especially good book for you as an LDS to read.

Kathy

As for the conversion story itself by both Scott and Kimberly Hahn, there’s the book Rome Sweet Home. Even its French translation touched me.

 

[Irish_Kathy]

As for the conversion story itself by both Scott and Kimberly Hahn, there’s the book Rome Sweet Home. Even its French translation touched me.

Hi Lapell – YOU ARE QUITE RIGHT!!! Naturally, Rome Sweet Home was the very first book by him and Kimberly that I ever read. It touched me so much that I’ve enjoyed reading all of his books ever since. But actually, for me, the beginning of my fascination with anything by Dr. Hahn was on EWTN when I would enjoy watching Our Father’s Plan with Jeff Cavins. The two of them together made a particularly good team during that series.

As for Jeff Cavins himself, I’ve also enjoyed reading MY LIFE ON THE ROCK where he relays his spiritual journey from leaving the Catholic Church, becoming a Protestant Minister and then returning to the Catholic Church. Contrary to what others may believe, there are many former Catholics who do indeed return to the Catholic Church after leaving earlier in their lives. Jeff has even coined a term for people like himself, often refering to himself as a “revert” to the Catholic Church. In fact, there are many people here who fall into this category of “converts” who visit here at CAF often.

 

[wina]

I read some of his books and I like them because I’ve learnt so many things about my faith through his books and of course through CAF too. CAF has many briliant people who know how to defend their catholic faith.

 

[Peter_J]

Thought was interesting about a Catholic Apologist who refuses to debate one of the best Christian Apologist. The question is why?

**Dr. Scott Hahn’s challenge to debate was delivered personally by James White following a debate in San Diego in January of 1991. James White had first met Scott Hahn at a debate between White and Gerry Matatics in Phoenix, Arizona. Hahn then moderated a debate on the Papacy the next evening. The next month White debated Dr. Mitchell Pacwa on justification and the Mass. Following one of these debates, White challenged Hahn, in front of a number of witnesses, to a public debate. That was in January of 1991—over six years ago now. So far, Hahn has been unwilling to debate.

In late 1996, James White received an invitation to participate in a Roman Catholic/Protestant dialogue/debate in Dallas, Texas, scheduled for April of 1997**. White gladly accepted the invitation, and sent out a number of books and debate tapes to those who invited him. However, the very next day, White received a phone call, dis-inviting him. He was told that when Dr. Hahn was told he (White) had been invited, he became quite upset, and indicated that if White was going to attend, he would not. Since they already had a contract with Hahn, White’s invitation was rescinded.

For those, then, who would like to see how individuals such as Mark Shea, Karl Keating, and Scott Hahn, would respond to the challenges put forward by James White, we can only suggest one thing: contact these men and ask them to engage in such a public exchange.

The source: vintage.aomin.org/Aboutdebates.html

I’ve got another observation relating to the whole debate-James-White theme, but not wanting to further divert this thread, I’ve started a new one: Hahn, White, Madrid, Sippo.

 

[Jokoangel]

I really like Scott Hahn, I think his books are awesome and they helped in my own conversion

****I, too, like Scott Hahn. One question related to how Presbyterians feel about him. I can only attest to one of them, my son. It almost seems that they are afraid of him and the truth that he tells. I had met him a few times and one of the things that no one, so far, has touched upon. That is, how vividly he “proves” with scripture that we have the one true, holy and and apostolic church. His books and talks cover using Old Testament to relate how “jewish” our Mass is. Our Jewish converts recognize this when attending a Mass. He is a master of Bible Study (which he has online). God bless . . .

 

[SemperReformada]

****I, too, like Scott Hahn. One question related to how Presbyterians feel about him. I can only attest to one of them, my son. It almost seems that they are afraid of him and the truth that he tells. I had met him a few times and one of the things that no one, so far, has touched upon. That is, how vividly he “proves” with scripture that we have the one true, holy and and apostolic church. His books and talks cover using Old Testament to relate how “jewish” our Mass is. Our Jewish converts recognize this when attending a Mass. He is a master of Bible Study (which he has online). God bless . . .

No, no one is afraid of Scott Hahn…at least no one I’ve run across. Scott is a very intelligent guy and a gifted speaker but your giving him too much credit. I know he has written several books that are popular within the Catholic apologetic circles and I am sure there are many apologists from the reformed side of things who would like to debate/discuss things with him.

The only issue I have with Scott is that he comes across as less than…forthcoming in his book describing his conversion. It’s been a very long time since I read the book but it appears he was leaving something out when he was describing his departure from reformed theology into the Catholic church.

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

No, no one is afraid of Scott Hahn…at least no one I’ve run across. Scott is a very intelligent guy and a gifted speaker but your giving him too much credit. I know he has written several books that are popular within the Catholic apologetic circles and I am sure there are many apologists from the reformed side of things who would like to debate/discuss things with him.

The only issue I have with Scott is that he comes across as less than…forthcoming in his book describing his conversion. It’s been a very long time since I read the book but it appears he was leaving something out when he was describing his departure from reformed theology into the Catholic church.

What could he have possibly left out?

 

[SemperReformada]

What could he have possibly left out?

I don’t know…I just remember thinking how could a guy of Scott’s supposed intellectual ability study reformed theology for so long and then be clueless as how to defend it on matters such as sola fide and sola scriptura.

 

[usemelord]

Did Scott Hahn leave anything out in his book regarding his conversion story? I don’t know, but I rather doubt it. It’s been a while since I read it. However, the story of his conversion on CD is as complete as it gets. He pulls no punches when it comes to describing how anti-Catholic he was, and then ever so gradually was lead, through research in an attempt to disprove Catholic tenets, to ultimately accept the canons and dogma as true. Next, as far as Scott Hahn being “clueless” on matters of sola fide and sola scriptura, I would suggest you listen to Dr. Hahn’s series entitled “The Bible Alone?” This eight set cassette series directly answers those questions in detail. (I don’t know if it is on cd, however.) Let me assure you that he is in no way “clueless.” This man just didn’t accidentally fall into the Catholic Church by some sort of default. His was a studied and most deliberate journey if there ever was one.

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

I don’t know…I just remember thinking how could a guy of Scott’s supposed intellectual ability study reformed theology for so long and then be clueless as how to defend it on matters such as sola fide and sola scriptura.

Is it just that a Protestant here cannot accept how Dr. Hahn, a die hard Protestant himself became a Catholic? He is hardly “clueless” as you put it. A triple major in Theology, a Masters in Divinity and a PH.D in Scripture and Bibliology is hardly “clueless”. Could it rather be something you are missing?

 

[SemperReformada]

Did Scott Hahn leave anything out in his book regarding his conversion story? I don’t know, but I rather doubt it. It’s been a while since I read it. However, the story of his conversion on CD is as complete as it gets. He pulls no punches when it comes to describing how anti-Catholic he was, and then ever so gradually was lead, through research in an attempt to disprove Catholic tenets, to ultimately accept the canons and dogma as true. Next, as far as Scott Hahn being “clueless” on matters of sola fide and sola scriptura, I would suggest you listen to Dr. Hahn’s series entitled “The Bible Alone?” This eight set cassette series directly answers those questions in detail. (I don’t know if it is on cd, however.) Let me assure you that he is in no way “clueless.” This man just didn’t accidentally fall into the Catholic Church by some sort of default. His was a studied and most deliberate journey if there ever was one.

I would recomend you actually read what I wrote. I didn’t say Hahn was clueless about sola fide or sola scriptura. I said he was clueless about how to defend them. If I remember correctly someone in one of the classes he was teaching asked him to defend one or the other and he couldn’t do it. That’s pretty strange.

It’s been quite a while since I read the book and I don’t have a copy on hand so I won’t be able to debate the merits of the book in detail since I’m no longer in possesion of the book.